Feminism, Rape and Immigration
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18-08-2014, 03:59 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
(18-08-2014 03:40 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  As much as 10-15%*
And no, it's certainly not giant organized movement let's all march on Washington and storm the white house gates significant.
It's pretty far down the list of what I would consider important world issues.

OK, but the fact that other people consider it important is also fine, right? So if they want to make an organization and sing songs and perform marches there's nothing wrong with that...

In any case I don't have a ranked list of shit that's important that I care about. "First we gotta fix the world starvation problem, then we gotta end war, then we gotta fix racism, then maaaaybe we'll think about gender equality".

All of this shit happens all at once. So you try to respond to it all at once too - fix the stuff that you can and hope that eventually if everyone tries hard maybe the other stuff will also get fixed. Maybe you can't stop the war, but you *can* challenge some bullshit idea in your own back yard - and feminism for me is one of those things, something where you can make a difference yourself, without getting all fancy about marches and organizations and so on.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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18-08-2014, 04:04 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
Anyone else notice that arguments against feminism so often devolve into "your right, but shut up about it"!
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18-08-2014, 04:05 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
(18-08-2014 04:04 PM)Michael_Tadlock Wrote:  Anyone else notice that arguments against feminism so often devolve into "your right, but shut up about it"!

That or "Well other people have it worse so shut up".

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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18-08-2014, 04:35 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
Quote:In particular, I fail to see how protests in the United States would affect Canada.

I never said they did? It was a metaphor...

Quote:Then it may interest you to know that nobody has ever said that it was?

Plenty of feminist activists who would.

Quote:Citation needed on "uproar".

Nope it's not, because you know what I'm saying.

Quote:Citation needed on "everyone wants [changes] to happen overnight".

Also no citation needed because you know what I'm saying again.

Quote:At best it is raising awareness that, in fact, change does take time and systematic inequalities do still exist. That's it.

Now now cjlr, you make sound so pointless..

Quote:OK, but the fact that other people consider it important is also fine, right?

The scale of which people consider this important is not proportionate to the issue.

Quote:In any case I don't have a ranked list of shit that's important that I care about.

Neither do I, but I view certain issues as a higher priority than others.
And not just issues like world hunger, I'm talking about issues closer to home. Homelessness, child poverty, youth unemployment.
That sort of shit. And don't think it's because I'm a guy, gay rights is pretty fucking far down my list of priorities too.
It was higher than women's rights because we didn't have equality under the law for a moment there but now it's back being way down near the bottom.

Quote:All of this shit happens all at once. So you try to respond to it all at once too - fix the stuff that you can and hope that eventually if everyone tries hard maybe the other stuff will also get fixed. Maybe you can't stop the war, but you *can* challenge some bullshit idea in your own back yard - and feminism for me is one of those things, something where you can make a difference yourself, without getting all fancy about marches and organizations and so on.

The issue doesn't have to be something huge like trying to solve the Israel-Palestine conflict, it can be something simple like child poverty in your own country. Instead of marching for middle income women to get a 10% pay increase, why not march for the welfare family that can't afford to send their child to school with lunch?

Quote:That or "Well other people have it worse so shut up".

Other people do have it worse. So shut up.

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18-08-2014, 04:42 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
(18-08-2014 04:35 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  
Quote:Then it may interest you to know that nobody has ever said that it was?

Plenty of feminist activists who would.

... Such as?

(18-08-2014 04:35 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  
Quote:Citation needed on "uproar".

Nope it's not, because you know what I'm saying.

Quote:Citation needed on "everyone wants [changes] to happen overnight".

Also no citation needed because you know what I'm saying again.

Oh. Right. How silly of me, to be skeptical of your feels.

(18-08-2014 04:35 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  
Quote:At best it is raising awareness that, in fact, change does take time and systematic inequalities do still exist. That's it.

Now now cjlr, you make sound so pointless.

Hardly.

You've acknowledged that nominal legal equality is a far cry from actual equality. You've said peoples' attitudes are changing.

Perhaps you might consider why attitudes are changing?

Hint: it might have something to do with that whole "raising awareness" thing.

(18-08-2014 04:35 PM)earmuffs Wrote:  The issue doesn't have to be something huge like trying to solve the Israel-Palestine conflict, it can be something simple like child poverty in your own country. Instead of marching for middle income women to get a 10% pay increase, why not march for the welfare family that can't afford to send their child to school with lunch?

That's an idiotic response. Which assumption would you care to substantiate first?

That you know what people are and are not "marching" for?
That said marching must be exclusive?
That "marching" is a sufficient to characterise all action and activism?

It's okay; we'll wait.

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18-08-2014, 07:06 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
Quote:... Such as?

I'm not talking people on this forum.

Quote:Oh. Right. How silly of me, to be skeptical of your feels.

It's alright, apology accepted.

Quote:Perhaps you might consider why attitudes are changing?

Perhaps. But can you say without a doubt that it's due to feminist groups?
It in part no doubt is, but I would say external factors and peoples personal experience (such as their wife working or whatever) is far more powerful than someone waving a picket sign around.

Quote:That's an idiotic response. Which assumption would you care to substantiate first?

That you know what people are and are not "marching" for?
That said marching must be exclusive?
That "marching" is a sufficient to characterise all action and activism?

It's okay; we'll wait.

"Marching" is a metaphor.

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18-08-2014, 07:08 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
I am a bit disappointed at your view Muffs.

Women don't invest enough time and effort as men...I don't think that's quite accurate.

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18-08-2014, 07:12 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
(18-08-2014 07:08 PM)Anjele Wrote:  I am a bit disappointed at your view Muffs.

Women don't invest enough time and effort as men...I don't think that's quite accurate.

Women are paid less... must be their fault. Afterall, sexism in the workplace doesn't exist.
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18-08-2014, 07:18 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
(18-08-2014 07:08 PM)Anjele Wrote:  I am a bit disappointed at your view Muffs.

Women don't invest enough time and effort as men...I don't think that's quite accurate.

Why? Because I don't believe one gender is better than the other and believe that there are work related issues among both genders (as well as race and sexuality) and that to focus on one gender is not a good way to go about achieving equality?
ie: Why are there very few primary school male teachers? At my primary school there were none in fact. The only male on the whole staff was the care-taker.
Is it because male primary school teachers are frowned upon? Like "look, he wants to teach little kids, he must be a pedophile"?

I guess I'm in the same mind as Ato, I don't see the point in feminism when something more inclusive of all people is far more desirable.

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18-08-2014, 08:02 PM
RE: Feminism, Rape and Immigration
I wonder if a woman who makes 10% less than her male counterpart actually ends up with less after factoring in lower caloric requirements for food. Obviously I'm not saying its right, just something that came to mind.
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