Drich, Answers to my questions
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12-03-2014, 07:25 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
(11-03-2014 04:42 PM)Mathilda Wrote:  I am really trying to establish a time-line here based on the information you give me but it is inconsistent.

Can you provide me with a time-line, similar to post 97 but without the nebulous waffle, specifying when you were a christian or otherwise, when you a/s/k'ed, when you experienced his nano-second of love and at each point whether or not you had a choice as to whether to become a christian?

I shall provide a template if this is too difficult for you.
  • You weren't a christian and you had / hadn't a choice to serve God
  • You a/s/k'ed and you had / hadn't a choice to serve God
  • You experienced a nano-second of his love and you had / hadn't a choice to serve God
  • You became a christian and you have / haven't a choice to serve God

If you need a time line to resolve this issue your going about it the wrong way. Your trying to comprehend a general logical concept, through a chonological sequence of events in a specific person.

If you want a time line allow me to place the logical progression of the concept your struggling with in time line form.

God puts us here in this world in this realm Apart from His Glory so that we may be given the oppertunity to logically work out or come to belief in Him under our own steam.

If One wants to know or Have proof of God, there is only one perscribed way, that is through the Holy Spirit.

We obtain the Holy Spirit by A/S/King.

The Holy Spirit usally gives us small doses or relevations, and if we are faithful to them then we are given more till God's glory is completely known to us.

One we know of God's Glory then all intelectual chosing (whether to believe in God or not)is no longer an option. Why? Because we will know God to be real, knowing God is real means one does not have an option to believe that He is real. Once this realization takes hold, the true nature of our hearts takes over. If it is inclined to follow God then it will want to follow God beyond all reason. If not then the oppsite will occour. It will hate God beyond all reason.

That is why Christ seperated us into two camps. Wheat and weeds.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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12-03-2014, 07:31 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
Are you not able to put it into a time line in the format that I asked for?
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13-03-2014, 09:39 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
(12-03-2014 07:31 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Are you not able to put it into a time line in the format that I asked for?

I do not see the point as it does not answer the question your asking. If your asking a question about God and the nature of his Glory and how it effects our abilty to choose you have all the information you need.

The question you ask has already been answered once, (one page ago) I do not understand why you need me to answer this a second time.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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13-03-2014, 10:04 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
You did not provide all the information I was asking for. So taking the following time line from post 97

(09-03-2014 10:27 AM)Drich Wrote:  1) I was not a Christian
2) I a/s/k'ed through the beatings, torment, and challenges I made to the Christians I knew. As this was all I knew to do.
3) I experienced what God's glory/love means to us just for an nano second before I was expelled from His presents.
4) I accepted my fate as just and righteous.
5) I was given a second chance, and chose God because of the Glory I experienced.

... and removing all the evasive fluff:

1) You were not a christian
2) You a/s/k'ed.
3) You experienced a nano second of his love.
4) You chose to serve God.

I have the following questions:

1) Before a/s/k'ing, did you have a choice about serving God?
2) After a/s/k'ing but before experiencing a nano-second of his love, did you have a choice about serving God?
3) After experiencing a nano-second of his love did you have a choice about serving God?
4) You chose to serve God. Did you then lose your choice in serving him?
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14-03-2014, 06:02 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
(13-03-2014 10:04 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  I have the following questions:

1) Before a/s/k'ing, did you have a choice about serving God?
2) After a/s/k'ing but before experiencing a nano-second of his love, did you have a choice about serving God?
3) After experiencing a nano-second of his love did you have a choice about serving God?
4) You chose to serve God. Did you then lose your choice in serving him?
The Choice i am speaking of is not about serving God. It is about belief in God, and comming to the point where one can choose to serve or walk away, under his own steam. I have underscored this point at least 1/2 a dozen times now.

Your heart determines whether or not you serve God, there is little choice in that. Before the knoweledge of God's glory we have the ability to muddle ourway to an intelectual selection. (One collects and gathers evidences for or against belief in God) Once God's Glory is known the choices we thought we had is gone, because God is no longer a variable, but a known fact. What is written on our heart comes to the surface. For some it is service for others it is hate.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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14-03-2014, 07:50 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
(14-03-2014 06:02 AM)Drich Wrote:  The Choice i am speaking of is not about serving God. It is about belief in God, and comming to the point where one can choose to serve or walk away, under his own steam.

That doesn't mean to say that you can't answer my questions about which points you had and did not have a choice to 'serve or walk away'. But if it makes you happier, let's add the choice of belief to the timeline then.

1) Before a/s/k'ing, did you have a choice about believing in God? Did you have a choice between serving God and walking away?

2) After a/s/k'ing but before experiencing a nano-second of his love, did you have a choice about believing in God? Did you have a choice between serving God and walking away?

3) After experiencing a nano-second of his love did you have a choice about believing in God? Did you have a choice between serving God and walking away?

4) You chose to serve God. Did you then lose you choice in believing in him? Did you then lose your choice between serving God and walking away?
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14-03-2014, 09:09 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
Just a reminder this is the boxing ring and it's a one on one debate between Mathilda and Drich only. Thank you.


But as if to knock me down, reality came around
And without so much as a mere touch, cut me into little pieces

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15-03-2014, 09:57 PM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
(14-03-2014 07:50 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  That doesn't mean to say that you can't answer my questions about which points you had and did not have a choice to 'serve or walk away'. But if it makes you happier, let's add the choice of belief to the timeline then.
it does in that you have constructed a strawman. I clearly outline that choice given is about belief in God, you have added the requisite of service to your questions, which has not been introduced as you have framed each question.

That said I will answer your questions just so we can move on.

Quote:1) Before a/s/k'ing, did you have a choice about believing in God?
yes
Quote:Did you have a choice between serving God and walking away?
yes


Quote:2) After a/s/k'ing but before experiencing a nano-second of his love, did you have a choice about believing in God?
yes.

Quote: Did you have a choice between serving God and walking away?
yes.

Quote:3) After experiencing a nano-second of his love did you have a choice about believing in God?
no, of course not.

Quote:Did you have a choice between serving God and walking away?
The options where to stay or walk away. After I knew God to be real my heart wanted what it wanted. Which would have been true even if it went the other way.
If in my heart I hated God for his Love then I would not have a choice but to hate God.

Quote:4) You chose to serve God.
did I or was I called to serve and I simply obeyed the call?

Quote:Did you then lose you choice in believing in him?
can you stop believing in something as absolute as gravity, once you have been made aware of it? If God became an absolute in your life, could you simply pretend to not believe? What if you pretended to stop believing in gravity? Would you then change your life to accommodate your new system of belief? Or would your new belief be in name/claim only?

Quote:Did you then lose your choice between serving God and walking away?
yes I gave up or traded my ability to choose.

It's kinda like getting married to the person of your dreams. If all you ever wanted was 'X' then why and try to retain the option for dating other people?

If we were designed to Love God, and we have been made aware, given assurances and received this love Back in a real way, then why would anyone want to retain the option to go back to the empty/unsured-ness from which we all came?[/quote]

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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16-03-2014, 03:06 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
You ask 'can you stop believing in something as absolute as gravity, once you have been made aware of it?'

Can we only rely upon personal experience in deciding whether to believe something, or can we also make decisions based on knowledge and understanding obtained from other sources?
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16-03-2014, 07:02 AM
RE: Drich, Answers to my questions
(16-03-2014 03:06 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  You ask 'can you stop believing in something as absolute as gravity, once you have been made aware of it?'

Can we only rely upon personal experience in deciding whether to believe something, or can we also make decisions based on knowledge and understanding obtained from other sources?
Why can't it be both? Or do you assume that knowledge of God can only come through personal experience?

My knowledge of God was experienced and verified through an outside source.

The Index: A/S/K Ask Seek Knock as outlined by Luke 11:5-13
Ot Old testament
Nt New testament
H/S Holy Spirit

If you want to ask me a question feel free to Pm me or E/M me. I will not speak of it to anyone.
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