Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
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22-07-2013, 09:42 PM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
(22-07-2013 09:37 PM)NoahsFarce Wrote:  
(22-07-2013 09:26 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  Guess I'm a terrible person then.

Because I think that someone being religious says a lot about the type of person they are...and I would avoid that. I'm not someone to waste my time on something I don't want. Not anymore.

To each their own.

I agree to a point. It does say some things about a person. But I can't include every individual in this equation. Take KC for example. He's religious, yet he is scientifically minded and doesn't believe in other hoo has. What about Dr. Kent Miller? That man did a great service towards keeping ID out of schools. And he's a Christian. What about one of my closest friends? He's a believer too. All these people are believers, yet they are superbly accepting and open-minded. Only one difference arises and that is the belief in God.

I'm not saying you're horrible. Just saying it's not really fair to judge all believers like that. It makes a world of sense for you to date other Atheists. You have that option. Again, I'm mostly speaking for the situations where one person in a long-term relationship loses their religion. It's a crying shame when couples can't work that out solely because one, the other, or both are devout in their world-views.

Also, I would like to point out that some cultures are deeply rooted in religion. That makes it doubly hard for those people to shake their beliefs. To me, it's not fair for me to pass judgment solely based on their religious beliefs. Isn't that the same reason why Atheism elicits such negative reactions?

You're also making the assumption that I'm talking about all relationships. Which would be wrong.

I'm talking about in a romantic sense only. I think KC is a bright and respectable man. But I couldnt date someone with his beliefs. Too much of a clash.

It is bad when it happens in a couple in long term. But if its a problem its a problem, and should be nipped in the bud as quickly as possible.
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22-07-2013, 09:52 PM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
(22-07-2013 09:42 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  
(22-07-2013 09:37 PM)NoahsFarce Wrote:  I agree to a point. It does say some things about a person. But I can't include every individual in this equation. Take KC for example. He's religious, yet he is scientifically minded and doesn't believe in other hoo has. What about Dr. Kent Miller? That man did a great service towards keeping ID out of schools. And he's a Christian. What about one of my closest friends? He's a believer too. All these people are believers, yet they are superbly accepting and open-minded. Only one difference arises and that is the belief in God.

I'm not saying you're horrible. Just saying it's not really fair to judge all believers like that. It makes a world of sense for you to date other Atheists. You have that option. Again, I'm mostly speaking for the situations where one person in a long-term relationship loses their religion. It's a crying shame when couples can't work that out solely because one, the other, or both are devout in their world-views.

Also, I would like to point out that some cultures are deeply rooted in religion. That makes it doubly hard for those people to shake their beliefs. To me, it's not fair for me to pass judgment solely based on their religious beliefs. Isn't that the same reason why Atheism elicits such negative reactions?

You're also making the assumption that I'm talking about all relationships. Which would be wrong.

I'm talking about in a romantic sense only. I think KC is a bright and respectable man. But I couldnt date someone with his beliefs. Too much of a clash.

It is bad when it happens in a couple in long term. But if its a problem its a problem, and should be nipped in the bud as quickly as possible.

Yes, I agree with that. That's what I suggested the OP do: separate as she is obviously the intolerant type.

As for the KC thing, I don't think there's much clash at all. Let's say him and yourself are compatible in every other aspect. You can talk Atheism all you want and he'll never bat an eye to it. You guys have kids and both decide to leave it up to the children to decide for themselves. You introduce both topics. He would be accepting of Atheist children as much as he'd be accepting of gay children.

In this scenario, the only clash that I see is the belief in God. If this is unacceptable still, then isn't it an issue with your own tolerance and not the believer's (KC)?

This type of relationship is rare, but they do exist. And they only exist because both parties are accepting of each other and are able to overlook this one issue. Again, I fear relationships more for reasons other than religion. Faithfulness, parenting style, ambition, interests... all of those matter more to me than one's belief in God so long as they aren't devout and intolerant.

But that's just me. However, don't think that I'm not going to be seeking out other non-believers should I find myself single again. I totally am. But who knows when it comes to love? Some religious hottie could win me over.

“We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically.”

-Neil deGrasse Tyson
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22-07-2013, 09:56 PM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
(22-07-2013 09:52 PM)NoahsFarce Wrote:  
(22-07-2013 09:42 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  You're also making the assumption that I'm talking about all relationships. Which would be wrong.

I'm talking about in a romantic sense only. I think KC is a bright and respectable man. But I couldnt date someone with his beliefs. Too much of a clash.

It is bad when it happens in a couple in long term. But if its a problem its a problem, and should be nipped in the bud as quickly as possible.

Yes, I agree with that. That's what I suggested the OP do: separate as she is obviously the intolerant type.

As for the KC thing, I don't think there's much clash at all. Let's say him and yourself are compatible in every other aspect. You can talk Atheism all you want and he'll never bat an eye to it. You guys have kids and both decide to leave it up to the children to decide for themselves. You introduce both topics. He would be accepting of Atheist children as much as he'd be accepting of gay children.

In this scenario, the only clash that I see is the belief in God. If this is unacceptable still, then isn't it an issue with your own tolerance and not the believer's (KC)?

This type of relationship is rare, but they do exist. And they only exist because both parties are accepting of each other and are able to overlook this one issue. Again, I fear relationships more for reasons other than religion. Faithfulness, parenting style, ambition, interests... all of those matter more to me than one's belief in God so long as they aren't devout and intolerant.

But that's just me. However, don't think that I'm not going to be seeking out other non-believers should I find myself single again. I totally am. But who knows when it comes to love? Some religious hottie could win me over.

Cause hottness is the only real reason to have a relationship Wink

Things like you have listed are all affected by a persons core beliefs.

While religious ideology may not be important to you. It is important to a lot of people.

Including myself.

I'll just stick with my incredibly intelligent, attractive, atheist boyfriend thanks Big Grin

Good luck with a new religious hottie Tongue
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22-07-2013, 09:57 PM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
(22-07-2013 09:56 PM)Hobbitgirl Wrote:  
(22-07-2013 09:52 PM)NoahsFarce Wrote:  Yes, I agree with that. That's what I suggested the OP do: separate as she is obviously the intolerant type.

As for the KC thing, I don't think there's much clash at all. Let's say him and yourself are compatible in every other aspect. You can talk Atheism all you want and he'll never bat an eye to it. You guys have kids and both decide to leave it up to the children to decide for themselves. You introduce both topics. He would be accepting of Atheist children as much as he'd be accepting of gay children.

In this scenario, the only clash that I see is the belief in God. If this is unacceptable still, then isn't it an issue with your own tolerance and not the believer's (KC)?

This type of relationship is rare, but they do exist. And they only exist because both parties are accepting of each other and are able to overlook this one issue. Again, I fear relationships more for reasons other than religion. Faithfulness, parenting style, ambition, interests... all of those matter more to me than one's belief in God so long as they aren't devout and intolerant.

But that's just me. However, don't think that I'm not going to be seeking out other non-believers should I find myself single again. I totally am. But who knows when it comes to love? Some religious hottie could win me over.

Cause hottness is the only real reason to have a relationship Wink

Things like you have listed are all affected by a persons core beliefs.

While religious ideology may not be important to you. It is important to a lot of people.

Including myself.

I'll just stick with my incredibly intelligent, attractive, atheist boyfriend thanks Big Grin

Good luck with a new religious hottie Tongue

But you never once asked me how I define hotness Drinking Beverage

“We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically.”

-Neil deGrasse Tyson
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22-07-2013, 09:59 PM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
And please don't think I'm judging you or thinking that you're horrible. I respect you and your opinion.

But hey, we agree on a lot more than this one subject...








... yea, I know you see what I did there Tongue

“We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically.”

-Neil deGrasse Tyson
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23-07-2013, 05:02 AM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
(22-07-2013 09:03 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(22-07-2013 05:10 PM)cjs Wrote:  Sorry to hear, hope she will come around. Good men are not easy to find.

Actually, we're very easy to find.

Apparently, we're also easy to overlook. Dodgy

^^ this

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It's too damn "peopley" out there....
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23-07-2013, 08:12 AM (This post was last modified: 23-07-2013 08:18 AM by CCrosby.)
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
Thanks for the insight guys. She apologized to me this morning and I think we are going to try to work things out. However given the type of person she is I do believe we are going to keep having these same problems in the future. She is a "devout" Christian and what makes it even worse is that she refuses to even read the Bible and see my perspective on it. I tried to explain my view on Hell and as Bill Maher said on Religulous "selling certainty". I mean I shouldnt even have to explain these things, all you would have to do is actually sit and think about things. The problem I have is that I am stuck with a stubborn and intolerant woman and I am uncertain that we will work. I feel that the only reason that I am with her is because of her kids and the lease extension we just signed for our apartment. I am not happy at all guys and I feel that I have fallen out of love with her because of all of this mess. I don't really care anymore...FML
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23-07-2013, 10:01 AM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
Did her apology seem sincere? Was she willing to discuss this issue with you after said apology? If not, then the apology was not sincere.

I would let her know straight up that if you guys cannot discuss this matter with civility, then the relationship is doomed. I'm sure you love her kids so it would be nice for you to reassure her that you'll still be a part of their lives if she allows it.

Don't try to push non-belief on her right now. If she's willing to give you a listen, then ease her into it. Find some neutral material. There's some great speeches out there from people like Dr. Kent Miller. A Christian who is adamantly against ID. Then there are scientists like Neil deGrasse Tyson. He has moments where he challenges religion, but he always does so in a neutral manner.

What you don't want to do is slap Christopher Hitchens or Richard Dawkins in her face... at least for the time being. Tell her you are open to discourse and her thoughts on the subject.

If none of this is worth it to you, then I'm afraid you don't love her enough to try and make this work. If that's the case, cut your losses right now. It'll be better for the both of you.

“We are all connected; To each other, biologically. To the earth, chemically. To the rest of the universe atomically.”

-Neil deGrasse Tyson
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26-07-2013, 02:59 PM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
She is controlled by her religious beliefs and with southern Baptists there's no maybe's. The church will soon control the children and it will put pressure on her to convert you. I don't think your relationship will survive this because you will become resentful and it will eat at you. It's time to distance yourself from her. I know it's painful but she needs to sort this out, without your influence.
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26-07-2013, 09:17 PM
RE: Fiance's overreaction to my new found atheism/agnosticism
(26-07-2013 02:59 PM)Takelababy Wrote:  She is controlled by her religious beliefs and with southern Baptists there's no maybe's. The church will soon control the children and it will put pressure on her to convert you. I don't think your relationship will survive this because you will become resentful and it will eat at you. It's time to distance yourself from her. I know it's painful but she needs to sort this out, without your influence.

I Disagree....I married a Southern Baptist, and eventually she came around and is now atheist, they take more time, but if they are intelligent people it will happen with enough leverage. I had to make my wife realize that a relationship was a two way street and if she wasn't willing to love me for me then she needed to GTFO....two weeks later she came back and said she loves me and that she want's to hear my POV. Now, 5 years later, she's an atheist, we have two children, and are still in love with each other.

It CAN WORK...Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. If both of you are willing to work through it, and come to some sort of compromise.

DO NOT go into this trying to convert her.
DO NOT give an Ultimatum.
DO NOT allow her to push anything on you
DO NOT allow her to shut you out.

DO sit her down and talk.
DO tell her you still love her and the kids and want to fix this so you are both happy.
ALLOW her to believe what she wants to believe and love her as a person regardless.

Relationships are work, everything doesn't always work the way you want, give her time and she'll either 1. Love you more for trying so hard or 2. push you away and make the decision for you.

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