Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
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29-09-2016, 02:11 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(29-09-2016 01:41 PM)theBorg Wrote:  
(28-09-2016 10:56 PM)Astreja Wrote:  ..... the "holy fire" is merely sleight of hand and perhaps some chemical effects planted by priests.....
Aren't theists simply "dumb"????

Not necessarily dumb.

Credulous? Certainly! 100%

Tomorrow is precious, don't ruin it by fouling up today.
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29-09-2016, 08:35 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(27-09-2016 10:53 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  ..........
The First Way: Argument from Motion
  • Our senses prove that some things are in motion.
  • Things move when potential motion becomes actual motion.
    Only an actual motion can convert a potential motion into an actual motion.
  • Nothing can be at once in both actuality and potentiality in the same respect (i.e., if both actual and potential, it is actual in one respect and potential in another).
  • Therefore nothing can move itself.
  • Therefore each thing in motion is moved by something else.
  • The sequence of motion extends ad infinitum because things change over time, actual motion stops and can increase in potential motion. Motion is performed by energy and energy cannot be created nor destroyed.
  • Therefore there cannot be a first mover, put in motion by no other; and this everyone understands would be God.
  • Therefore God cannot exist.
The nothing has no properties, except one: "nothing does not exist."
Nothing does nothing. Here is more reliable quote of TA:

Quote:1. The first way: motion
a. Things do move (motion is the most obvious form of change).
b. Change is passing from potency to act (that is, from potentiality to actuality).
c. Nothing passes from potency to act except by something that is in act, for it is
impossible for a potentiality to actualize itself.
d. There cannot be an infinite regress of actualizers or movers. If there is no first
mover, there can be no subsequent motion, since all subsequent motion depends on prior movers for its motion.
e. Therefore, there must be a first unmoved mover, a pure act or actualizer with
no potentiality in it which is unactualized.
f. Everyone understands this to be GOD!
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29-09-2016, 08:46 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(29-09-2016 02:11 PM)Gloucester Wrote:  
(29-09-2016 01:41 PM)theBorg Wrote:  Aren't theists simply "dumb"????

Not necessarily dumb.

Credulous? Certainly! 100%
If they produce the Holy Fire by themselves, they are more advanced in a head, than all atheists put together. How come, what they are not simply "dumb" from all these dogmatic praying, rituals???

If they are very credulous, then why they found to be well in this deceitful world? Why are they scientists, business-owners, presidents like -Eastern Orthodox Christian- Vladimir Putin?
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29-09-2016, 09:13 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(29-09-2016 01:41 PM)theBorg Wrote:  
(28-09-2016 10:56 PM)Astreja Wrote:  ..... the "holy fire" is merely sleight of hand and perhaps some chemical effects planted by priests.....
Aren't theists simply "dumb"????

Some of them, like you for example certainly are.



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The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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29-09-2016, 09:53 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
Well, Borg, if you can change Putin's horse to a bear maybe I should do a little bit of Photoshop, too. Which would you prefer: Jesus at at a gay pride parade, or Mary doing a striptease?
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29-09-2016, 10:27 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(29-09-2016 01:41 PM)theBorg Wrote:  
(28-09-2016 10:56 PM)Astreja Wrote:  ..... the "holy fire" is merely sleight of hand and perhaps some chemical effects planted by priests.....
Aren't theists simply "dumb"????
One at least. Drinking Beverage

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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29-09-2016, 10:32 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(29-09-2016 08:35 PM)theBorg Wrote:  Nothing does nothing.
Says who?

When valour preys on reason, it eats the sword it fights with.
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29-09-2016, 10:44 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(29-09-2016 08:46 PM)theBorg Wrote:  If they produce the Holy Fire by themselves....
Explain, in detail, the difference between Holy Fire and regular fire and then demonstrate it.

(29-09-2016 08:46 PM)theBorg Wrote:  they are more advanced in a head, than all atheists put together.
Indeed, because an asshole with a fancy bic lighter is smarter than an astrophysicist or a molecular biologist.Rolleyes
You are more or less the least qualified to determine who is and is not smart being, yourself, a massive idiot.

(29-09-2016 08:46 PM)theBorg Wrote:  If they are very credulous, then why they found to be well in this deceitful world? Why are they scientists, business-owners, presidents like -Eastern Orthodox Christian- Vladimir Putin?
If they are not credulous than why are they found to be poor in this world? Why are so many of them drug addicts, rapists, and criminals? *cough* confirmation bias *cough*
The answer to your question, by the way, is that being credulous in ONE area, doesn't mean you are credulous in EVERY area. The fact a person believes in fucking talking snakes and global floods doesn't mean they can't run a business you silly tit lol.
You know how I keep saying you shouldn't be a part of this conversation because you don't even understand the basics of the topic? Ya.....this is a good example of what I'm talking about.Drinking Beverage

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29-09-2016, 11:57 PM
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
Borgie wrote:

Quote:f. Everyone understands this to be GOD!

Not me mate!

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30-09-2016, 01:23 AM (This post was last modified: 30-09-2016 01:41 AM by Mathilda.)
RE: Even an atheist can say "the laws came from above", isn't it?
(29-09-2016 08:35 PM)theBorg Wrote:  Here is more reliable quote of TA:

Oh right so when you said that Thomas Aquinas proved the existence of your god what you actually meant was not that Thomas Aquinas's own formulations proved it, but someone's translation of what he said into modern English proved it.

That's called shifting the goal posts. Most theists rely on equivocation of words, you rely on equivocation of entire arguments written by other people.

You really just say anything without caring what you actually mean don't you. You put zero effort into actually trying to counter any argument or think things through.

Rather than try to say why my version of Thomas Aquinas is wrong compared to his version, you just point to the same argument made by him but expressed in a different way.

Why should we listen to you if you don't put any thought into what you are saying?

You have zero understanding of what a debate is. And you claim to be a scientist?

In fact I don't have any confidence that you even understand what I am saying to you.

Do you understand what I have written in this post?
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