Dumb Atheist Sayings
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14-05-2016, 09:19 PM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 05:26 PM)Aliza Wrote:  I’d be curious to learn if theism (or atheism) has a genetic component.

Only as a by-product or side effect of brain function, likely connected to reasoning ability.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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14-05-2016, 11:55 PM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 05:26 PM)Aliza Wrote:  I’d be curious to learn if theism (or atheism) has a genetic component.

Well, there HAS been some supposition about a "god gene" which makes people more inclined to superstition and religion and faith-based beliefs. ... and ponzi schemes and cons and other schmuck bait. ... if you think there's a difference.

In any case, it's a hypothesis, there's no evidence yet strongly indicating it to be true, but no strong disproof that it's false, and it IS falsifiable which puts it in the realm of scientific inquiry. Far from disproven but mostly in the realm of speculation and "let's see if it's true or not" -- for those interested in it at all -- rather than any strong consensus that it's likely true or likely false.

There was one particular "god gene" identified a decade or so ago that spawned a book or two, but this was premature and fell apart under scientific scrutiny. Its function apparently is not as was advertised.
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15-05-2016, 12:03 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 08:29 PM)Fireball Wrote:  
(14-05-2016 07:20 PM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  That only works if you let them set the rules for the conversation. I believe that the plane will make it to Denver because I have faith in the science that makes it work. If they want to play semantic games I'll have to ask them for their blood type and a number for their next of kin.

It's funny that way. I have "faith" in science and engineering, in that I know how that shit works, and have seen what an airliner goes through before it is certified for flight worthiness. There isn't a whole lot that mother nature can dole out that can bring them down, nowadays- especially since we usually dodge the big shit. I still hate to fly with a passion. I did it for years, and have never been hurt as badly (by other people) as when I was driving a car. I've had some scares on some flights, never have been hurt.

What you two are really discussing is the common equivocation between the different denotations of the word "faith" made by theists -- either a slipshod thought process, or more often, a positively dishonest tactic on their part.
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15-05-2016, 09:05 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 09:15 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(14-05-2016 01:55 PM)jabeady Wrote:  You can't imagine the non-existence of something until you first imagine it's existence. Therefore, atheism came *after* the rise of theism. This seems to imply that belief in god is more "natural" than nonbelief. Before then, the subject does not arise.

It is not about imagining the non-existence of gods, it is simply not having a belief in them. If one has never been introduced to the concept, one can't have the belief.
Atheism is the default.

That doesn't really apply if you lack the capacity for belief.

It's like pointing to a computer and saying, "This button makes it go and this button makes it stop. Stop is the default." Until that computer is plugged in neither button does anything and there is no default.

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15-05-2016, 09:11 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 12:29 PM)Vosur Wrote:  
(14-05-2016 07:27 AM)Paleophyte Wrote:  The correct response is, "OK, thanks." Unless you're really worried about their prayers that is.
That one also sounds a bit rude. I'd personally opt for "Thanks, I appreciate the thought", especially if the person you're talking to knows that you're an atheist.

Depends on context, tone, etc. I had meant a polite "OK that's kind of you, thanks for thinking of me" rather than a snarky "*sigh* OK, thanks for nothing."

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15-05-2016, 09:15 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
My response is "Go ahead if it makes you feel better I don't imagine it will do me any damage."
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15-05-2016, 09:17 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 05:51 PM)SitaSky Wrote:  I don't like when atheists say "I believe in science." It makes it seem like your belief is equal to a spiritual one and instead it's better to say "I trust the validity of the scientific method." or "I trust that the intentions of the scientific community isn't to disprove a God but to simply discover the truth,religion is not interested in the truth." Anything that pits belief vs. belief is bad, it should always be truth vs. belief or facts vs. myths.

I believe in the evidence.

You're right, science isn't something that you should believe in. However there is belief and Belief, much like there is faith and Faith. I love to hate that confationary argument.

I believe in the evidence.
I do not Believe in the evidence.

Any theist who can't tell the difference is the sort that will shortly be equivocating about semantics so don't worry about your wording with them.

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15-05-2016, 09:25 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 06:16 PM)The Organic Chemist Wrote:  For me it is much of what comes out of Silverman.

Having watched the official YouTube playlists for the American Atheist 2014 and 2015 conventions and enjoyed every other speaker to an extent, even as a theist, I have to agree.

Need to think of a witty signature.
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15-05-2016, 09:27 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
(14-05-2016 05:26 PM)Aliza Wrote:  
(14-05-2016 05:03 PM)Paleophyte Wrote:  I agree entirely with you both on that misunderstanding. Atheism is not a religion and that's an important point. So you need to make thatpoint well.

We're all born a squealing pink larva without a thought in our head. The part of us that does the thinking the bit that calls itself "me" isn't there yet. I emerges from the interaction of the devellopping brain with its physical and cultural environment.

If that environment is full of religion then the "me" that does the thinking will be "born" a believer.

Suppose a religious couple gives a child up for adoption who happens to end up in an atheist family. Could the child develop some theistic tendencies independent of their upbringing? Perhaps they’ll turn out like some kind of hybrid.

I’d be curious to learn if theism (or atheism) has a genetic component.

There has been some on and off speculation about genes and brain functions that lead to a propensity for belief but nothing that ever panned out. I suspect that there might be something behind it all but environment seems to be the overwhelming factor in this case.

I think that it's more interesting to examine the thought experiment of two pure cultures. In a culture make purely of nonbelievers, belief is unlikely to arise in an individual. In a culture made purely of believers, nonbelief will likely be rare but will arise if history is any indication.

I suspect that part of that is because looking at a complex belief and rejecting it as flawed is much simpler than building that same complex belief from the ground up. Modern organized monotheism piggy-backs on the less formal polytheistic beliefs that preceded them, which are supported in turn by the rag-tag assortment of tribal cultures and superstitions that preceded them.

Ironically, religions evolve over long timespans but their extinction within an individual is much simpler and swifter.

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15-05-2016, 09:30 AM
RE: Dumb Atheist Sayings
I got a few:

Atheists who believe morality is subjective, and yet make appeals to the Problem of Evil, to suggest a logical contradiction.

Atheists who reject the idea of free will, yet suggest that we can choose to think rationally and logically.

The "I just believe in one less God than you".

The, "Who created God, question?"

"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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