Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
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30-12-2013, 04:23 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 04:18 AM)HU.Junyuan Wrote:  How come it doesn't make sense ?

[1] The drug related crimes are horrible, unless you think the locals like decapitations, do you ?

Doesnt justify the death penalty, since I mentioned before it fails do decrease drug releated violence.

Quote:[2] According to the merits of democracy, problems are dealt with fairly and efficiently, unless you think otherwise, do you ?

Or bogged down through making dhortsighted and unefficiant decisions.

Democracy does not guarantee any success in social and economic questions whatsoever.

It merely provides and guarantees that there is no totalitarianism.

Quote:[3] Thus, I said, "Democracy is supposed to have worked unless the locals wanted drugs". It should have made sense to you, unless you don't agree with something stated above, do you ?

No that sentence makes absolutly no sence at all since it conects two things which have hardly anything to do with eachother.

You meantion one thing, which is drug violence and then jump over to making a conclusion about something completly different, without leaving anykind of explaination to why that jump was made.

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30-12-2013, 04:25 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 04:11 AM)HU.Junyuan Wrote:  ...
I should have asked "is there any practical way under the existing political structure that the locals could help themselves out."

Yeah, dude, you should have.

It was a clumsily worded question. It's not like English isn't you first language, is it?

Tongue

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30-12-2013, 04:25 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(29-12-2013 09:49 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  The locals wanted drugs?

C'mon man, really? Drug runners and producers around the world found a perfect opportunity for manufacture in Mexico and took it, I doubt the locals had anything to do with it on the most part aside from being forced into submission by the various cartels through murder, torture and kidnapping.

Even if Mexico still had the death penalty, how would anything be better off? Should they just arrest and execute anybody they think is associated with a Cartel? Or just execute the members? How would you distinguish between civilians forced into collaboration and willing members?

You gave more questions to a man asking a question ...

And that's exactly why I asked "How could the locals practically help themselves out with their current democratic political system and no-death-penalty policy ?"

Or I should put it this way: "What's your sugguestion to the locals of practically help themselves out with their current democratic political system and no-death-penalty policy ? "

Time now to exhibit your wisdom.

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30-12-2013, 04:30 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
Hate doesn't breed love. Violence doesn't breed peace. Human rights violations don't mend hearts. Mend hearts and build community. Enrich the population and minimise poverty. That's how we solve problems such as these.

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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30-12-2013, 04:32 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 04:25 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(30-12-2013 04:11 AM)HU.Junyuan Wrote:  ...
I should have asked "is there any practical way under the existing political structure that the locals could help themselves out."

Yeah, dude, you should have.

It was a clumsily worded question. It's not like English isn't you first language, is it?

Tongue

You have just dealt a fatal blow to a mediocre translator ...

I did have a strange feeling when I wrote that sentence down ... turned out to be gravely mistaken ...

Yet it still has its interesting side: after I seemed to have asked a rhetorical question (not my intention at all), three wise men respectfully disagreed. Now that I put the question in an better worded form, I think I am totally justified to admire some wisdom at work.

Big Grin

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30-12-2013, 04:35 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 04:23 AM)The Germans are coming Wrote:  ...

OK.

Simple question: under the exsiting political structure, any advice to help the locals out ?

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30-12-2013, 04:47 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 04:30 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  Hate doesn't breed love. Violence doesn't breed peace. Human rights violations don't mend hearts. Mend hearts and build community. Enrich the population and minimise poverty. That's how we solve problems such as these.

It depends on how well the enriching of the population and minimising of the poverty can go then.

Yet when mayors and cops being murdered no longer qualifies for shocking news, something might have went wrong. Consider

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30-12-2013, 05:05 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 04:35 AM)HU.Junyuan Wrote:  OK.

Simple question: under the exsiting political structure, any advice to help the locals out ?

Legalise Cannabis.

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30-12-2013, 05:18 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 05:05 AM)The Germans are coming Wrote:  
(30-12-2013 04:35 AM)HU.Junyuan Wrote:  OK.

Simple question: under the exsiting political structure, any advice to help the locals out ?

Legalise Cannabis.

Mexico's former president Vicente Fox said on a Friday in August this year that Cannabis is going to be legalised in 5 years.

Only if this could force the gangsters to get corporatized and law-abiding ... and turned into a well regulated militia ? I don't think they will easily waive their old business of inducing fear anyway.

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30-12-2013, 05:43 AM
RE: Five decapitated bodies dumped in Michoacan capital
(30-12-2013 04:25 AM)HU.Junyuan Wrote:  
(29-12-2013 09:49 PM)Free Thought Wrote:  The locals wanted drugs?

C'mon man, really? Drug runners and producers around the world found a perfect opportunity for manufacture in Mexico and took it, I doubt the locals had anything to do with it on the most part aside from being forced into submission by the various cartels through murder, torture and kidnapping.

Even if Mexico still had the death penalty, how would anything be better off? Should they just arrest and execute anybody they think is associated with a Cartel? Or just execute the members? How would you distinguish between civilians forced into collaboration and willing members?

You gave more questions to a man asking a question ...

And that's exactly why I asked "How could the locals practically help themselves out with their current democratic political system and no-death-penalty policy ?"

Or I should put it this way: "What's your sugguestion to the locals of practically help themselves out with their current democratic political system and no-death-penalty policy ? "

Time now to exhibit your wisdom.

I personally can't see a real way for the locals themselves to get out of their predicament.

Aside from the civilians putting themselves in extreme danger by actively and violently opposing one, or both groups simultaneously there is not much that can happen, or that the civilians can do, which would improve their general condition. And even the suggestion of large-scale opposition is not practical; it's unlikely that the people (civilians) have great access to weapons or training or outside support, or even the capacity to plan such an undertaking in general.

Those cartels will take decades of blood the wipe from Mexico; every one down means growth for those still standing after all, and I doubt that the Mexican government, with or without the general people, has the resources to deal with the problem, in the long-term.
I can see military and peacekeeping Interventions from the UN working, but they could in fact make the Cartels desperate and cause more civilian blood to be spilled, so I can also see that idea failing.

Overall, I see no real way for local Mexican civies to get themselves or their nation of that mess without extremely exceptional circumstances, in addition: I choose to blame the US 'cause a lot of the guns the Cartel us come from there, and hell, it's the US so blame it anyway, and I uphold my question: "How would Mexico be better off if it weren't democratic and had the death penalty still?"

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