For those that have debated with me...
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27-06-2012, 09:04 AM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
(27-06-2012 08:56 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(27-06-2012 08:31 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  I am actually quite skeptical. I've admitted that my belief makes no logical sense; however, I can't deny it: based on my experience.
Maybe, but you are not applying your skepticism to your experience.
Consider optical illusions or conjurer's tricks. One's experience of these viewed uncritically leads one to false beliefs. They are tricks played on the brain by the brain.
I suggest your religious experience is in that category.

I've honestly tried that.

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27-06-2012, 09:05 AM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
This is how i often look at the Bible or any book:

1. How accurate is the source of information for that book?

2. What was the persons intent for writing the book?

3. How trustworthy is the person who wrote it?

4. How many hands has the information been past through before the final product was produced?
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27-06-2012, 09:16 AM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
(27-06-2012 09:04 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(27-06-2012 08:56 AM)Chas Wrote:  Maybe, but you are not applying your skepticism to your experience.
Consider optical illusions or conjurer's tricks. One's experience of these viewed uncritically leads one to false beliefs. They are tricks played on the brain by the brain.
I suggest your religious experience is in that category.

I've honestly tried that.
You haven't tried hard enough. You have let the pleasure of feeling special (elect) overwhelm your skepticism.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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27-06-2012, 09:19 AM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
(27-06-2012 09:16 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(27-06-2012 09:04 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  I've honestly tried that.
You haven't tried hard enough. You have let the pleasure of feeling special (elect) overwhelm your skepticism.

No.

The fact that I suddenly started believing in a God overwhelmed my skepticism.

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27-06-2012, 09:28 AM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
(27-06-2012 09:19 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(27-06-2012 09:16 AM)Chas Wrote:  You haven't tried hard enough. You have let the pleasure of feeling special (elect) overwhelm your skepticism.

No.

The fact that I suddenly started believing in a God overwhelmed my skepticism.
And you are not skeptical about this sudden sense of belief. QED.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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27-06-2012, 09:12 PM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
(27-06-2012 09:19 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(27-06-2012 09:16 AM)Chas Wrote:  
The fact that I suddenly started believing in a God overwhelmed my skepticism.

That would be the equivalent of someone becoming an atheist because they suddenly started not believing in god and that overwhelmed their lack of skepticism (e.g. faith).

Impulse is not a good vehicle for arriving at one's beliefs in my opinion.

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28-06-2012, 04:08 AM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
I think most of your reasoning is based on inductive thinking and maybe you need to lean more about inductive versus deductive reasoning.

We all use inductive thinking a lot more then deductive thinking in everyday life and it has it's place in the thinking process but when you know that your beliefs make no logical sense you should start to deconstruct the inductive process and try and rebuild it deductively.

If you can't find deductive reasons for your arguments that are valid then it's time to stat removing that belief from your everyday inductive system. I think Egor's statements are totally false by the way.

All Atheists do is make the claim that evidence and reason are important to them few make the statement that Atheists are more reasonable people. Even if they did Atheists are not bound to a set of core beliefs so you can't make any claims at all about the entire group other then a lack of belief in a deity.

Theists on the other hand have a set of core beliefs (Christ was the son of god who died for us and rose again for example) that are by all methods invalid and irrational. The only claim I've seen made is the claim that some of the core tenets of Christianity are irrational.

That and Egor can scream until he's blue in the face about how we deny anything beyond the physical realm but if that was the case why on earth would we have ever experimented with bacteria or atoms or anything else we can't touch or see or hear?

Face it your out to lunch on the claim that people who value science won't explore what they can't see for themselves.
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28-06-2012, 04:16 AM (This post was last modified: 28-06-2012 07:10 AM by Mark Fulton.)
RE: For those that have debated with me...
(27-06-2012 09:01 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  
(27-06-2012 06:46 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Hi KC...good on you for be willing to cop some criticism. Here's some more, seeing you asked for it.

People like your good self no FUCK ALL about the origins of your beliefs.

I actually know and understand a good bit. But, thanks.
No you don't. You don't know how much you don't know. Thank me by learning, and not indoctrinating the next generation.

ps...thanks everyone for letting me get away with "no," instead of "know." lol
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28-06-2012, 04:18 AM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
(27-06-2012 09:05 AM)Flying Spaghetti Monster Wrote:  This is how i often look at the Bible or any book:

1. How accurate is the source of information for that book?

2. What was the persons intent for writing the book?

3. How trustworthy is the person who wrote it?

4. How many hands has the information been past through before the final product was produced?
Bingo! Go straight to the top of the class. Tell KC, he don't get it.
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28-06-2012, 01:01 PM
RE: For those that have debated with me...
When one debates reality vs fantasy, I don't think you can really call that a debate.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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