For everyone! Mostly
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08-05-2016, 09:56 PM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
(08-05-2016 08:30 PM)Jewelarcher Wrote:  
(08-05-2016 08:02 PM)Shai Hulud Wrote:  Thanks, glad to be considered good company! Smile

And nope, still Catholic. Despite plenty of doubts and some reasonable points that people raise. I'm not as good in a debate as you, so I just tend to try and hang around the Casual Coffeehouse and such.

Ok this might be weird but I think Catholics are so cool and I know NOTHING about them.
Could you share some beliefs?
My art teacher from high school is Catholic and I think that's where I get the idea of how cool I say they are.

NO. Catholics are not cool. One example.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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08-05-2016, 09:59 PM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
(08-05-2016 09:56 PM)Banjo Wrote:  
(08-05-2016 08:30 PM)Jewelarcher Wrote:  Ok this might be weird but I think Catholics are so cool and I know NOTHING about them.
Could you share some beliefs?
My art teacher from high school is Catholic and I think that's where I get the idea of how cool I say they are.

NO. Catholics are not cool. One example.

Ok. I just like the outfits.
My teacher is part of some Catholic knights thing and they just look cool.
But I might as well learn about everything Big Grin
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09-05-2016, 07:08 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
(08-05-2016 08:30 PM)Jewelarcher Wrote:  Ok this might be weird but I think Catholics are so cool and I know NOTHING about them.
Could you share some beliefs?
My art teacher from high school is Catholic and I think that's where I get the idea of how cool I say they are.
It is so weird Banjo brings that up, someone on Catholic Bronies the other day was bringing up the need for another Vandee Uprising and massacres like that one, and that with the "wickedness" of modern society, martyrdom is inevitable. Did I ever mention that group is crazy? I think I did, somewhere around here, heh.

Anyhow, some beliefs:
1) Jesus Christ is the Son of God and part of the Trinity (simple I know, but when I was growing up, I didn't know this, because people taught otherwise).
2) Mary, Christ's mother, was immaculately conceived. Most people think this refers to the virgin birth, but actually means that Mary herself was born without the stain of original sin. This belief is established by one of the two "ex Cathedra" statements in church history; that is, when the Pope claims to be speaking infallibly.
3) The other "ex Cathedra" statement is that Mary did not die, but at the end of her life, was taken up bodily into Heaven. This is known as The Assumption.
4) The above two "ex Cathedra" statements were actually passed in response to popular belief, not otherwise theological grounds; every time someone says "the church is not a democracy" I think about how the Popes bowed to public pressure with those.
5) The Eucharist, or Communion, is the body and blood of Christ through a process known as Transubstantiation, rather than just a symbol like in most Protestant churches. It's also daily, except for Good Friday, 364 days a year.
6) The actual Mass is broken into two parts, the Liturgy of the Word (the Scripture readings and homily) and the Liturgy of the Eucharist (all the stuff relating to Communion, as well as the world's most annoying meet and greet if you go to Mass alone, the Sign of Peace).
7) Most American Catholics seem to think they know their religion better than the Pope, and any time he does something the more conservative of them disagree with, they shout about how he should bow to our American political values.
8) The Catholic Church doesn't just do altar calls to have people join, if you're an adult you have to go through the Rite of Christian Initiation for Adults (RCIA). Mine at least was 3 hours a week, once a week, and basically a college level intro course into Catholicism, taught by the parish priest and food cooked by two nuns from Zimbabwe...one time, during annulments and remarriage, it went into the 4 hour mark and I asked to be excused, as the only person in my class whom that did not apply to. The priest shook my hand, told me to head home, and whispered that he envied my ability to run away. RCIA was also the first time I heard someone in a ministry position deny Creationism and say that evolution was indisputable fact. A lot of folks online have told me I was lucky and that theirs sucked and they learned nothing.
9) Despite the fact the Church is relatively wealthy, places like Notre Dame and other historic cathedrals, as well as your local parish, are mainly financed through donations. The average Catholic priest in my archdiocese earns $24,000 a year to be on call 365 days a year, 24 hours a day.
10) Retiring as a priest rarely means really retiring, it just means you still get called in to cover for the active priests, but we don't have to pay you even as little as they get. (I still think they get paid a small sum to play substitute, but it's pretty paltry.) Let's put it this way, a retired 70-some year old priest with cancer heard my Confession on Saturday while the one assigned to the parish was doing a wedding.
11) Following the breaking of the sex abuse scandals, over 400 priests in the U.S. were quietly purged by Benedict XVI and a series of reforms set into motion. Volunteers have to go through training sessions about sex abuse now, before working with kids. Any priest accused of sex abuse is pretty much suspended first, then investigated second. If anything's found, they're supposed to call the police and turn over the evidence now, instead of following the 1970s line of thought that sexual predators can be rehabilitated and should just be moved. (Interestingly enough, sex abuse is huge in non-Catholic churches too, but there isn't a hierarchy that covers it up, just a local thing. One non-denom church at home is headed by a sex offender and a Baptist youth leader's son that I grew up with, who went to seminary for a few semesters is in prison for soliciting minors via computer and sexual assault. Just as two personal examples...as another example, I should, in disclosure, say that there have been two priests in my time as a Catholic who have made my skin crawl. One of them was recently found to be a sexual predator and his Order had been covering it up...the other one, I really keep waiting to see in the news.) The archdiocese I'm in now, has a priest shortage because the "new" Archbishop made a huge purge of everyone involved in the sex abuse scandals here.
12) Before the Second Vatican Council (Vatican II), the Mass was in Latin. Afterwards, the local vernacular became the norm. Re-translations are still being issued, V2 was in the 1960s. Normally, "Traditionalist" Catholics don't like the Novus Ordo (vernacular) Mass...I can sometimes relate to this, just google Clown Mass or Barney Blessing if you want to see why, but most of the time, Mass is Mass.
13) The Archdiocese of Philadelphia has a bad reputation due to the sex abuse scandals. I once dated a woman there; every parish I visited was horrible, the priests and people didn't care, and one priest bragged about his ability to condense a 1 hour Mass into 20 minutes or less.
14) Much like other churches, Easter and Christmas, suddenly everyone shows up to church. Unlike most other churches, we only welcome new converts on the night before Easter Sunday, this is the Easter Vigil. It lasts forever. (Janitor thankfully told me to use the bathroom right before it.) There are up to seven lengthy Old Testament readings, a New Testament reading, and a reading from the Gospel. Professions of Faith. Baptisms. Confirmations. Etc. It's absolutely beautiful, but it's the Iron Bladder Challenge.
15) We enjoy rules lawyering. For instance, the Inquisition usually had the secular authorities kill people, to keep its own hands "clean". As you can tell from the reputation, everyone saw through that one, heh.
16) It's the norm for most priests to have a Bachelors, a Masters, and a degree from their seminary. I have a Franciscan friend whose Order required at least 60 credits in Philosophy for potential applicants.
17) Worship/Adoration is for God alone. Veneration is for the Saints; an example often used is like asking family members to pray for you.
18) Coming from a Baptist background, the level of drinking and gambling is insane. Bingo, elimination dinners, raffles, etc. on the gambling front. (Sadly, there is no Patron Saint for Bingo, we need one.) Drinking wise, there's alcohol at every Mass. Funny enough, my priest ended up in the hospital recently and they asked, "Do you drink?" "Every day." "....how much?" "A few swallows. I'm a priest and have to finish off the Blood of Christ. I keep telling my parishoners to drink more."
19) Catholicism can hold its grudges. Like Hardcore. When the Patriarch of the Eastern Orthodox Church came to Pope Francis's installation as Pope, it was the first time that happened in over 900+ years, closing in on one thousand!
20) The knights you're thinking of are probably the Knights of Columbus, a Catholic alternative to the Masons, who love to sell life insurance. They have little tuxedos and the guys who reach the top degree in it get really cool swords. Smile I've been asked to join multiple times, kept saying no. Supposedly the ceremonies for each degree involve deception, and are secretive in nature.

My favorite part of things is that unlike my time as a Baptist, no one has discouraged doubt and questions. As a Baptist, I was told to shut up and believe, so actually being able to question and have someone admit to not knowing is a breath of fresh air.

Sorry to sort of put your thread off course! And sorry I ended up with 20 items!

Need to think of a witty signature.
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09-05-2016, 07:46 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
(09-05-2016 07:08 AM)Shai Hulud Wrote:  
(08-05-2016 08:30 PM)Jewelarcher Wrote:  Ok this might be weird but I think Catholics are so cool and I know NOTHING about them.
Could you share some beliefs?
My art teacher from high school is Catholic and I think that's where I get the idea of how cool I say they are.
It is so weird Banjo brings that up, someone on Catholic Bronies the other day was bringing up the need for another Vandee Uprising and massacres like that one, and that with the "wickedness" of modern society, martyrdom is inevitable. Did I ever mention that group is crazy? I think I did, somewhere around here, heh.

Anyhow, some beliefs:
1) Jesus Christ is the Son of God and part of the Trinity (simple I know, but when I was growing up, I didn't know this, because people taught otherwise).
2) Mary, Christ's mother, was immaculately conceived. Most people think this refers to the virgin birth, but actually means that Mary herself was born without the stain of original sin. This belief is established by one of the two "ex Cathedra" statements in church history; that is, when the Pope claims to be speaking infallibly.
3) The other "ex Cathedra" statement is that Mary did not die, but at the end of her life, was taken up bodily into Heaven. This is known as The Assumption.
4) The above two "ex Cathedra" statements were actually passed in response to popular belief, not otherwise theological grounds; every time someone says "the church is not a democracy" I think about how the Popes bowed to public pressure with those.
5) The Eucharist, or Communion, is the body and blood of Christ through a process known as Transubstantiation, rather than just a symbol like in most Protestant churches. It's also daily, except for Good Friday, 364 days a year.
6) The actual Mass is broken into two parts, the Liturgy of the Word (the Scripture readings and homily) and the Liturgy of the Eucharist (all the stuff relating to Communion, as well as the world's most annoying meet and greet if you go to Mass alone, the Sign of Peace).
7) Most American Catholics seem to think they know their religion better than the Pope, and any time he does something the more conservative of them disagree with, they shout about how he should bow to our American political values.
8) The Catholic Church doesn't just do altar calls to have people join, if you're an adult you have to go through the Rite of Christian Initiation for Adults (RCIA). Mine at least was 3 hours a week, once a week, and basically a college level intro course into Catholicism, taught by the parish priest and food cooked by two nuns from Zimbabwe...one time, during annulments and remarriage, it went into the 4 hour mark and I asked to be excused, as the only person in my class whom that did not apply to. The priest shook my hand, told me to head home, and whispered that he envied my ability to run away. RCIA was also the first time I heard someone in a ministry position deny Creationism and say that evolution was indisputable fact. A lot of folks online have told me I was lucky and that theirs sucked and they learned nothing.
9) Despite the fact the Church is relatively wealthy, places like Notre Dame and other historic cathedrals, as well as your local parish, are mainly financed through donations. The average Catholic priest in my archdiocese earns $24,000 a year to be on call 365 days a year, 24 hours a day.
10) Retiring as a priest rarely means really retiring, it just means you still get called in to cover for the active priests, but we don't have to pay you even as little as they get. (I still think they get paid a small sum to play substitute, but it's pretty paltry.) Let's put it this way, a retired 70-some year old priest with cancer heard my Confession on Saturday while the one assigned to the parish was doing a wedding.
11) Following the breaking of the sex abuse scandals, over 400 priests in the U.S. were quietly purged by Benedict XVI and a series of reforms set into motion. Volunteers have to go through training sessions about sex abuse now, before working with kids. Any priest accused of sex abuse is pretty much suspended first, then investigated second. If anything's found, they're supposed to call the police and turn over the evidence now, instead of following the 1970s line of thought that sexual predators can be rehabilitated and should just be moved. (Interestingly enough, sex abuse is huge in non-Catholic churches too, but there isn't a hierarchy that covers it up, just a local thing. One non-denom church at home is headed by a sex offender and a Baptist youth leader's son that I grew up with, who went to seminary for a few semesters is in prison for soliciting minors via computer and sexual assault. Just as two personal examples...as another example, I should, in disclosure, say that there have been two priests in my time as a Catholic who have made my skin crawl. One of them was recently found to be a sexual predator and his Order had been covering it up...the other one, I really keep waiting to see in the news.) The archdiocese I'm in now, has a priest shortage because the "new" Archbishop made a huge purge of everyone involved in the sex abuse scandals here.
12) Before the Second Vatican Council (Vatican II), the Mass was in Latin. Afterwards, the local vernacular became the norm. Re-translations are still being issued, V2 was in the 1960s. Normally, "Traditionalist" Catholics don't like the Novus Ordo (vernacular) Mass...I can sometimes relate to this, just google Clown Mass or Barney Blessing if you want to see why, but most of the time, Mass is Mass.
13) The Archdiocese of Philadelphia has a bad reputation due to the sex abuse scandals. I once dated a woman there; every parish I visited was horrible, the priests and people didn't care, and one priest bragged about his ability to condense a 1 hour Mass into 20 minutes or less.
14) Much like other churches, Easter and Christmas, suddenly everyone shows up to church. Unlike most other churches, we only welcome new converts on the night before Easter Sunday, this is the Easter Vigil. It lasts forever. (Janitor thankfully told me to use the bathroom right before it.) There are up to seven lengthy Old Testament readings, a New Testament reading, and a reading from the Gospel. Professions of Faith. Baptisms. Confirmations. Etc. It's absolutely beautiful, but it's the Iron Bladder Challenge.
15) We enjoy rules lawyering. For instance, the Inquisition usually had the secular authorities kill people, to keep its own hands "clean". As you can tell from the reputation, everyone saw through that one, heh.
16) It's the norm for most priests to have a Bachelors, a Masters, and a degree from their seminary. I have a Franciscan friend whose Order required at least 60 credits in Philosophy for potential applicants.
17) Worship/Adoration is for God alone. Veneration is for the Saints; an example often used is like asking family members to pray for you.
18) Coming from a Baptist background, the level of drinking and gambling is insane. Bingo, elimination dinners, raffles, etc. on the gambling front. (Sadly, there is no Patron Saint for Bingo, we need one.) Drinking wise, there's alcohol at every Mass. Funny enough, my priest ended up in the hospital recently and they asked, "Do you drink?" "Every day." "....how much?" "A few swallows. I'm a priest and have to finish off the Blood of Christ. I keep telling my parishoners to drink more."
19) Catholicism can hold its grudges. Like Hardcore. When the Patriarch of the Eastern Orthodox Church came to Pope Francis's installation as Pope, it was the first time that happened in over 900+ years, closing in on one thousand!
20) The knights you're thinking of are probably the Knights of Columbus, a Catholic alternative to the Masons, who love to sell life insurance. They have little tuxedos and the guys who reach the top degree in it get really cool swords. Smile I've been asked to join multiple times, kept saying no. Supposedly the ceremonies for each degree involve deception, and are secretive in nature.

My favorite part of things is that unlike my time as a Baptist, no one has discouraged doubt and questions. As a Baptist, I was told to shut up and believe, so actually being able to question and have someone admit to not knowing is a breath of fresh air.

Sorry to sort of put your thread off course! And sorry I ended up with 20 items!

Something about long duration anything turns me away. But thanks for all of that. I actually enjoyed reading it but I have now decided I don't want to visit a Catholic Church.
And you are right it's the Knights of Columbus. Those guys look cool.
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09-05-2016, 08:23 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
You are welcome person I never meet.

[Image: Guilmon-41189.gif] https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCOW_Ioi2wtuPa88FvBmnBgQ my youtube
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09-05-2016, 08:58 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
(09-05-2016 07:08 AM)Shai Hulud Wrote:  3) The other "ex Cathedra" statement is that Mary did not die, but at the end of her life, was taken up bodily into Heaven. This is known as The Assumption.

Well, they named it correctly anyway...

as·sump·tion/əˈsəm(p)SH(ə)n/
noun

1. a thing that is accepted as true or as certain to happen, without proof.
2. the action of taking or beginning to take power or responsibility.
3. the reception of the Virgin Mary bodily into heaven. This was formally declared a doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church in 1950.
4. arrogance or presumption.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
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09-05-2016, 09:34 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
(09-05-2016 07:46 AM)Jewelarcher Wrote:  Something about long duration anything turns me away. But thanks for all of that. I actually enjoyed reading it but I have now decided I don't want to visit a Catholic Church.
And you are right it's the Knights of Columbus. Those guys look cool.

I forgot, after each Old Testament reading is a sung Responsorial Psalm between the Cantor who is singing the verses and the Congregation doing the responses, so up to seven Responsorial Psalms on Easter Vigil!

You're welcome for the info, though sorry on the long duration turning you away. This once again shows why I sucked hardcore as a Baptist at any type of Evangelism. Though wasn't trying to convert you just now either, but it really does reinforce that I'd be a terrible missionary. Tongue

Agreed on the Knights looking cool though. And I enjoy your posts too, you ask really great questions so that some of us don't have to.

(09-05-2016 08:58 AM)unfogged Wrote:  Well, they named it correctly anyway...

as·sump·tion/əˈsəm(p)SH(ə)n/
noun

1. a thing that is accepted as true or as certain to happen, without proof.
2. the action of taking or beginning to take power or responsibility.
3. the reception of the Virgin Mary bodily into heaven. This was formally declared a doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church in 1950.
4. arrogance or presumption.

I never realized the whole belief of the Assumption was in the dictionary even (even though that's not the part you bolded). Learn something new every day...although I find I learn more about the Bible and extra-Biblical beliefs on this site than Christian ones.

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10-05-2016, 12:22 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
I've done nothing. But, thank you for thanking me.

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10-05-2016, 12:35 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
(09-05-2016 08:58 AM)unfogged Wrote:  
(09-05-2016 07:08 AM)Shai Hulud Wrote:  3) The other "ex Cathedra" statement is that Mary did not die, but at the end of her life, was taken up bodily into Heaven. This is known as The Assumption.

Well, they named it correctly anyway...

as·sump·tion/əˈsəm(p)SH(ə)n/
noun

1. a thing that is accepted as true or as certain to happen, without proof.
2. the action of taking or beginning to take power or responsibility.
3. the reception of the Virgin Mary bodily into heaven. This was formally declared a doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church in 1950.
4. arrogance or presumption.


When you assume you make an Ass out of U and Me.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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10-05-2016, 12:50 AM
RE: For everyone! Mostly
More on the catholic church.

Catholic rubbish in scripture. Clearly showing the catholic church is built upon farce.

Matthew 23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.
Matthew 23:9 And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
(Verse 8 tells that the pope is nobody's master. Verse 9: The word "pope" means "father")

2nd Corinthians 11:13 For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.
2nd Corinthians 11:14 And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
2nd Corinthians 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

1st Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
1st Timothy 4:2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;
1st Timothy 4:3 Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats , which God hath created to be received
(Celibate priests and meat-less Fridays)

2nd Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2nd Thessalonians 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God , or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God , shewing himself that he is God.

Revelation 18:4: And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.
(Leave the FALSE church, NOW!)

Revelation 17:5: And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
[...]
Revelation 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains , on which the woman sitteth.
(Rome is situated on seven hills)

1st Timothy 3:1 This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.
1st Timothy 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife , vigilant, sober, of good behaviour, given to hospitality, apt to teach;
[...]
1st Timothy 3:12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife , ruling their children and their own houses well.
(Bishops (including popes) and deacons are allowed to marry (compare Timothy 4:1-3, quoted above).)

Titus 1:6 If any be blameless, the husband of one wife , having faithful children not accused of riot or unruly.
Titus 1:7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;

The worship of Peter. This breaks commandment # 1. This is, as I have spoken elsewhere, where we see paganism enter into xianity through the Rome abandoned by Constantine. At least as those left behind viewed his departure for Constantinople.

Matthew 8:14 And when Jesus was come into Peter's house, he saw his wife 's mother laid, and sick of a fever.

1st Corinthians 9:5 Have we not power to lead about a sister, a wife , as well as other apostles, and as the brethren of the Lord, and Cephas?
(Peter (=Cephas) was married. So why is the pope not allowed to marry?)

Matthew 16:23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

Matthew 18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
(All the disciples had the power to bind and loose in Heaven - not just Peter ("ye" is plural))

Galatians 2:9 And when James, Cephas, and John , who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
(James is listed before Peter (=Cephas), so James and not Peter was the leader)

Galatians 2:11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
Galatians 2:12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
Galatians 2:13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
Galatians 2:14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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