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Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
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27-09-2016, 03:10 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(27-09-2016 10:36 AM)Aliza Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 10:26 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  Let's be fair.

I think his hypothesis is that there's a genetic component of an "ability" to sense that supernatural things are real (in the case of a theist, a god or gods), which the group he calls "mind-blind" atheists simply don't possess. He readily acknowledges that this is only one group out of four types of atheist, so his idea (as I read it) would be that the others you mentioned do in fact have the "belief gene" but choose to override it for reasons unrelated to their ability to sense it.

As far as I'm concerned, if this hypothesis was proven credible, it would disprove Christianity.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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27-09-2016, 06:16 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
Christian fire chief outside of a burning church with 1000+ people inside.
Fire Chief yells out toward the church, but it's unlikely that anyone inside can hear him.

"If any of you want us to save you, all you have to do is sit down very quietly and meditate while wearing bright blue hats. We're only going to save those who do this. Do you understand ?"

Other fireman
"Sir the building is going up pretty fast. We have to get people inside right now."

Fire Chief
"Ok people. Only rescue those sitting down meditating with bright blue hats on."

Fireman
"Whoever set this fire is one sick individual."

Fire Chief
"It was me. I set it. Now get in there."

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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27-09-2016, 07:01 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(27-09-2016 10:36 AM)Aliza Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 10:26 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  Let's be fair.

I think his hypothesis is that there's a genetic component of an "ability" to sense that supernatural things are real (in the case of a theist, a god or gods), which the group he calls "mind-blind" atheists simply don't possess. He readily acknowledges that this is only one group out of four types of atheist, so his idea (as I read it) would be that the others you mentioned do in fact have the "belief gene" but choose to override it for reasons unrelated to their ability to sense it.

As far as I'm concerned, if this hypothesis was proven credible, it would disprove Christianity. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Christianity hold that you must "believe" to be "saved"?

I'm not sure what Christianity says about freewill, but KC's Christianity aside, if you're genetically incapable of belief, then you were denied salvation from birth. Isn't the point of Christianity that they have to sell it to people to get them to believe? I thought they say that anyone can be saved if they just believe.

I had not considered that angle, but you're right. A genetic inability to believe would definitely conflict with the idea in Christian theology that anyone can be saved, and that salvation is a transformation of any sort of sinner into a "saved" person.

I think the OP kinda hinted at that same nagging worry, though, if there is such a thing as a genetic inability to believe, as he sees it. I just don't think he connected the dots to realize this is evidence against the entire notion of universal salvation. Unless he's a Calvinist--aren't they the ones that think it's predetermined that some people can be saved and others can't?--they'll eat that book up! Heh.

Edit to Add: I don't think it is real, in the sense he's using it... I just don't think he made the connections between his ideas and the potential conflict with one of the dominant theological ideas in Pauline Christianity.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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27-09-2016, 07:39 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(27-09-2016 07:01 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 10:36 AM)Aliza Wrote:  As far as I'm concerned, if this hypothesis was proven credible, it would disprove Christianity. Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't Christianity hold that you must "believe" to be "saved"?

I'm not sure what Christianity says about freewill, but KC's Christianity aside, if you're genetically incapable of belief, then you were denied salvation from birth. Isn't the point of Christianity that they have to sell it to people to get them to believe? I thought they say that anyone can be saved if they just believe.

I had not considered that angle, but you're right. A genetic inability to believe would definitely conflict with the idea in Christian theology that anyone can be saved, and that salvation is a transformation of any sort of sinner into a "saved" person.

I think the OP kinda hinted at that same nagging worry, though, if there is such a thing as a genetic inability to believe, as he sees it. I just don't think he connected the dots to realize this is evidence against the entire notion of universal salvation. Unless he's a Calvinist--aren't they the ones that think it's predetermined that some people can be saved and others can't?--they'll eat that book up! Heh.

Edit to Add: I don't think it is real, in the sense he's using it... I just don't think he made the connections between his ideas and the potential conflict with one of the dominant theological ideas in Pauline Christianity.

The entire notion conflicts with Christian theology. According to Paul, faith is one of the gifts of the spirit. According to Jesus, "No one shall come to me, UNLESS the father draw him".

Rug Rat never read the Bible.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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27-09-2016, 11:02 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(27-09-2016 07:39 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 07:01 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I had not considered that angle, but you're right. A genetic inability to believe would definitely conflict with the idea in Christian theology that anyone can be saved, and that salvation is a transformation of any sort of sinner into a "saved" person.

I think the OP kinda hinted at that same nagging worry, though, if there is such a thing as a genetic inability to believe, as he sees it. I just don't think he connected the dots to realize this is evidence against the entire notion of universal salvation. Unless he's a Calvinist--aren't they the ones that think it's predetermined that some people can be saved and others can't?--they'll eat that book up! Heh.

Edit to Add: I don't think it is real, in the sense he's using it... I just don't think he made the connections between his ideas and the potential conflict with one of the dominant theological ideas in Pauline Christianity.

The entire notion conflicts with Christian theology. According to Paul, faith is one of the gifts of the spirit. According to Jesus, "No one shall come to me, UNLESS the father draw him".

Rug Rat never read the Bible.

He's a Christian for commercial purposes, why would he bother actually reading it?

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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28-09-2016, 12:01 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(27-09-2016 11:02 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 07:39 PM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  The entire notion conflicts with Christian theology. According to Paul, faith is one of the gifts of the spirit. According to Jesus, "No one shall come to me, UNLESS the father draw him".

Rug Rat never read the Bible.

He's a Christian for commercial purposes, why would he bother actually reading it?

Yep ... looks like we got us a money changer, here.

Sweet little baby Jesus won't like that! Angel

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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28-09-2016, 12:19 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(27-09-2016 07:01 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I just don't think he connected the dots to realize this is evidence against the entire notion of universal salvation.

hmmm. Seems to me I could use it to argue in favor of universal reconciliation. Everyone is saved regardless of their ability to believe.

There is only one really serious philosophical question, and that is suicide. -Camus
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28-09-2016, 12:51 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(28-09-2016 12:19 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(27-09-2016 07:01 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I just don't think he connected the dots to realize this is evidence against the entire notion of universal salvation.

hmmm. Seems to me I could use it to argue in favor of universal reconciliation. Everyone is saved regardless of their ability to believe.

Now, now Girly ... don't go all Kingsy on us. Wink

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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28-09-2016, 02:39 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(28-09-2016 12:51 PM)kim Wrote:  
(28-09-2016 12:19 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  hmmm. Seems to me I could use it to argue in favor of universal reconciliation. Everyone is saved regardless of their ability to believe.

Now, now Girly ... don't go all Kingsy on us. Wink

Where is Kingsy anyway? He dun disappeart?

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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28-09-2016, 02:44 PM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(28-09-2016 02:39 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(28-09-2016 12:51 PM)kim Wrote:  Now, now Girly ... don't go all Kingsy on us. Wink

Where is Kingsy anyway? He dun disappeart?

He did have his house destroyed by a flood just a few weeks ago. He might be a little busy dealing with that situation.
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