Does the bible being unchanged= divine inspiration?

[Fireball]

A red letter day in the life of the Fireball! I had to look up two words. "ourania" and "Contrafibularities". The first is a variant spelling of Urania, which I knew of in this spelling, but the latter is just a made-up word in Brit-lands. FWIW, I never heard of "Blackadder" before, either.

[Brian37]

(04-09-2016 03:18 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  Richard Carrier is a serious historian and he does not think jesus was anything more than a mythical creation of primitive minds.

So the premise is wrong from the start.

Yes, that is where honest historians are, not to be mistaken with sales pitchmen theologians who are bias apologists.

But legends and myths start with deluded people who don't understand what they saw, or are deluded and lying to get attention.

[Brian37]

(04-09-2016 05:07 PM)Banjo Wrote:  

(04-09-2016 04:29 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  The Bible claims inspiration not inerrancy.

Scripture has been changed many times. The NIV leaves out massive chunks of the NT due to those verses not being in older manuscripts.

The last line in the "Lord's Prayer" was added later, and is not in older translations like the KJV or the DRA.

This doesn't affect inspiration.

I've studied it. If it is inspired by an all powerful being, why does it contradict itself constantly, go off on random tangents, not follow any kind of literary form, has two sets of 10 commandments, condemns its own orders them gives those orders etc etc etc.

Worst. Book. I. Ever. Read.

Why is god such a shitty inspiration??? Zeus was better.

Because there is no all powerful sky wizard and humans wrote it because they were either deluded or flat out lying.

[Minimalist]

That's one way....not the only way.

Unless you think that Mayans actually saw a feathered serpent?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quetzalcoatl

Quote:In the Postclassic period (900–1519 AD), the worship of the feathered serpent deity was based in the primary Mexican religious center of Cholula. It is in this period that the deity is known to have been named "Quetzalcoatl" by his Nahua followers. In the Maya area he was approximately equivalent to Kukulkan and Gukumatz, names that also roughly translate as "feathered serpent" in different Mayan languages.

Quetzalcoatl, the Aztec god of wind and learning, wears around his neck the "wind breastplate" ehecailacocozcatl, "the spirally voluted wind jewel" made of a conch shell. This talisman was a conch shell cut at the cross-section and was likely worn as a necklace by religious rulers as they have been discovered in burials in archaeological sites throughout Mesoamerica and potentially symbolized patterns witnessed in hurricanes, dust devils, seashells, and whirlpools which were elemental forces that had meaning in the Aztec mythology. In codex drawings showing Quetzalcoatl and Xolotl, both are pictured wearing an ehecailacozcatl around each of their necks.[5] There has also been at least one major cache of offerings with knives and idols adorned with the symbols of more than one god, some of which were adorned with wind jewels.

Sometimes people just make shit up.

[Banjo]

From Banjo, HISTORY BUFF!!!!!!!!

Little known fact about the Council of Nicea.

On the first day there was a great feast. The more important priests had the roast pig stuffed with fish and dates.

The lesser priests from Africa had fried door mice in garlic.

The quality of the wine went directly with the food. Falernian for the upper class, vinegar for the Africans etc.

By the time the meal was finished, Scholasticus reports that a Byzantine priest began making fun of the Africans. He claimed they were stupid because their skin was dark. That their opinions were the opinions of the very door mice they have nibbled upon.

Taken aback by this insult, one of the black priests turned over the table killing a slave who was cleaning up the piss from under the table. (Pissing on the floor at a feast being the Roman way.)

Sadly the slave was African, which made the German priests laugh all the more.

"You see what you have done? You killed the piss boy!"

This is why the Arian race is superior. Our opinions matter most.

Constantine walked in at this time and the Germans began going on about blacks and Jews. Constantine was unhappy with the drunken Germans.

And so the Arian controversy began.

Many years later Adolf Hitler, while hoola hooping, said how angry he was with Constantine. That he could make the empire he created last longer than the one in Constantinople.

This is how WWII began.

[Chas]

(04-09-2016 06:26 PM)Banjo Wrote:  From Banjo, HISTORY BUFF!!!!!!!!

Little known fact about the Council of Nicea.

On the first day there was a great feast. The more important priests had the roast pig stuffed with fish and dates.

The lesser priests from Africa had fried door mice in garlic.

The quality of the wine went directly with the food. Falernian for the upper class, vinegar for the Africans etc.

By the time the meal was finished, Scholasticus reports that a Byzantine priest began making fun of the Africans. He claimed they were stupid because their skin was dark. That their opinions were the opinions of the very door mice they have nibbled upon.

Taken aback by this insult, one of the black priests turned over the table killing a slave who was cleaning up the piss from under the table. (Pissing on the floor at a feast being the Roman way.)

Sadly the slave was African, which made the German priests laugh all the more.

"You see what you have done? You killed the piss boy!"

This is why the Arian race is superior. Our opinions matter most.

Constantine walked in at this time and the Germans began going on about blacks and Jews. Constantine was unhappy with the drunken Germans.

And so the Arian controversy began.

Many years later Adolf Hitler, while hoola hooping, said how angry he was with Constantine. That he could make the empire he created last longer than the one in Constantinople.

This is how WWII began.

Sounds legit.

[Fireball]

(04-09-2016 08:15 PM)Chas Wrote:  

(04-09-2016 06:26 PM)Banjo Wrote:  From Banjo, HISTORY BUFF!!!!!!!!

Little known fact about the Council of Nicea.

On the first day there was a great feast. The more important priests had the roast pig stuffed with fish and dates.

The lesser priests from Africa had fried door mice in garlic.

The quality of the wine went directly with the food. Falernian for the upper class, vinegar for the Africans etc.

By the time the meal was finished, Scholasticus reports that a Byzantine priest began making fun of the Africans. He claimed they were stupid because their skin was dark. That their opinions were the opinions of the very door mice they have nibbled upon.

Taken aback by this insult, one of the black priests turned over the table killing a slave who was cleaning up the piss from under the table. (Pissing on the floor at a feast being the Roman way.)

Sadly the slave was African, which made the German priests laugh all the more.

"You see what you have done? You killed the piss boy!"

This is why the Arian race is superior. Our opinions matter most.

Constantine walked in at this time and the Germans began going on about blacks and Jews. Constantine was unhappy with the drunken Germans.

And so the Arian controversy began.

Many years later Adolf Hitler, while hoola hooping, said how angry he was with Constantine. That he could make the empire he created last longer than the one in Constantinople.

This is how WWII began.

Sounds legit.

He's stoned on meds. I'm cutting him a little slack. His post makes more sense than theBorg, Pops or Tomasia, at least.

[Gloucester]

(04-09-2016 03:18 PM)Minimalist Wrote:  Richard Carrier is a serious historian and he does not think jesus was anything more than a mythical creation of primitive minds.

So the premise is wrong from the start.

You sure he used the term, "primitive minds"?

Doubt that he did if he is a credible historian. Human intelligence has not changed significantly for maybe 100ky, if what I have read is correct. What has changed is our knowledge, and therefore understanding, and, perhaps more importantly in this instance, our politics. Religion is a form of politics in many ways, less so now for Christianity than Islam and Judaism perhaps. Christianity is fast losing its iron grip on the Western nations at least. As much due to its own actions and inactions as anything else perhaps.

So, blame ignorance for the origin and that and politics for success of the bible, not primitive minds. It took smart, inventive (if ignorant) people to make those stories up and make them stick!

I use "ignorant" in the sense of "not knowing". I am constantly reminded of my own ignorance.

[Minimalist]

Quote:You sure he used the term, "primitive minds"?

No. I said "primitive minds."

I'm trying to keep the discussion above the level of calling theists "fucktards."

[Deesse23]

(04-09-2016 06:26 PM)Banjo Wrote:  From Banjo, HISTORY BUFF!!!!!!!!

Little known fact about the Council of Nicea.

On the first day there was a great feast. The more important priests had the roast pig stuffed with fish and dates.

The lesser priests from Africa had fried door mice in garlic.

The quality of the wine went directly with the food. Falernian for the upper class, vinegar for the Africans etc.

By the time the meal was finished, Scholasticus reports that a Byzantine priest began making fun of the Africans. He claimed they were stupid because their skin was dark. That their opinions were the opinions of the very door mice they have nibbled upon.

Taken aback by this insult, one of the black priests turned over the table killing a slave who was cleaning up the piss from under the table. (Pissing on the floor at a feast being the Roman way.)

Sadly the slave was African, which made the German priests laugh all the more.

"You see what you have done? You killed the piss boy!"

This is why the Arian race is superior. Our opinions matter most.

Constantine walked in at this time and the Germans began going on about blacks and Jews. Constantine was unhappy with the drunken Germans.

And so the Arian controversy began.

Many years later Adolf Hitler, while hoola hooping, said how angry he was with Constantine. That he could make the empire he created last longer than the one in Constantinople.

This is how WWII began.

*shhhhhht* Kerim may still be around