Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
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03-10-2015, 03:21 PM (This post was last modified: 03-10-2015 03:25 PM by Chas.)
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 03:12 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(03-10-2015 03:04 PM)Chas Wrote:  No, Ben Carson was a medical practitioner, not a scientist.
Not every medical practitioner does what Ben Carson was doing.
Only medical practitioner and scientist can do what Ben Carson did.
So, he is both. Even better.

You are going to have to support your claim that he is a scientist.

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(03-10-2015 03:04 PM)Chas Wrote:  He might be intelligent, but that's not enough.
what is enough?

Knowledge of the world, knowledge of history, sound judgement, courage, commitment, and an understanding of, and respect for, science.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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03-10-2015, 03:40 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 03:04 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(03-10-2015 02:12 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  Yes, you evidently don't know what a Genius is by definition or by able to point one out. Doing great things doesn't make one a Genius. Even the concept of Genius is horribly outdated and flawed itself anyway to even bother labeling someone it. Being a good neurosurgeon or charitable human isn't a reflection on if he'll be a genius.
OK, what is genius?
(03-10-2015 02:12 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  It's philosophy of ethics... and what do you mean correct? There isn't some "correct" answer in philosophy in this manner. Do you understand what is being said?
ethics, ethics. what is wrong with Ben Carson's ethics? could you please give me some examples?
(03-10-2015 02:12 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  He is also evolutionary completely inaccurate to say selfless love of risking life to save a song doesn't make sense without God, except it fits every evolutionary description out there. His understanding of the issue is deplorable so it should be pointed out.
I am not sure I understand. Could you say it differently?
(03-10-2015 02:12 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  Why should you care if you think a politician is "conservative" as you want it to be? What a person believes affects their decisions.
Not all the time. Depends what decisions we are talking about.
(03-10-2015 02:12 PM)ClydeLee Wrote:  Someone who embraces or at least understands how science and scientific theories work would be more beneficial to the progress of millions of American's scientific education than the opposite.
People who achieve what Ben Carson achieved in his life have some understanding of how science and scientific theories work.
What Ben Carson achieved was a scientific progress. Nobody could do what he did. He was the first.
So, how does Obama with his understanding of science help scientific progress?

There are many views & theories on Genius. There are some different types, Pattern genius/verbal genius/knowledge genius, others say they may be 4 types of Genius. In otherways it's just superior intellectual or creative ability that outshines contemporaries of the same tasks.

You've made the assertion he is a genius but not given any direct conclusion to why. It's really up to you if you assert and think something to describe it. If he's a genius at anything, it's a specific Neurology genius... which isn't a task that makes him adequate as a politician. Other than preforming one outstanding surgery, what actually separates him via his actions as something remarkably higher achieving.

You need to also work on your interactive communication skills or comprehension too. What does Obama have to do with anything? You bring him up in ways with no relation to him often here. It's very indicative of some assumptions.

To elaborate on that comprehension, I didn't say anything about Carson's Ethics. You apparently don't understand the topics just as he doesn't. His point is that self sacrifice of one's life to save their son makes no sense within Evolution and without God. He demonstrates he has no understanding of THAT scientific view and theory. It's so horribly off base it's against the strongest points of what keeps evolution going. Survival of ones genes. It's his view that this ethically doesn't make sense, he doesn't actually understand the concepts of ethics/evolution if he believes that.

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03-10-2015, 04:28 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 03:16 PM)Imathinker Wrote:  
(03-10-2015 03:04 PM)Alla Wrote:  So, how does Obama with his understanding of science help scientific progress?
How about climate change? Obama has made more regulations for emissions,
Yes, he made lots of regulations. He makes it harder for businesses in America but it has zero progress in slowing down global warming/climate change.

(03-10-2015 03:16 PM)Imathinker Wrote:  Carson thinks global warming isn't happening.
How do you know that he thinks global warming isn't happening.

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03-10-2015, 04:43 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
On climate change:
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/ben-...10-issues/

Lowering CO2 (among other things) emissions doesn't slow climate change? How bout you put that in a scientific journal and see how it does.

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03-10-2015, 04:52 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 03:21 PM)Chas Wrote:  You are going to have to support your claim that he is a scientist.
Wow!
Dr. Carson is a leading research scientist. A "voracious reader of the medical and scientific literature" from his graduate school days, he has long been very interested in scientific research and has been very active in this area for his entire career,5, 6 with over 120 major scientific publications in peer reviewed journals, 38 books and book chapters, and grant awards of almost a million dollars. His achievements have so far earned him 51 honorary doctorates, including from Yale and Columbia Universities.

Ben Carson revolutionized his field in several areas, including hemispherectomies (removal of half of the brain to prevent untreatable severe seizures, such as those caused by Rasmussen's encephalitis). He dramatically increased the safety of the procedure by developing several major surgical innovations, which include better ways of controlling bleeding and infection, as well as an innovative system of incrementally removing specific brain parts as units rather than in whole sections.3

Dr. Carson has also contributed to new techniques used for conjoined twin separation7 and accomplished one of the most complex surgical feats in history as the lead surgeon of a team that separated twins joined at the back of the head in a 22-hour-long operation. Known as the doctor who takes cases that no other doctor will risk, Dr. Carson has had outstanding success in spite of this challenge. For example, he has achieved an amazing 80 to 90 percent success rate for difficult-to-treat trigeminal neuralgia.8

If this is not a scientist than I don't know who scientist is. Obama?
(03-10-2015 03:21 PM)Chas Wrote:  
Alla Wrote:what is enough?
Knowledge of the world, knowledge of history, sound judgement, courage, commitment, and an understanding of, and respect for, science.
Ben Carson has knowledge of the world. He has knowledge of history, he has sound judgement (not like Obama called ISIS "JV"), he has courage (prayer breakfast - Oh, I loved to see Obama's face), he is not afraid of Liberals.
Commitment, I can say that Carson has it. He understands and respects science that is why he achieved what YOU or OBAMA will NEVER achieve.

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03-10-2015, 04:56 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 04:43 PM)Imathinker Wrote:  On climate change:
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/ben-...10-issues/

Lowering CO2 (among other things) emissions doesn't slow climate change? How bout you put that in a scientific journal and see how it does.

I didn't say that lowering CO2 doesn't slow climate change. I said that what Obama does has zero impact because China and many other countries do not have Obama's regulations.
Obama's attempts only make American people life harder. Thanks, Obama!

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03-10-2015, 04:56 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(14-09-2015 01:49 AM)WalkingSnake Wrote:  You may have seen the Ben Carson meme Christians are going nuts over: [Image: carson.jpg]

Yeah, clever right?

It was posted on fb, and here's the conversation so far. Trying to work on a response that doesn't turn into a book.

Me: Calling out someone's namecalling: very good. Misrepresenting evolution: very bad. I would like to see footage of this debate Carson is talking about. In any case, the "come from monkeys" bit shows ignorance. http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyath...ks-he-won/
Mike E: Taking joke as fact puts the joke in you. Far more scientific facts behind the biblical version than behind the evolution theory.
Me:I love comedy and can't get enough of it. But, call me a killjoy, if the "joke" gets it wrong I just can't. But also I suspect it's only half joke, since I know many creationists think that's exactly what evolution teaches. I haven't heard one creationist correctly represent what evolution is, joking or not.

I'm going to disagree with you on your second sentence there. But not because I'm atheist and think the Bible got it wrong (which is the case), but because the sentence ignores the fact that for many people - including lots (I've heard "most" but don't have proof on me at the moment) of Christians - evolution does not cancel out the Bible. Lots (again carefully avoiding "most") of Christians believe in evolution, and there are even some atheists who don't believe in evolution.
Josh S:Mike E is still correct. In fact, evolution "teaches" nothing. It speculates. It's a theory. An untestable theory. IMO it doesn't even hold up to philosophical scrutiny. Many large issues at play here, not the least of which are Love, Purpose, and Reason.


Ah man, wtf. How many of you are now suffering brain aneurysm?

It should also be noted that that last guy has the laminin picture as his profile pic. Yeah, that bulshit.

Anyway, off to work.

Ben Carson is a joke that isn't funny

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03-10-2015, 05:01 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 04:52 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(03-10-2015 03:21 PM)Chas Wrote:  You are going to have to support your claim that he is a scientist.
Wow!
Dr. Carson is a leading research scientist. A "voracious reader of the medical and scientific literature" from his graduate school days, he has long been very interested in scientific research and has been very active in this area for his entire career,5, 6 with over 120 major scientific publications in peer reviewed journals, 38 books and book chapters, and grant awards of almost a million dollars. His achievements have so far earned him 51 honorary doctorates, including from Yale and Columbia Universities.

Ben Carson revolutionized his field in several areas, including hemispherectomies (removal of half of the brain to prevent untreatable severe seizures, such as those caused by Rasmussen's encephalitis). He dramatically increased the safety of the procedure by developing several major surgical innovations, which include better ways of controlling bleeding and infection, as well as an innovative system of incrementally removing specific brain parts as units rather than in whole sections.3

Dr. Carson has also contributed to new techniques used for conjoined twin separation7 and accomplished one of the most complex surgical feats in history as the lead surgeon of a team that separated twins joined at the back of the head in a 22-hour-long operation. Known as the doctor who takes cases that no other doctor will risk, Dr. Carson has had outstanding success in spite of this challenge. For example, he has achieved an amazing 80 to 90 percent success rate for difficult-to-treat trigeminal neuralgia.8

If this is not a scientist than I don't know who scientist is. Obama?
(03-10-2015 03:21 PM)Chas Wrote:  Knowledge of the world, knowledge of history, sound judgement, courage, commitment, and an understanding of, and respect for, science.
Ben Carson has knowledge of the world. He has knowledge of history, he has sound judgement (not like Obama called ISIS "JV"), he has courage (prayer breakfast - Oh, I loved to see Obama's face), he is not afraid of Liberals.
Commitment, I can say that Carson has it. He understands and respects science that is why he achieved what YOU or OBAMA will NEVER achieve.


You still need to work on communication or reading comprehension. Though I'll say you did show the case that he was a scientist. Not necessarily "great" or "genius" still.

You really should put back your case of I am bad at rational thinking apparently, in your signature because it wholly still applies.

For some reason you love to frequently point out 1 thing as a standard for proof of something. One comment doesn't make him courage or not fear. Nearly every political comment he makes not about something relevant to Christianity, he actually does cower heavily and refuses to take a stand verbally. His debates so far, his time talking from the boarder, his speech at Ferguson, MO, they all go the same way.

Your constant return to referring to Obama in this discussion in entirely irrelevant ways is just irrational leaps that has no connection. It doesn't even deserve any further response for how clearly unconnected it is.

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03-10-2015, 05:06 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 04:56 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(03-10-2015 04:43 PM)Imathinker Wrote:  On climate change:
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/updates/ben-...10-issues/

Lowering CO2 (among other things) emissions doesn't slow climate change? How bout you put that in a scientific journal and see how it does.

I didn't say that lowering CO2 doesn't slow climate change. I said that what Obama does has zero impact because China and many other countries do not have Obama's regulations.
Obama's attempts only make American people life harder. Thanks, Obama!

That just means that other countries aren't doing enough. Lowering emissions IS helpful. Maybe there are better ways to do it that don't hurt our economy, but to elect a pres that doesn't even ADDRESS the issue of climate change is to selfishly ignore the problem.

A man should not believe in an ism, he should believe in himself. -Ferris Bueller

That's what a ship is, you know. It's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs but what a ship is... what the Black Pearl really is... is freedom. -Jack Sparrow
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03-10-2015, 05:11 PM
RE: Facebook debate: Ben Carson Meme
(03-10-2015 04:56 PM)TheBeardedDude Wrote:  Ben Carson is a joke that isn't funny
Who says this? those who have no talent to do at least 1/10 of what he had done?
Laugh out load

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