Dyson swarm?
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15-10-2015, 10:00 PM
RE: Dyson swarm?
Oh I wouldn't get my hopes up. That answer will not come in my lifetime but man it would be neat.
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15-10-2015, 10:40 PM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(15-10-2015 10:00 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  Oh I wouldn't get my hopes up. That answer will not come in my lifetime but man it would be neat.

I personally think that life elsewhere is exceedingly rare.....we might be it in the observable universe. But if life is somewhat common, we should discover strong evidence for it in your lifetime(I'm assuming you're pretty, young, and healthy). It won't be too long before we can resolve spectroscopic data from the atmospheres of exo-planets.

Are you going to see ET in your lifetime? Probably not. Are you going to learn about the existence of an exo-planet with an oxygenated atmosphere and green land masses?.....There is a pretty good chance.
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15-10-2015, 11:48 PM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(14-10-2015 10:10 PM)Lightvader Wrote:  I have a question, because I never looked into the SETI . What if they are so advanced, they don't even use technology that emits radio waves we associate with technological activity?

I didn't see anyone else address this, so I will.

It's possible they do use radio waves, but on a broad spectrum in smaller individual frequencies, akin to our phased-array "low-observability" radar systems, like on the F-22. With older radars, they sent out a powerful "beam" of single-frequency radio waves, and picked up the reflection of that beam; now, they send out thousands of lower-power, multi-frequency beams, and then use a computer to reassemble the returns into a composite picture. It's harder to detect and uses much less overall energy. Broadband wireless internet works on a similar principle of multichannel trnasmission-and-assembly. In effect, they would be hard to distinguish from random background noise, even if we did pick up the myriad signals, since we don't know the protocols they're using to encode/transmit and receive/decode.

And that's assuming they even use EM communications. It's entirely possible that even 100-200 years from now we will look back on EM comms the way we look back on lamps blinking Morse code, telegraphs, signal flags, or semaphore poles.

Just look at Star Trek's "subspace" frequencies, which they use for FTL communication. They could be sitting in cloak in orbit right now, using "subspace" (whatever that is) to communicate extra-dimensionally, and we'd never know it.

Edit to Add: It's also plausible that they use technology so much more advanced than ours that it doesn't even occur to them to look for EM comms, anymore, or to use radio telescopes, and so our civilization may be effectively undetectable to them.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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16-10-2015, 12:02 AM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(15-10-2015 09:15 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  If they have birth control, why would they travel outside their solar system?

Um... if it's some form of intelligence, then they are harnessing a literal fek-ton of energy from that star for something.

Stars do not put out the same amount of energy over their life times... eventually (Again, if it's an intelligence harvesting power) they will have ot move on and start work on taking in the power from another star......

(15-10-2015 09:18 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  A couple of planets smacked into each other and kicked up some dust.

That amount of occlusion? That's no planet.. that's a... well we don't know what...

Heck from the article we might be looking at the after effects of two solar systems after suffering a 'glancing' blow. Where one solar system has careened through another. Creating all sorts of stellar havoc.

(15-10-2015 11:57 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  Thought I'd look up some facts about KIC 8462852

The object that's causing the obstruction to the star's light is estimated to be about half of the star's 1.82 million Km diameter. A 900,000 Km wide object!

(15-10-2015 09:55 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  Don't get your hopes up.

We are not going to be able to build telescopes anytime soon that would allow us to resolve structures built around stars by alien life. The only way we will know is if we look for and find radio waves consistent with intelligent life coming from that system.

It is certainly an interesting find even if it turns out to be non-life.

I.. don't think we're ever going to 'Get' radio waves from another intelligence. Unless they broadcast at the level we did back in the 1940's? Then, yeah, they'll move onto using much more energy efficient methods (As RocketSurgeon76 pointed out)

I'll put my money on a 'Star-crash' scenario first and hyper advanced 'somethings' second. Smile

I just thought of something... what if it's 'Something' creating not an energy harvesting operation... but simply making the stellar equivalent of an amusement park? Maybe something out there is making a 'Niven-Pournell' "Smoke Ring" to play in?
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16-10-2015, 12:10 AM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(15-10-2015 11:48 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  And that's assuming they even use EM communications. It's entirely possible that even 100-200 years from now we will look back on EM comms the way we look back on lamps blinking Morse code, telegraphs, signal flags, or semaphore poles.

Just look at Star Trek's "subspace" frequencies, which they use for FTL communication. They could be sitting in cloak in orbit right now, using "subspace" (whatever that is) to communicate extra-dimensionally, and we'd never know it.

Edit to Add: It's also plausible that they use technology so much more advanced than ours that it doesn't even occur to them to look for EM comms, anymore, or to use radio telescopes, and so our civilization may be effectively undetectable to them.

Now your inventing "facts" to explain why we never hear from aliens. I know you're not literally claiming "subspace" to be a fact but what you are doing is the exact same as "God works in mysterious ways"......Except that it is the aliens who are working in mysterious ways.
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16-10-2015, 12:36 AM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(16-10-2015 12:10 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(15-10-2015 11:48 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  And that's assuming they even use EM communications. It's entirely possible that even 100-200 years from now we will look back on EM comms the way we look back on lamps blinking Morse code, telegraphs, signal flags, or semaphore poles.

Just look at Star Trek's "subspace" frequencies, which they use for FTL communication. They could be sitting in cloak in orbit right now, using "subspace" (whatever that is) to communicate extra-dimensionally, and we'd never know it.

Edit to Add: It's also plausible that they use technology so much more advanced than ours that it doesn't even occur to them to look for EM comms, anymore, or to use radio telescopes, and so our civilization may be effectively undetectable to them.

Now your inventing "facts" to explain why we never hear from aliens. I know you're not literally claiming "subspace" to be a fact but what you are doing is the exact same as "God works in mysterious ways"......Except that it is the aliens who are working in mysterious ways.

Well... not quite.

The "Alucebra" (sp?) 'Warp drive' is theoretically possible.

So, if another intelligence has figured it said 'Warp-drive' out... and possibly need the resources of a star to make it work... then having a 'Warp torpedo' that can traverse the stellar distances faster than light is therefore a possible way said intelligence shares communication across interstellar distances.

As opposed to simply 'shining a laser flash-light' from one star system to another.

We'd have no way of knowing if or what such a communication system would be saying. Heck, nor really even detecting such things moving across distant interstellar space.
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16-10-2015, 12:47 AM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(16-10-2015 12:36 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  Well... not quite.

The "Alucebra" (sp?) 'Warp drive' is theoretically possible.

So, if another intelligence has figured it said 'Warp-drive' out... and possibly need the resources of a star to make it work... then having a 'Warp torpedo' that can traverse the stellar distances faster than light is therefore a possible way said intelligence shares communication across interstellar distances.

As opposed to simply 'shining a laser flash-light' from one star system to another.

We'd have no way of knowing if or what such a communication system would be saying. Heck, nor really even detecting such things moving across distant interstellar space.

The drive you talk about is only possible if negative energy is possible. It is not theoretically possible. It is theoretically possible if negative energy is possible. So we are still stuck inventing "facts" even with this warp drive.
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16-10-2015, 12:52 AM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(14-10-2015 08:11 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(14-10-2015 08:09 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  Omfg....here I thought this was about a vacuum cleaner.

Damn my housewife head....damn it to hell.

Big Grin

Not likely to be a familiar term to someone who doesn't read a lot of sci-fi. Wink

Hey I am more likely to be reading Tacitus than Azimov yet I know about Dyson.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
Banjo.
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16-10-2015, 01:14 AM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(16-10-2015 12:10 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(15-10-2015 11:48 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  And that's assuming they even use EM communications. It's entirely possible that even 100-200 years from now we will look back on EM comms the way we look back on lamps blinking Morse code, telegraphs, signal flags, or semaphore poles.

Just look at Star Trek's "subspace" frequencies, which they use for FTL communication. They could be sitting in cloak in orbit right now, using "subspace" (whatever that is) to communicate extra-dimensionally, and we'd never know it.

Edit to Add: It's also plausible that they use technology so much more advanced than ours that it doesn't even occur to them to look for EM comms, anymore, or to use radio telescopes, and so our civilization may be effectively undetectable to them.

Now your inventing "facts" to explain why we never hear from aliens. I know you're not literally claiming "subspace" to be a fact but what you are doing is the exact same as "God works in mysterious ways"......Except that it is the aliens who are working in mysterious ways.

I didn't claim the subspace concept was a fact. I claimed it was a speculation about where our technology might be in 100-200 years, let alone at the technology gap we're speculating about for an alien culture's advantages over our own. This entire thread is speculative. So take the pineapple out of your butt.

Far greater men than me came up with the speculation about the potential technology-gap as the explanation for the silence; notably Asimov and Clarke, and a few other famous scientists/scifi-writers, in well-publicized essays on the subject.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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16-10-2015, 01:17 AM
RE: Dyson swarm?
(16-10-2015 12:02 AM)Peebothuhul Wrote:  
(15-10-2015 09:18 PM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  A couple of planets smacked into each other and kicked up some dust.

That amount of occlusion? That's no planet.. that's a... well we don't know what...




"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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