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Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
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13-09-2016, 02:33 AM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
Quote:Actually quite sad that some obviously intelligent people are so out of touch with reality.

If its true what we/you are guessing - and i have become quite confident about that in the meantime- then its not so much related to being out of touch with reality. Deliberately lying, misquoting, misrepresenting scientific ideas (in this case Darwin, if hes the author of the book in question), quote mining, being evasive, omitting information particularly info that has been asked for, all of this indicates that the person in question knows very well what he is doing.

To me its more about sacrificing personal integrity and humanity on the altar of belief in something you have no good reason to belive in.

Believing in a fairy tale monstrous entity and giving up your humanity for this imaginary entity and then looking down on others who call themselves things like "humanists" (or "atheists"for that matter)....i cant tell how much dripping the irony seems to me when looking at the two words i bolded.

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13-09-2016, 02:38 AM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(13-09-2016 02:33 AM)Deesse23 Wrote:  
Quote:Actually quite sad that some obviously intelligent people are so out of touch with reality.

If its true what we/you are guessing - and i have become quite confident about that in the meantime- then its not so much related to being out of touch with reality. Deliberately lying, misquoting, misrepresenting scientific ideas (in this case Darwin, if hes the author of the book in question), quote mining, being evasive, omitting information particularly info that has been asked for, all of this indicates that the person in question knows very well what he is doing.

To me its more about sacrificing personal integrity and humanity on the altar of belief in something you have no good reason to belive in.

Believing in a fairy tale monstrous entity and giving up your humanity for this imaginary entity and then looking down on others who call themselves things like "humanists" (or "atheists"for that matter)....i cant tell how much dripping the irony seems to me when looking at the two words i bolded.

I accede to your points, Deese, "out of touch" implies a degree of innocence.

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13-09-2016, 02:44 AM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(13-09-2016 02:33 AM)Deesse23 Wrote:  If its true what we/you are guessing - and i have become quite confident about that in the meantime- then its not so much related to being out of touch with reality. Deliberately lying, misquoting, misrepresenting scientific ideas (in this case Darwin, if hes the author of the book in question), quote mining, being evasive, omitting information particularly info that has been asked for, all of this indicates that the person in question knows very well what he is doing.

To me its more about sacrificing personal integrity and humanity on the altar of belief in something you have no good reason to belive in.

Believing in a fairy tale monstrous entity and giving up your humanity for this imaginary entity and then looking down on others who call themselves things like "humanists" (or "atheists"for that matter)....i cant tell how much dripping the irony seems to me when looking at the two words i bolded.

QFT.

Lying for Jesus is still lying.

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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13-09-2016, 03:03 AM (This post was last modified: 13-09-2016 03:07 AM by Gloucester.)
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(13-09-2016 02:44 AM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  
(13-09-2016 02:33 AM)Deesse23 Wrote:  If its true what we/you are guessing - and i have become quite confident about that in the meantime- then its not so much related to being out of touch with reality. Deliberately lying, misquoting, misrepresenting scientific ideas (in this case Darwin, if hes the author of the book in question), quote mining, being evasive, omitting information particularly info that has been asked for, all of this indicates that the person in question knows very well what he is doing.

To me its more about sacrificing personal integrity and humanity on the altar of belief in something you have no good reason to belive in.

Believing in a fairy tale monstrous entity and giving up your humanity for this imaginary entity and then looking down on others who call themselves things like "humanists" (or "atheists"for that matter)....i cant tell how much dripping the irony seems to me when looking at the two words i bolded.

QFT.

Lying for Jesus is still lying.

Ditto for "God" or any other imaginary diety, especially as involved in the creation myth in this context.

[This tablet insists on capitalising "god" unless I take measures to prevent it.]

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13-09-2016, 04:49 AM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(12-09-2016 10:11 PM)Randy Ruggles Wrote:  You said:

"You say "mutation" like it's a bad thing... you call it "corruption"."

If I implied that, I didn't mean it. The mutation itself was "unbiased" so to speak. Its effect, however, was a corruption of a previously working system.

There is your loaded language again.

A mutation may be an improvement.

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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13-09-2016, 05:06 AM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
Actually I think Randy presents a very sophicated argument.

That is "sophisticated" in its original definition: "adulterated, not pure, not genuine, corrupted by something spurious or foreign", Oglivie's "The Comprehinsive English Dictionary" of 1885.

Similar root to "sophistry" - "fallacious reasoning".

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13-09-2016, 05:08 AM
Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(12-09-2016 02:46 PM)Fatbaldhobbit Wrote:  
(12-09-2016 12:23 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  No, there's platonic theism, scholastic theism, aristotelian theism, etc...which aren't schools of philosophy, but rather different understandings of theism. Many of which don't see God seen as a sort "being" in a general sense.

I've done multiple searches and come up with nothing but the most peripheral links. For example, there are articles platonic theories and theism, but the only article on platonic theism is a dissertation by Paul Gould.

So I am forced to conclude that it is yet more meaningless chatter from theists trying to justify their beliefs.

(12-09-2016 12:23 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  None this should come as surprise though, because at some level atheists seem to recognize that God concepts are broad, often seen as ambiguous to the point were some atheists, like our good old Bucky define themselves as Ignostics.

It doesn't surprise me the lengths that people will go to find a god somewhere. I place them in the same group as people who see a light move in the night sky and scream "ufo" or hear a twig break in the forest and yell "bigfoot".


Lol, informing you that there is variety of forms of theism, is not justifying theism, anymore so that you pointing out that their are variety of forms of racist, equates to justifying racism.

None of which I said has anything to do with validity of theism, just in regards to different historical conceptions of God, such as Plutos (platonic theism) Aristotelian theism ( Aristotles conception of God), process theism. Even pantheism, deism, etc. have a variety of expressions.

There are variety of meanings associated with the term God, it why some atheists prefer to label themselves ignostics. If he the concept wasn't so broad, an ambiguous, why do you think ignosticism exists?

But please every form of theism can be silly and false, as belief in fairies, but my point still stands independent of the validity of any form of theism.




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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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13-09-2016, 05:29 AM
Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(12-09-2016 02:17 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(12-09-2016 12:33 PM)Tomasia Wrote:  I do, and I told you the evidence often used in support of the existence agency detection, has nothing to do with agency, but threats, etc. all of which goes with negativity bias, not agency detection.

Such as in the example used in your wikipedia article: "For example, if a human came across an indentation in the ground that might be a lion's footprint, it is advantageous to err on the side of caution and assume that the lion is present."

An example of negativity bias, favoring perception of a threat, over a non-threat. Not agent over non-agent, but threat over non-threat.

If you want to argue that agency detection exists, prove it. The burden of proof falls on you, so get to work old man.

Perceiving a threat and assigning agency is only one example of agency detection.
Typical of you to cherry-pick, though.

How about Michael Shermer?

Or maybe just check the references in this article?


Please show us other examples supportive of "agency detection".

Please prove to us that "agency detection" exists. By not appealing to authority.






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"Tell me, muse, of the storyteller who has been thrust to the edge of the world, both an infant and an ancient, and through him reveal everyman." ---Homer the aged poet.

"In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."
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13-09-2016, 05:32 AM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(13-09-2016 05:08 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  Lol, informing you that there is variety of forms of theism, is not justifying theism, anymore so that you pointing out that their are variety of forms of racist, equates to justifying racism.

None of which I said has anything to do with validity of theism, just in regards to different historical conceptions of God, such as Plutos (platonic theism) Aristotelian theism ( Aristotles conception of God), process theism. Even pantheism, deism, etc. have a variety of expressions.

There are variety of meanings associated with the term God, it why some atheists prefer to label themselves ignostics. If he the concept wasn't so broad, an ambiguous, why do you think ignosticism exists?

But please every form of theism can be silly and false, as belief in fairies, but my point still stands independent of the validity of any form of theism.

Yes, I agree. The misunderstanding was on my part.

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13-09-2016, 05:43 AM
RE: Feedback requested on a new hypothesis on the origin of atheism
(13-09-2016 05:29 AM)Tomasia Wrote:  
(12-09-2016 02:17 PM)Chas Wrote:  Perceiving a threat and assigning agency is only one example of agency detection.
Typical of you to cherry-pick, though.

How about Michael Shermer?

Or maybe just check the references in this article?


Please show us other examples supportive of "agency detection".

Please prove to us that "agency detection" exists. By not appealing to authority.






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You clearly did not read any of the supporting material.
The evidence is there.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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