Free will?
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09-01-2018, 09:55 PM
RE: Free will?
(09-01-2018 03:50 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(09-01-2018 12:50 PM)elsie1901 Wrote:  What's your rebuttal to the whole "free will" concept?

It seems dubious at best based on all available evidence - Neuroscience of Free Will. ... Just more woo flotsam and jetsom.

Quote:Dennett insists that many important and common conceptions of "free will" are compatible with the emerging evidence from neuroscience

Specifically, free will as moral competence...




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10-01-2018, 07:36 PM
RE: Free will?
(09-01-2018 12:50 PM)elsie1901 Wrote:  What's your rebuttal to the whole "free will" concept?...

Why have you couched your question in terms of "rebuttal"? Presumably you believe that free will does exist, and that you're asking us to provide evidence supporting the opposite?

So I'll ask you whether or not you really do believe free will exists, or it doesn't, before I answer your question.

I'm a creationist... I believe that man created God.
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10-01-2018, 10:49 PM
RE: Free will?
It doesn't matter whether we have a real choice or not. If it turns out we don't, nothing has been lost.

It's not even possible to "try to act as if we have no choice". That's a contradiction in terms. It involves making a choice, towards what we somehow think would be the consequence of having no choice. We could, of course, actually have no choice, and part of that is some hilarious ironic attempt to ape ourselves. But if we have a choice, we're choosing.

It's a tricky subject because almost all language and trains of thought take some form of free-will as a given. For any kind of moral debate, it's impossible to proceed without making this assumption. And again, we lose nothing if it's wrong.

I have a website here which discusses the issues and terminology surrounding religion and atheism. It's hopefully user friendly to all.
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11-01-2018, 10:48 AM
RE: Free will?
(09-01-2018 12:50 PM)elsie1901 Wrote:  What's your rebuttal to the whole "free will" concept? I'm having trouble fully understanding what exactly it is in the first place... But it just seems like a big fat miserable excuse as to "why there's evil in the world".

The consequences of sin, according to the same theologies the spout free will as an excuse, are:
evil
disease
natural disasters
painful childbirth
poverty
etc.

These things would supposedly not exist if complete free will was not allowed simply by God making sinning not an option.

Those who state free will as an acceptable justification for those things are actually saying those things are worth enduring just so that we still have the choice to sin. But why is a choice to sin so important? I don't think they really understand what they are saying.

Fox News: Praying Preying on ignorance since 1996.
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14-04-2018, 02:03 AM
RE: Free will?
(09-01-2018 09:55 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(09-01-2018 03:50 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  It seems dubious at best based on all available evidence - Neuroscience of Free Will. ... Just more woo flotsam and jetsom.

Quote:Dennett insists that many important and common conceptions of "free will" are compatible with the emerging evidence from neuroscience

Specifically, free will as moral competence...




I agree with you so thats why I'm a slave of my own free will.

Atheism is a method of accepting biblical facts by the use of scientific approach.
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14-04-2018, 02:22 AM
RE: Free will?
(09-01-2018 12:50 PM)elsie1901 Wrote:  What's your rebuttal to the whole "free will" concept? I'm having trouble fully understanding what exactly it is in the first place... But it just seems like a big fat miserable excuse as to "why there's evil in the world".

1. Welcome to the forums

2. I think I"m starting to like you already! Thumbsup

3. Pretty much what everyone above said, I don't have much more I could add to this discussion but I'm enjoying it all the same.

DLJ Wrote:And, yes, the principle of freedom of expression works both ways... if someone starts shit, better shit is the best counter-argument.
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14-04-2018, 03:52 AM
RE: Free will?
(14-04-2018 02:03 AM)347eat Wrote:  
(09-01-2018 09:55 PM)DLJ Wrote:  Specifically, free will as moral competence...




I agree with you so thats why I'm a slave of my own free will.

That's an oblique but accurate way of putting it.

And bear this in mind... you are also the slave of my free will.

Believe it, you have no choice.

Evil_monster

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14-04-2018, 04:05 AM
RE: Free will?
A spiritualist perspective would be that we are all GOD or at least apart of GOD we are the creator of everything it’s just we’ve been brainwashed into believing we are not one that we are individuals separate from everything. Spiritualism suggests this is not true that we are all just multiple perceptions of the same entity there is no GOOD or EVIL only polar opposites of the same energy. And because we are perspectives of the same GOD ( or as I call it energy of the universe) then we display our multiple behavious as humans wether we perceive it as GOOD or BAD is merely the way our brains label everything like it was taught to do.
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14-04-2018, 04:49 AM
RE: Free will?
(14-04-2018 03:52 AM)DLJ Wrote:  
(14-04-2018 02:03 AM)347eat Wrote:  I agree with you so thats why I'm a slave of my own free will.

That's an oblique but accurate way of putting it.

And bear this in mind... you are also the slave of my free will.

Believe it, you have no choice.

Evil_monster

I believe in you. That applies to everyone with no exception Smile

Atheism is a method of accepting biblical facts by the use of scientific approach.
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14-04-2018, 05:17 AM
RE: Free will?
(14-04-2018 04:05 AM)Kie Wrote:  A spiritualist perspective would be that we are all GOD or at least apart of GOD we are the creator of everything it’s just we’ve been brainwashed into believing we are not one that we are individuals separate from everything. Spiritualism suggests this is not true that we are all just multiple perceptions of the same entity there is no GOOD or EVIL only polar opposites of the same energy. And because we are perspectives of the same GOD ( or as I call it energy of the universe) then we display our multiple behavious as humans wether we perceive it as GOOD or BAD is merely the way our brains label everything like it was taught to do.

Too bad for spiritualists that there isn't any good reason to believe any of that.

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