Evidence Of Absence.
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24-08-2015, 09:05 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 08:52 AM)Free Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 08:37 AM)Chas Wrote:  That's not what I wrote. It is the proof of non-existence that has not been observed.

And you have reason to assume we can somehow observe proof of a non existence?

Firstly, can you provide any evidence whatsoever that any kind of proof pf non existence actually exists?

You really don't understand what I wrote. Facepalm

When someone says "The non-existence of X has not been proved" they are not making a claim about the possibility of the existence of X.

Quote:No, you can't. You have no reason to hold this position. It is fallacious.

I have every reason to hold this position - it is logically sound.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-08-2015, 09:08 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:04 AM)Free Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:00 AM)Chas Wrote:  It may seem trivial, but it seems to be Near's argument that they are equivalent.

I am pointing out that noting that there is no proof of non-existence does not require or imply a claim about possibility.

If the proposed possibility is without evidence, how is it a possibility?

The statement that there is no proof of non-existence of X does not make any claim regarding the possibility of the existence of X.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-08-2015, 09:09 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:05 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 08:52 AM)Free Wrote:  And you have reason to assume we can somehow observe proof of a non existence?

Firstly, can you provide any evidence whatsoever that any kind of proof pf non existence actually exists?

You really don't understand what I wrote. Facepalm

When someone says "The non-existence of X has not been proved" they are not making a claim about the possibility of the existence of X.

You don't understand that X is the possibility.

Quote:
Quote:No, you can't. You have no reason to hold this position. It is fallacious.

I have every reason to hold this position - it is logically sound.

Okay, then prove that any possibility exists.

That's all you need to do.

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24-08-2015, 09:11 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:09 AM)Free Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:05 AM)Chas Wrote:  You really don't understand what I wrote. Facepalm

When someone says "The non-existence of X has not been proved" they are not making a claim about the possibility of the existence of X.

You don't understand that X is the possibility.

Quote:I have every reason to hold this position - it is logically sound.

Okay, then prove that any possibility exists.

That's all you need to do.

He's restating the burden of proof from an alternate perspective.

No evidence of existence, does not suggest the possibility of existence. A possibility of existence can only be met through positive evidence.

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24-08-2015, 09:11 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:08 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:04 AM)Free Wrote:  If the proposed possibility is without evidence, how is it a possibility?

The statement that there is no proof of non-existence of X does not make any claim regarding the possibility of the existence of X.

What I am talking about here is the non existence of a possibility. Make X refer to the possibility.

Now provide evidence to support that any possibility exists.

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24-08-2015, 09:12 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:09 AM)Free Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:05 AM)Chas Wrote:  You really don't understand what I wrote. Facepalm

When someone says "The non-existence of X has not been proved" they are not making a claim about the possibility of the existence of X.

You don't understand that X is the possibility.

Quote:I have every reason to hold this position - it is logically sound.

Okay, then prove that any possibility exists.

That's all you need to do.

For fuck's sake, X is not the fucking possibility. Don't fucking tell me what my statements mean.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-08-2015, 09:15 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:11 AM)Free Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:08 AM)Chas Wrote:  The statement that there is no proof of non-existence of X does not make any claim regarding the possibility of the existence of X.

What I am talking about here is the non existence of a possibility. Make X refer to the possibility.

Now provide evidence to support that any possibility exists.

No. My assertion is about statements about the existence of X.

You seem to have been arguing that the lack of evidence for the existence of X is the same as there being no possibility of X.

I am denying the truth of that.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-08-2015, 09:18 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:11 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:09 AM)Free Wrote:  You don't understand that X is the possibility.


Okay, then prove that any possibility exists.

That's all you need to do.

He's restating the burden of proof from an alternate perspective.

No evidence of existence, does not suggest the possibility of existence. A possibility of existence can only be met through positive evidence.

I know what he is saying. But he remains at 6.9 because, as he's claimed in the past, "you claim no gods exist. You have not proved it." We've had this discussion on another thread right HERE.

He expects a negative to be proven.

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24-08-2015, 09:22 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:18 AM)Free Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:11 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  He's restating the burden of proof from an alternate perspective.

No evidence of existence, does not suggest the possibility of existence. A possibility of existence can only be met through positive evidence.

I know what he is saying. But he remains at 6.9 because, as he's claimed in the past, "you claim no gods exist. You have not proved it." We've had this discussion on another thread right HERE.

He expects a negative to be proven.

No, I don't. I expect you to be honest and agree that such a proof does not exist.

I expect a position of certainty to require proof. No one can be a 7.0 since the proof does not exist.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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24-08-2015, 09:26 AM
RE: Evidence Of Absence.
(24-08-2015 09:22 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(24-08-2015 09:18 AM)Free Wrote:  I know what he is saying. But he remains at 6.9 because, as he's claimed in the past, "you claim no gods exist. You have not proved it." We've had this discussion on another thread right HERE.

He expects a negative to be proven.

No, I don't. I expect you to be honest and agree that such a proof does not exist.

I expect a position of certainty to require proof. No one can be a 7.0 since the proof does not exist.

Who said proof is required to be certain of non existence of something?

Being nice is something stupid people do to hedge their bets
-Rick
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