Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
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07-02-2016, 06:43 PM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(07-02-2016 04:09 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  
(07-02-2016 03:14 PM)Stevil Wrote:  What if there is only one school in town (run by Catholics) and a gay person is qualified as a teacher, but they won't hire him because he is gay. Does he have to move to another town, or state, or country?

Dude should have thought about that in advance. As an atheist, I also wouldn't expect to be hired by a catholic school. Was life supposed to be fair?
A catholic school will hire atheists, they won't hire gays.
So if many schools become Catholic schools then there are far less employment opportunities for gays, especially trained teachers who are gay.

Life isn't supposed to be fair, but a ruling government does have a responsibility to make sure that society is somewhat safe.

Bigotry breeds hatred, violence, poverty and desperation. These things can cause much danger in society.

But in saying this, Catholic churches have been allowed to operate schools in many countries and enforce their bigotry for many years and society hasn't fallen apart. Do we give Catholic churches special privileges or do we allow anyone to come up with discriminate policies? Perhaps we should allow schools just for whites, schools just for blacks, schools just for heterosexuals, schools where the principle and board are to be male only... and see where that gets us.
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07-02-2016, 08:57 PM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(07-02-2016 06:23 PM)cactus Wrote:  I like this one:
[Image: gaywedding.jpg]

Mate that's a World Championship wrestling cake. Big Grin

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
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08-02-2016, 12:43 AM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(07-02-2016 06:43 PM)Stevil Wrote:  see where that gets us.

Where that gets you is de facto apartheid. Matt, do you have a concrete plan for what happens when businesses discriminate and don't go under? When in contrast, they flourish. When the business interests in a town are all owned by (for example) people of one ethnicity, all of whom like to discriminate? You say the free market will sort such situations out but we know historically that it doesn't, so what magic formula will you apply to human nature to make it happen *this time*?

What the fuck is wrong with laws to ensure that all people get treated fairly regardless of the stupid business owner's personal preference? You claim that we're riding roughshod over the poor business owners personal freedoms but the point is *a business is not personal*. It is NOT his or her freedom to discriminate when operating a business that serves the public.

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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08-02-2016, 01:08 AM (This post was last modified: 08-02-2016 01:27 AM by Thumpalumpacus.)
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(06-02-2016 04:11 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  There's no right or wrong answer to this.

Some people want to let businesses decide who they want to business with and other don't, simple as that. It's just a matter of preference, can we at least all agree on that?

In America, it's a matter of Federal law. Many businesses are not allowed to discriminate in doing business, and that is not a matter of preference, so no, I can't agree that it's "just a matter of preference", myself.

The way I read that portion of the CRA 1964, if a business is based on interstate commerce, it falls under that law. There are also many state laws regulating the practice of discrimination in business, and even though I do have libertarian leanings, I think that the freedom to be free of bigotry trumps the freedom to violate said laws.

If you don't like those laws, work to change them. Let us know how that works out for you.

(06-02-2016 05:16 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  I'm just saying that laws are based on preference.

In that case, I prefer to have all members of society to have equal access to services, in order to prevent the social disturbances which such systemic discrimination almost invariably brings about.
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08-02-2016, 01:17 AM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(06-02-2016 11:43 PM)morondog Wrote:  
(06-02-2016 10:03 PM)Fireball Wrote:  Gotcha. So he starts up on a rant even with no darker people around. No

A lot of bigots will do that *only* if there are no black / gay / whatever-their-bigotry-is people around. They look and see a white woman and think "She's safe, it's a small town, she must be as fucking racist as me, I'll vent". Happens to me quite often here.

(06-02-2016 11:50 PM)Anjele Wrote:  That's exactly what the situation was. I am white therefore I must hold the same prejudices he does.

I am sure he is also a Christian and figured I am too. Dodgy

The same thing happened with me living in California. When people found out I was from Texas, out came the racial slurs ... they assumed I was a safe audience.
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08-02-2016, 01:27 AM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(07-02-2016 04:09 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  Was life supposed to be fair?

No ... but people are.
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08-02-2016, 01:43 AM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(08-02-2016 01:27 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  
(07-02-2016 04:09 PM)Matt Finney Wrote:  Was life supposed to be fair?

No ... but people are.

Laws are. At least, if one subscribes to those so-great enlightenment ideals like "freedom". Dodgy

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(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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08-02-2016, 02:02 AM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(08-02-2016 01:43 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(08-02-2016 01:27 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  No ... but people are.

Laws are. At least, if one subscribes to those so-great enlightenment ideals like "freedom". Dodgy

There's that whole "... of the people, by the people, for the people" thing [emphasis added] too, although that clearly doesn't carry much significance with some folks.
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08-02-2016, 02:56 AM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(08-02-2016 01:43 AM)morondog Wrote:  
(08-02-2016 01:27 AM)Thumpalumpacus Wrote:  No ... but people are.

Laws are. At least, if one subscribes to those so-great enlightenment ideals like "freedom". Dodgy

Freedom costs money dude. $$$$$$$$$$ = Freedom.

That's why the sand people are broke and under dictatorships. Usually paid for by $$$$$$ from a richer country.

Have I never mentioned Rome on this forum??? Big Grin Big Grin Big Grin

"Banjo, STFU about Rome!"

But it's the history of the world.

"Yeah yeah yeah. Stupid fuck!"

Big Grin

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
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08-02-2016, 03:11 AM
RE: Forcing christian bakers to bake gay cakes is wrong
(08-02-2016 02:56 AM)Banjo Wrote:  
(08-02-2016 01:43 AM)morondog Wrote:  Laws are. At least, if one subscribes to those so-great enlightenment ideals like "freedom". Dodgy

Freedom costs money dude. $$$$$$$$$$ = Freedom.

That's why the sand people are broke and under dictatorships. Usually paid for by $$$$$$ from a richer country.

Who then get their... do Arabs wear knickers... their undergarments in a bunch and get diagnosed with being chronically violent and deserving of repression by the freedom loving societies who paid for the dictatorship.

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
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