Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
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29-09-2015, 10:44 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(29-09-2015 10:14 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  Also, just wanted to add: a fall from two meters can indeed hurt or in certain instances kill you.
True...

Inversely -- I have a friend who fell off a scaffolding while painting -- and fell 60 feet -- and landed on his back - on concrete.

He was in a coma for two months, broke a shitload of bones (including his back) - but he survived.....

He said he was as surprised as anyone to find out he was still alive...

.......................................

The difference between prayer and masturbation - is when a guy is through masturbating - he has something to show for his efforts.
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29-09-2015, 10:49 AM (This post was last modified: 29-09-2015 10:57 AM by Deltabravo.)
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
Hi...

Last week a group of Islamic men opened fire with semi automatic weapons in the town I live in. They fired at a building my next door neighbour works in. They are said to be ISIS.

So, I have a very rational fear of being shot since I am a westerner in a Muslim community within a few hundred miles of Damascus.

I think Islamophobia is actually a good description of the fear I have developed. I think about doing something about this situation and it just leaves me feeling paralyzed. What does it matter anymore whether it is the correct word?

When I was in grade 9 my social studies teacher told us about Jihad and said that it was nothing to worry about because Muslims just rode camels and waved swords about and no one got killed. That was in the late 1960s and may have been true then. It isn't now.

In the interim, Western liberal democracy has allowed Islam to have an equal ranking with other religions, because we in the West value free speech and equality. But this is insane. In the West, we have a history of fighting against religious intolerance to get to where we are. When we finally achieve a situation in relation to Christianity, where we can speak freely, believe what we want without fear of being burned at the stake and all manner of other consequence, we think we can now throw the door open to religions which are even worse than Christianity ever was in terms of repression of dissent, ill treatment of minorities, women. Christianity has as its central concept, "do unto others as you would have them do unto you". At least there is something to work with when dealing with those who wage war in the name of Christianity.

But, how do you talk to Islam? The mass of Muslims aren't allowed to read the Koran in their own language and even if they did, it is largely incomprehensible. And if they could make sense of it, it doesn't preach peace! Muslim fundamentalists don't knock on your door and tell you to let the love of Jesus into your heart as Christian fundamentalists do. They slaughter goats, fast, shout from towers five times a day, believe they will be rewarded in heaven with 72 virgins, engage in bigamy, believe in beheading blasphemers and unbelievers, throw homosexuals off 10 story office buildings.

Is fearing a religion which, in extremis, behaves like a psychopathic murderer a "phobia"? It hardly matters anymore. Yes, it is a phobia because I now fear that having written this I am making myself a target, that someone is out there trolling this site and will find me. So, I don't say where exactly I live, and never have.
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29-09-2015, 11:02 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(29-09-2015 10:49 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Is fearing a religion which, in extremis, behaves like a psychopathic murderer a "phobia"?

So...

all of them?

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29-09-2015, 11:03 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(29-09-2015 10:49 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Hi...

Last week a group of Islamic men opened fire with semi automatic weapons in the town I live in. They fired at a building my next door neighbour works in. They are said to be ISIS.

So, I have a very rational fear of being shot since I am a westerner in a Muslim community within a few hundred miles of Damascus.

I think Islamophobia is actually a good description of the fear I have developed. I think about doing something about this situation and it just leaves me feeling paralyzed. What does it matter anymore whether it is the correct word?

When I was in grade 9 my social studies teacher told us about Jihad and said that it was nothing to worry about because Muslims just rode camels and waved swords about and no one got killed. That was in the late 1960s and may have been true then. It isn't now.

In the interim, Western liberal democracy has allowed Islam to have an equal ranking with other religions, because we in the West value free speech and equality. But this is insane. In the West, we have a history of fighting against religious intolerance to get to where we are. When we finally achieve a situation in relation to Christianity, where we can speak freely, believe what we want without fear of being burned at the stake and all manner of other consequence, we think we can now throw the door open to religions which are even worse than Christianity ever was in terms of repression of dissent, ill treatment of minorities, women. Christianity has as its central concept, "do unto others as you would have them do unto you". At least there is something to work with when dealing with those who wage war in the name of Christianity.

But, how do you talk to Islam? The mass of Muslims aren't allowed to read the Koran in their own language and even if they did, it is largely incomprehensible. And if they could make sense of it, it doesn't preach peace! Muslim fundamentalists don't knock on your door and tell you to let the love of Jesus into your heart as Christian fundamentalists do. They slaughter goats, fast, shout from towers five times a day, believe they will be rewarded in heaven with 72 virgins, engage in bigamy, believe in beheading blasphemers and unbelievers, throw homosexuals off 10 story office buildings.

Is fearing a religion which, in extremis, behaves like a psychopathic murderer a "phobia"? It hardly matters anymore. Yes, it is a phobia because I now fear that having written this I am making myself a target, that someone is out there trolling this site and will find me. So, I don't say where exactly I live, and never have.

You are indeed in an extreme situation - are you trying to leave?

[Image: dobie.png]Science is the process we've designed to be responsible for generating our best guess as to what the fuck is going on. Girly Man
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29-09-2015, 11:07 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(29-09-2015 10:49 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Hi...

Last week a group of Islamic men opened fire with semi automatic weapons in the town I live in. They fired at a building my next door neighbour works in. They are said to be ISIS.

So, I have a very rational fear of being shot since I am a westerner in a Muslim community within a few hundred miles of Damascus.

What changed your mind?

(23-06-2014 01:57 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  I live in a Muslim republic and the people are more polite, less ideological and more open minded than your average American who wants to shove his religion or superiority down the throats of all the rest of us.

I feel much safer here than I ever did driving through American cities even though there are armed soldiers with automatic rifles walking around.

It's another myth. You are much more likely to get shot in the US just for minding your own business and getting lost in the wrong neighbourhood in many American cities than you are of getting killed even living in the middle of a big city in a place like Syria.

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29-09-2015, 11:16 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
No, I just bought a house.

The people are very nice in many ways. It is a real culture shock. Until you have lived in a Muslim society you can't really understand what it is about. It's an all pervasive religion, like a cult but even more all embracing. You simply cannot have a discussion with a Muslim about religion qua religion because there is nothing outside Islam. Islam is religion, Islam is everything, nothing exists outside of it. Until you get that into your mind, you don't understand Islam. When you do get it into your mind...well...

I knew a western woman who left town a year ago to move with her family to Bahrain and I asked how she would deal with the restrictiveness of it. She answered that she was a Muslim and that she was happy to wear a veil and abide by religious rules which meant she could not even go to a play park with her kids and sit on a swing. She said that once one accepted these limitation, life as a woman in an Islamic world was "ok". The mind boggles.
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29-09-2015, 11:16 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(28-09-2015 03:55 PM)The Germans are coming Wrote:  The Greek word for "hatred of" is "-misia"* so the correct term to describe a biggot who hates or inflicts harm on muslims for racist and theocratic reasons would be better served to be "Islammisia" than the nonsence word "Islamophobia".

First time I hear of the ending "-misia". It doesn't exist in Greek. What English does to languages Facepalm

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29-09-2015, 11:28 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(29-09-2015 11:07 AM)cjlr Wrote:  
(29-09-2015 10:49 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Hi...

Last week a group of Islamic men opened fire with semi automatic weapons in the town I live in. They fired at a building my next door neighbour works in. They are said to be ISIS.

So, I have a very rational fear of being shot since I am a westerner in a Muslim community within a few hundred miles of Damascus.

What changed your mind?

(23-06-2014 01:57 PM)Deltabravo Wrote:  I live in a Muslim republic and the people are more polite, less ideological and more open minded than your average American who wants to shove his religion or superiority down the throats of all the rest of us.

I feel much safer here than I ever did driving through American cities even though there are armed soldiers with automatic rifles walking around.

It's another myth. You are much more likely to get shot in the US just for minding your own business and getting lost in the wrong neighbourhood in many American cities than you are of getting killed even living in the middle of a big city in a place like Syria.

It is still much more dangerous living in an American city in terms of just getting shot by someone either at random or by virtue of a family member using a gun, not that this would apply to me.

There are few murders here at all. There is an underworld related to gambling, drugs, prostitution etc. But, life here is peaceful. I was told a year ago that there was an ISIS safehouse here and now this seems to support that.

I think, also, one has to live here and get to know how people think. I assumed that because people behaved in what appeared to be much like people do in other countries that they have the same values. That has proved not to be the case. If you mention something which is a bit controversial, for instance, which might lead someone to think that you were encouraging them to speak freely about an issue where there is a risk of repercussion, they go quiet and look away. After a while you realize that things are not the same. There is no religious debate, not because people here are open minded and sensible. They don't debate because the religion is absolute and all pervading. They have no means of knowing what is outside of Islam because they don't even know that there is an outside. They don't even know what Islam is or that it can even be looked at as a subject of analysis. Islam is all. Allah is all. There is nothing else. Some more westernized Muslim countries tolerae outsiders on some sort of reading of the Koran or for historical and cultural reasons, but as a non-Muslim, you are simply a tolerated outsider and there is no real dialogue or even any means of having a dialogue.
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29-09-2015, 11:38 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(29-09-2015 11:16 AM)undergroundp Wrote:  
(28-09-2015 03:55 PM)The Germans are coming Wrote:  The Greek word for "hatred of" is "-misia"* so the correct term to describe a biggot who hates or inflicts harm on muslims for racist and theocratic reasons would be better served to be "Islammisia" than the nonsence word "Islamophobia".

First time I hear of the ending "-misia". It doesn't exist in Greek. What English does to languages Facepalm

It doesn't exist in English either. We do at least use mis[o]-* as a prefix.
(cf perhaps the most well-known such constructs, misogyny or misanthropy, although I've seen things like misotheism as well)

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29-09-2015, 11:40 AM
RE: Does the word "Islamophobia" make any sence?
(29-09-2015 11:28 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  It is still much more dangerous living in an American city in terms of just getting shot by someone either at random or by virtue of a family member using a gun, not that this would apply to me.

Not that that's true, given the actual statistics. But do go on.

(29-09-2015 11:28 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  There are few murders here at all. There is an underworld related to gambling, drugs, prostitution etc. But, life here is peaceful. I was told a year ago that there was an ISIS safehouse here and now this seems to support that.

...

(29-09-2015 10:49 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  Last week a group of Islamic men opened fire with semi automatic weapons in the town I live in. They fired at a building my next door neighbour works in. They are said to be ISIS.

So, I have a very rational fear of being shot since I am a westerner in a Muslim community within a few hundred miles of Damascus.

Sure sounds peaceful.

(29-09-2015 11:28 AM)Deltabravo Wrote:  I think, also, one has to live here and get to know how people think. I assumed that because people behaved in what appeared to be much like people do in other countries that they have the same values. That has proved not to be the case. If you mention something which is a bit controversial, for instance, which might lead someone to think that you were encouraging them to speak freely about an issue where there is a risk of repercussion, they go quiet and look away. After a while you realize that things are not the same. There is no religious debate, not because people here are open minded and sensible. They don't debate because the religion is absolute and all pervading. They have no means of knowing what is outside of Islam because they don't even know that there is an outside. They don't even know what Islam is or that it can even be looked at as a subject of analysis. Islam is all. Allah is all. There is nothing else. Some more westernized Muslim countries tolerae outsiders on some sort of reading of the Koran or for historical and cultural reasons, but as a non-Muslim, you are simply a tolerated outsider and there is no real dialogue or even any means of having a dialogue.

A community living in fear of expression, with social conformity enforced by violence. Some peace.

If there is no freedom of expression, you don't know what people actually believe.

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