Evolution with God?
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02-02-2013, 12:22 AM
RE: Evolution with God?
(02-02-2013 12:14 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  He is also world-renowed as an expert in the neurological functioning, and cognitive processes and IQ's of paramecia, as you well know. Now that Egsy is a prelate, (one of us bishops), he does have a little less time for the paramecia research lab, but not to worry, Paramecium Pete began his career in Esgy's lab, and will survive now, on his own reputation. I fully expect a Paramecium Museum to be established as a tourist destination in the near future for the hoards of Veridickians that will soon, (no doubt), be breaking down the doors of Rev Ed's new chuch. You will soon wish YOU had been in on the ground floor of THAT one.
(01-02-2013 06:17 PM)Phaedrus Wrote:  A psychologist is a scientist.
A psychiatrist is a doctor.


Just for the record.

I stand corrected.

2.5 billion seconds total
1.67 billion seconds conscious

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02-02-2013, 01:37 AM
 
RE: Evolution with God?
(01-02-2013 02:27 AM)Rahn127 Wrote:  Thor guides lightning strikes
My magical rock of infinite power creates gravity throughout the universe.

Not the same thing. God is not an imaginary figure plugged into the holes that we can't fill. God, if you understand what God is, is necessary. Thor is not necessary. A magical rock is not necessary. You could replace them with Zeus or a magical bowel of cereal. God, on the other hand, the fundamental monistic consciousness, is absolutely necessary.

(01-02-2013 03:48 AM)Vosur Wrote:  Same for me. I have wasted enough time on Creationists who have never read a book on biological evolution


Have you even been to college? Just a question. Are you from England? Do you at least have some A-level exams under your belt? Do you have anything except your party's line on the origins of life? Just asking. You have wasted enough time on all the people of the world and throughout all of history who have believed in God, not to mention Jesus Christ, himself, and you just know they's all juz ijits--and you're the bright one. So, what are your qualifications. It's the internet--feel free to lie.
Huh

(01-02-2013 09:14 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  The belief that God directed evolution is based on faith... empirical evidence has no bearing on that belief.


KC, you need to look at things more deeply. Empirical evidence is exactly the observations that lead one to conclude there must be an intelligence helping evolution out. You say it's based on faith, but it's not. It's based on reason.

K.C., let me ask you a straight up question, because after all this time I really can't tell: Do you believe God exists?
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02-02-2013, 01:51 AM
 
RE: Evolution with God?
(01-02-2013 09:45 AM)Chas Wrote:  Yes, by altering the theology. The science stands.


Theology changes as we become more enlightened. Do you have a problem with that?

(01-02-2013 01:35 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  You can take it back ever further than that, as evolution is incompatible with a literal interpretation of Genesis. Throw out the literal interpretation and you have no basis for Adam & Eve, no original sin, no need for vicarious redemption, no need for Jesus...


You are an atheist because you want to be able to sin. Great. Thumbsup

(01-02-2013 02:25 PM)Aspchizo Wrote:  You claim to have medical background AND you think things are irreducibly complex? More evidence that doctors and psychologists are in fact not scientists.


If by scientist you mean Richard Dawkins, no they are not.

As for what is a scientist: A scientist is someone who does research in one of the "sciences" using the scientific method. Typically, we think of them as someone with a Ph.D. employed to do that research.
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02-02-2013, 02:13 AM (This post was last modified: 02-02-2013 02:17 AM by Aseptic Skeptic.)
RE: Evolution with God?
(02-02-2013 01:51 AM)Egor Wrote:  You are an atheist because you want to be able to sin. Great. Thumbsup


This old line of crap again?

I thought we've talked about this. I know we've talked about this. So this time I'm going to tell it to you straight since you never listened before.

I don't sin. I don't want to sin. I want to live a good life with positive relationships and interactions with my fellow man. I want people to respect me and like me, not because I need approval or crave attention but because I like my self image as being a good person who inspires such things in the people who know me; it makes me feel good to behave in a fashion that other people like and respect. There is definitely no desire in me to do anything that a sane person would consider even remotely immoral or unethical.

I'm an atheist because I was born an atheist and nobody ever forced me to bend the knee to an imaginary boogeyman. I'm an atheist because I researched a dozen or so of the worlds most prominent religions and found every one of them to be just as mythological as the Greek gods or the Norse gods or any other made up fairy tales about magical men in the sky. I'm an atheist because I have better things to do with my time than waste it on codependent fantasies. And mostly, I'm an atheist because way too many antagonistic Christian nutjobs constantly remind me of how repulsive they can be and as the word implies, I am repulsed away from religion by people like that.

By people like you, Egor.

I'm kind of sorry to say this, Egor, because you've been very temperate on this thread and I appreciate that, but you're still beating your old misguided and very dead horse and you refuse to listen to anyone who tells you anything outside of your own narrow view.

You're wrong, wrong, wrong, but you won't listen to anyone who tells you this. I'm not even saying your theology is wrong - I'll leave that to others. I am saying your belief about atheists is wrong. Your intractable refusal to even consider anything beyond your narrow vision is wrong. Your (usually) abusive attitude toward your fellow man is wrong.

You are simply the worst example for theism of all kinds, and I wish you could get more global exposure than you do. I really wish I could get you more fame. Put you on 60 minutes. Get you an interview with Bill O'Reiley. Get you a spot on David Letterman. I can think of nothing that would drive more people off their fences and into atheism than having them get to know you and others like you.

Am I an atheist because I want to sin?

Nope.

I'm an atheist because I don't want to be associated with people like you.

"Whores perform the same function as priests, but far more thoroughly." - Robert A. Heinlein
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02-02-2013, 03:52 AM
RE: Evolution with God?
(02-02-2013 01:37 AM)Egor Wrote:  
(01-02-2013 09:14 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  The belief that God directed evolution is based on faith... empirical evidence has no bearing on that belief.


KC, you need to look at things more deeply. Empirical evidence is exactly the observations that lead one to conclude there must be an intelligence helping evolution out. You say it's based on faith, but it's not. It's based on reason.


Oh come on!


If an intelligence did guide evolution to make us, it must hate us with the passion of a billion fiery supernovas. But without the elegance of said.

Humans age purely because our bodies are inefficient with repair.

As we age, we loose our eyesight, our teeth fall out, our brains degrade, we get things like Alzheimers, our liver, kidneys, heart, lungs, stomach all slowly begin to stop being able to absorb nutrients, de-tox the body, or cycle blood; we all essentially die of incredibly slow poisoning or starvation. If something like one of the many thousands of cancers which literally everybody on earth has or any number of other diseases which easily overcome our pathetic immune systems, don't get you first. Not to mention just how easy it is to absolutely wreck a persons body, it is so weak!

We exhale most of the oxygen we inhale, so most of it is wasted.

We need to eat constantly, compared to crocodiles which have to eat only a fraction of the time we do. Not to mention their general physical superiority.

We are comatose for essentially 1/3 our lives, perfect opportunity for predators and rivals. But at least we get to hallucinate vividly, so that's a plus.

We see, hear and smell less than most other animals can. We are pretty much blind, even moths see more than we do.

We eat, breath, drink through the same hole in our face; guaranteeing that a decent chunk of our species will die of choking.


IF, we were designed by an intelligent thing it certainly was not on the higher end of the intelligence spectrum of it's kind, unless of course it decided to hate us, before we existed.

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
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02-02-2013, 04:27 AM
 
RE: Evolution with God?
(02-02-2013 02:13 AM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  I don't sin. I don't want to sin.

Yes, you do. And who are you to justify yourself anyway?

Quote:I want to live a good life with positive relationships and interactions with my fellow man.

So what?

Quote: I want people to respect me and like me, not because I need approval or crave attention but because I like my self image as being a good person who inspires such things in the people who know me; it makes me feel good to behave in a fashion that other people like and respect. There is definitely no desire in me to do anything that a sane person would consider even remotely immoral or unethical.

You can fool yourself; you're not fooling me. No

Quote:I'm an atheist because I was born an atheist

No you weren't.

Quote: and nobody ever forced me to bend the knee to an imaginary boogeyman.

Is that what God is to you? Why? If He doesn't exist, why do you have a negative opinion of Him? Why do you even consider him or waste your time debating it. You are so full of it, it's amazing you can keep your mind afloat.

Quote:I'm an atheist because I researched a dozen or so of the worlds most prominent religions and found every one of them to be just as mythological as the Greek gods or the Norse gods or any other made up fairy tales about magical men in the sky. I'm an atheist because I have better things to do with my time than waste it on codependent fantasies. And mostly, I'm an atheist because way too many antagonistic Christian nutjobs constantly remind me of how repulsive they can be and as the word implies, I am repulsed away from religion by people like that.

Finally, after we wade through the dung, we start to get down to the truth.

Quote:By people like you, Egor.

Oh, bite me. You can't wait to pounce on anything I write. You don't see me running to your posts, do you? But here you are ready to smell anything I fart. You can say I "repulse" you but that's not true. Obviously, that's not true.

Quote:I'm kind of sorry to say this, Egor, because you've been very temperate on this thread and I appreciate that, but you're still beating your old misguided and very dead horse and you refuse to listen to anyone who tells you anything outside of your own narrow view.

I listen. What amazes me is how you can delude yourself. You refuse to acknowledge the existence of God because you're too stupid to see anything but the broken and imperfect people--like me--who believe in him. At least have enough decency to admit that's not a good reason to be an atheist. At least be consistent. You said you popped out of the womb an atheist, and then you blame Christians for spoiling your image of God. We are just a convenient excuse. You don't want there to be a God, because then you might not be able to convince yourself of your own perfection--that is compared to His. Isn't that right?

Quote:You're wrong, wrong, wrong, but you won't listen to anyone who tells you this. I'm not even saying your theology is wrong - I'll leave that to others. I am saying your belief about atheists is wrong. Your intractable refusal to even consider anything beyond your narrow vision is wrong. Your (usually) abusive attitude toward your fellow man is wrong.

But Aseptic, if there's no God, how can I be wrong? Consider

Quote:You are simply the worst example for theism of all kinds, and I wish you could get more global exposure than you do. I really wish I could get you more fame. Put you on 60 minutes. Get you an interview with Bill O'Reiley. Get you a spot on David Letterman.

That's coming. Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, maybe not those particular people, but that's coming. Remember I said it.

Quote:I can think of nothing that would drive more people off their fences and into atheism than having them get to know you and others like you.

So what? I preach the Gospel message of Jesus Christ. Everything in the Veridican Articles of Faith is taken from the Gospel message of Jesus Christ. If you don't like what I say, it's because you don't like what Jesus Christ said. And if you don't like Jesus Christ, then you're really in trouble. But you don't get it, do you? You don't know what Christ represents (God, conscious of Himself from within His creation), so you hold onto the hope that if you're wrong and God really does exist that he will respect your atheism--your skepticism. He created you to be His Mirror, and you don't reflect anything, and you think He's going to keep you hanging around anyway. Why would He? Assuming you passed from this life today, you would be a wasted effort of His and nothing more.

Quote:Am I an atheist because I want to sin?

Nope.

Yes, you are guilty of the most common and most heinous sin of all: You reject Christ.

You may think you're holy because you're not out raping children or torturing animals, but you'd be better off to do that and believe in Christ, than to be Mother Teresa and Ghandi all rolled into one and reject him. In rejecting Christ, you choose to be the seed that doesn't sprout, the mirror that doesn't reflect, the human that doesn't transform. You will burn in hell for that.

Quote:I'm an atheist because I don't want to be associated with people like you.


And yet here we are on the dance floor. Drinking Beverage
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02-02-2013, 04:47 AM (This post was last modified: 02-02-2013 05:05 AM by fstratzero.)
RE: Evolution with God?
Egor if you have Verdicanism

Then I have the Cult of Reason


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The atheist is a man who destroys the imaginary things which afflict the human race, and so leads men back to nature, to experience and to reason.
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02-02-2013, 04:49 AM
RE: Evolution with God?
(02-02-2013 04:27 AM)Egor Wrote:  
Quote:I'm an atheist because I don't want to be associated with people like you.


And yet here we are on the dance floor. Drinking Beverage

Wrong again. I don't choose to be associated with you. You come to my forum, and atheist forum, to spew your bullshit. If I wanted to associate with you, I'd go to your forum. I haven't even visited it - I know some members here went to check it out, even if only to see how crazy it is, but not me. No interest, not curiosity where your brand of craziness is concerned. None.

But you come here and vomit out your diatribe. In my home. Maybe there are some people visiting this site, seekers, their minds not made up yet, looking for answers, passing by rather than moving in. Maybe they see your crap and are moved by it, as unlikely as that seems. Maybe they then see my responses and realize that your crap is not so moving after all.

Or maybe not. Actually, probably not. But I reply to you not because of your self-proclaimed magnetism, for you are completely lacking of such a quality, but rather on the off chance that such a seeker is here and my "dancing" with you might keep them from wandering into your insane world.

"Whores perform the same function as priests, but far more thoroughly." - Robert A. Heinlein
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02-02-2013, 06:47 AM
RE: Evolution with God?
(02-02-2013 01:37 AM)Egor Wrote:  Have you even been to college? Just a question. Are you from England? Do you at least have some A-level exams under your belt? Do you have anything except your party's line on the origins of life? Just asking. You have wasted enough time on all the people of the world and throughout all of history who have believed in God, not to mention Jesus Christ, himself, and you just know they's all juz ijits--and you're the bright one. So, what are your qualifications. It's the internet--feel free to lie.
I'm from Germany, actually. I'm not sure what the equivalent of the US American college in Germany is, but I'm going to start studying at a nearby University later this year. I've learned about evolutionary biology in 13th grade and have read two works about it. That education already suffices to determine that you have no clue what you're talking about.

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02-02-2013, 06:52 AM
RE: Evolution with God?
Egor - your god is an imaginary god, like all of the others. There is no difference. They only exist in the mind of those who have that delusion.
It's the same as Odin, the same as Zeus, the same as a 6ft tall pooka rabbit named Harvey.

You can assert all the bullshit fairy tales you want concerning the delusion you have running around in your head.
Doesn't bother me one bit. The truth remains the truth no matter how much you want to paint over it with your imaginary mental paint.

Your belief doesn't alter the laws of physics. Your belief doesn't alter truth.
I know you want it to, but that's just you wanting magic to be real.

Grow up. Santa isn't real. There is no tooth fairy. There are no gods.

All of these were made up fairy tales in order to manipulate children and yet one still manipulates adults.

Very Sad

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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