Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
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17-01-2016, 09:44 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 09:23 PM)Banjo Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 09:18 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  The highlighted bit.

As in, how might you test your thoughts are all there is?



For example. The Roman empire never existed regardless of countless evidence. What a complete idiot!
I would never make that statement.
I would make the more honest statement that:
"Within the subset of thoughts; the Roman Empire once existed due to the countless evidence we have found"
"Outside the subset of thoughts I cannot know for absolute certainty that it existed"
At no point will you ever hear me make the claim "The Roman empire never existed regardless of countless evidence".
It would be a dishonest statement.
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17-01-2016, 09:46 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 09:44 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 09:23 PM)Banjo Wrote:  For example. The Roman empire never existed regardless of countless evidence. What a complete idiot!
I would never make that statement.
I would make the more honest statement that:
"Within the subset of thoughts; the Roman Empire once existed due to the countless evidence we have found"
"Outside the subset of thoughts I cannot know for absolute certainty that it existed"
At no point will you ever hear me make the claim "The Roman empire never existed regardless of countless evidence".
It would be a dishonest statement.

But.. neither of those statements seems to make sense..

If all you are are your thoughts. Then how do you even know who/what/where/when a Roman is? How did you gain this thought of 'Roman' ?
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17-01-2016, 09:59 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
Yeah, Livy . Wink

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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17-01-2016, 10:05 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 09:46 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 09:44 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  I would never make that statement.
I would make the more honest statement that:
"Within the subset of thoughts; the Roman Empire once existed due to the countless evidence we have found"
"Outside the subset of thoughts I cannot know for absolute certainty that it existed"
At no point will you ever hear me make the claim "The Roman empire never existed regardless of countless evidence".
It would be a dishonest statement.

But.. neither of those statements seems to make sense..

If all you are are your thoughts. Then how do you even know who/what/where/when a Roman is? How did you gain this thought of 'Roman' ?

He LEARNED it. He acquired that knowledge by means ENTIRELY EXTERNAL to *his* thought.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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17-01-2016, 10:08 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 08:44 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 08:28 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  That's very obvious.


You do seem to have a very serious problem with reading comprehension. I never said you were mentally retarded. You made that up too. (It's called a "lie")
I didn't say you made up your list. I said the things you referenced, you made up and misinterpreted what I said.


Because you are both Presuppositionalists. You believe in your "thoughts" and can provide no argument for that belief.

In as much as it is recognized in science that many delusional psychotics "have thoughts" that are totally removed from, and in no way related to "reality", it appears there must be some sort of "objective" standard against which thought can be judged, and a way to determine of they correlate with reality.

Have fun in your Philosophical fapping adventures. Reality has been show to be counter-intuitive, and quite "illogical", (Uncertainty, Relativity, the math of Dirac's tensors, Quantum Mechanics). Philosophy never discovered anything important about the nature of Reality.
This statement:
" can you also indicate which one of my posts has an inclination to mental retardation"
should have read:
" can you also indicate which one of my posts has an inclination to mental illness"

You never called me a mental retard. I did not lie here, it was only a typo.

Regarding presupposition I am actually anti-presupposition.
One of the main points in the original post is that we should remove all presuppositions until the point in time we first became self aware & then consider what reality is.
Your last 2 paragraphs are seemingly irrelevant other than to attack my character.
Argumentum ad hominem – the evasion of the actual topic by directing an attack at your opponent.

Typing "retard" instead of "illness" is not a *typo*. And THAT was another lie.
And I just happened to notice YOU did not address the POINT.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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17-01-2016, 10:17 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 09:46 PM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 09:44 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  I would never make that statement.
I would make the more honest statement that:
"Within the subset of thoughts; the Roman Empire once existed due to the countless evidence we have found"
"Outside the subset of thoughts I cannot know for absolute certainty that it existed"
At no point will you ever hear me make the claim "The Roman empire never existed regardless of countless evidence".
It would be a dishonest statement.

But.. neither of those statements seems to make sense..

If all you are are your thoughts. Then how do you even know who/what/where/when a Roman is? How did you gain this thought of 'Roman' ?
I never made the statement that all I am are my thoughts.
The statement I am making is the only thing that can be known for absolute certainty is that "thoughts exist".

Can you not differentiate between these statements:
I am certain A does exist
I am uncertain if B does or does not exist

At no point in the above statements do I make the claim I am certain B does not exist.

Yet you somehow manage to see me saying "I am certain B does not exist".
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17-01-2016, 10:20 PM (This post was last modified: 17-01-2016 10:36 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 09:38 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  We cannot test for anything that existed before self awareness with absolute certainty. This is not to say that reality does not exists before self awareness. The probability remains 50/50 that reality exists pre self awareness

All preposterous meaningless unsupported assertions with no evidence.
How EXACTLY did you pull that 50/50 out of your ass ?
What is THAT based on ?
How do you KNOW it's not 45/55 ?

Oh. Your faith in ummm.... whatever. Never mind.
You are so full of shit.

Humans and other mammals which are self-aware have existed for a infinitesimally tiny fraction of the time the universe existed. The probability that the universe which gave rise to present self-aware beings on this planet is more like 1.0. That's 100 % certainty. And we can do countless test to prove it. You may be so ignorant of math and science that you actually think it's 50/50, but that's your problem, Mr. Philosobabble.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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17-01-2016, 10:33 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 10:20 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 09:38 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  We cannot test for anything that existed before self awareness with absolute certainty. This is not to say that reality does not exists before self awareness. The probability remains 50/50 that reality exists pre self awareness

All preposterous meaningless unsupported assertions with no evidence.
How EXACTLY did you pull that 50/50 out of your ass ?
What is THAT based on ?
How do you KNOW it's not 45/55 ?

Oh. Your faith in ummm.... whatever. Never mind.
You are so full of shit.
This is basic maths Bucky.
If you are given only 2 possibilities and no other data the chances of either of them happening is 50/50.
In the above scenario we have 2 possibilities:
1. Reality exists pre self awareness
2. Reality does not exist pre self awareness
We have no way of testing either possibilities.
Therefore the possibility of either one being true is 50/50
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17-01-2016, 10:36 PM (This post was last modified: 17-01-2016 11:02 PM by DLJ.)
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 10:20 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 09:38 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  We cannot test for anything that existed before self awareness with absolute certainty. This is not to say that reality does not exists before self awareness. The probability remains 50/50 that reality exists pre self awareness

All preposterous meaningless unsupported assertions with no evidence.
How EXACTLY did you pull that 50/50 out of your ass ?
What is THAT based on ?
How do you KNOW it's not 45/55 ?

Oh. Your faith in ummm.... whatever. Never mind.
You are so full of shit.

Edit tool not working.
EDIT BY DLJ: FIXT
"we are here to serve"


Nary a truer word has been spoken.
Nary a truer word was spoken.

As for Rome, Diocletian's palace , pantheon, coliseum, baths of Caraccala etc etc.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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17-01-2016, 10:42 PM
RE: Does my reality exists regardless of how I perceive it?
(17-01-2016 10:33 PM)Agnostic Shane Wrote:  
(17-01-2016 10:20 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  All preposterous meaningless unsupported assertions with no evidence.
How EXACTLY did you pull that 50/50 out of your ass ?
What is THAT based on ?
How do you KNOW it's not 45/55 ?

Oh. Your faith in ummm.... whatever. Never mind.
You are so full of shit.
This is basic maths Bucky.
If you are given only 2 possibilities and no other data the chances of either of them happening is 50/50.
In the above scenario we have 2 possibilities:
1. Reality exists pre self awareness
2. Reality does not exist pre self awareness
We have no way of testing either possibilities.
Therefore the possibility of either one being true is 50/50

100 % false. (BTW your English is VERY poor. Why is that ? How old are you ?)
The fact is we (well, at least reasonable, educated people), have MOUNTAINS of possible data to look at. You may not be aware of them, but that's your (delusional, uneducated) problem. If there is no data, then you can NOTHING about the probability for either possibility. It's not 50/50. Try a math course also.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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