Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
24-11-2017, 01:01 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 12:20 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  


I happened upon this site while looking up a scriptural reference for my Sunday school class. Since this is a 'thinking' group, I will presume that all are functioning under the fact that it is not within anyone's power to persuade those set in their beliefs, who do not wish to be persuaded in any other direction. With this as a foundation of thought, my only purpose is to expose other 'thinking minds' a distinct foundation of Knowledge different from their own. My years of study to gain understanding on the vocation of my Faith in God my Eternal Father and His Son Jesus Christ, have afforded me great personal revelation from which to draw from and I give gratitude and Glory to Him for these gifts. The post by 'TheInquisition' stated he was wondering in the Scripture Genesis 3:22, about the use of the word, 'us'. The numerous times these ancient, personal journals, which we call the Bible, were translated and reformatted, (most note worth for this was Constantine), its easily understood why so much of it is difficult to understand or flat out doesn't make sense. The most difficult parts are of written visions and dreams which ancient people's had of our day and their attempt to try to describe those things without a context to draw from. Outside of these translative difficulties... 'us' is a straight translation. It means 'us', 'we', more than 'just me' or 'just I'. There are 'Lords' many and 'Gods' many in the Divine Order of creation. Gods with a little 'g'.... as 'godhood' is a state of mastery. When 'God', with a big 'G', said to those who where with Him, who were those who had participated in the creation of this universe; when He said of Adam and Eve 'the man is become as one of us', this is a reference to 'Knowledge', the eating of that tree was the key that unlocked their understanding, as is indicated by the rest of the scripture. There were 2 trees in the garden. The Tree of Life, meaning 'eternal life' and the Tree of 'the Knowledge of good and evil' . Which one did they eat of? The tree that gave them Knowledge. This is the short answer. No truly reflective 'thinker' can dissuade from our life's body of evidence, that Knowledge is what is required to progress, to advance... in this world or any world... neither in any estate or educative institution, be that one of brick and mortar or the gray matter of the human mind. It was the necessary step to 'start the ball rolling' in this 2nd stage of our progression called 'Mortality'.

Welcome to TTA.

That didn't really explain the "us" though, did it?

Anyway, good luck with the sermon. I'm hoping that you are using Genesis references for and as metaphor.

Would hate to think that you would stoop so low as to lie to children.

Yes

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like DLJ's post
24-11-2017, 01:21 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 12:20 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  With this as a foundation of thought, my only purpose is to expose other 'thinking minds' a distinct foundation of Knowledge different from their own. My years of study to gain understanding on the vocation of my Faith in God my Eternal Father and His Son Jesus Christ, have afforded me great personal revelation from which to draw from and I give gratitude and Glory to Him for these gifts.

Personal revelation and faith are demonstrably unreliable as paths to knowledge about things that actually exist. The thousands of different, conflicting god claims and complete lack of evidence for any of them shows that none can be rationally accepted no matter how confident any believer feels in their own particular version.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like unfogged's post
24-11-2017, 02:06 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 12:20 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  


I happened upon this site while looking up a scriptural reference for my Sunday school class. Since this is a 'thinking' group, I will presume that all are functioning under the fact that it is not within anyone's power to persuade those set in their beliefs, who do not wish to be persuaded in any other direction. With this as a foundation of thought, my only purpose is to expose other 'thinking minds' a distinct foundation of Knowledge different from their own. My years of study to gain understanding on the vocation of my Faith in God my Eternal Father and His Son Jesus Christ, have afforded me great personal revelation from which to draw from and I give gratitude and Glory to Him for these gifts. The post by 'TheInquisition' stated he was wondering in the Scripture Genesis 3:22, about the use of the word, 'us'. The numerous times these ancient, personal journals, which we call the Bible, were translated and reformatted, (most note worth for this was Constantine), its easily understood why so much of it is difficult to understand or flat out doesn't make sense. The most difficult parts are of written visions and dreams which ancient people's had of our day and their attempt to try to describe those things without a context to draw from. Outside of these translative difficulties... 'us' is a straight translation. It means 'us', 'we', more than 'just me' or 'just I'. There are 'Lords' many and 'Gods' many in the Divine Order of creation. Gods with a little 'g'.... as 'godhood' is a state of mastery. When 'God', with a big 'G', said to those who where with Him, who were those who had participated in the creation of this universe; when He said of Adam and Eve 'the man is become as one of us', this is a reference to 'Knowledge', the eating of that tree was the key that unlocked their understanding, as is indicated by the rest of the scripture. There were 2 trees in the garden. The Tree of Life, meaning 'eternal life' and the Tree of 'the Knowledge of good and evil' . Which one did they eat of? The tree that gave them Knowledge. This is the short answer. No truly reflective 'thinker' can dissuade from our life's body of evidence, that Knowledge is what is required to progress, to advance... in this world or any world... neither in any estate or educative institution, be that one of brick and mortar or the gray matter of the human mind. It was the necessary step to 'start the ball rolling' in this 2nd stage of our progression called 'Mortality'.

Provide evidence of this nonsense. Hint: The bible isn't evidence, it's a claim.

There sure are a lot of fruit cakes this time of year

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like dancefortwo's post
24-11-2017, 03:04 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 12:20 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  My years of study to gain understanding on the vocation of my Faith in God my Eternal Father and His Son Jesus Christ, have afforded me great personal revelation pulling stuff from my ass from which to draw from and I give gratitude and Glory to Him for these gifts. like to brag on forums about how great I am.

Fixed it for ya!

Gods derive their power from post-hoc rationalizations. -The Inquisition

Using the supernatural to explain events in your life is a failure of the intellect to comprehend the world around you. -The Inquisition
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like TheInquisition's post
24-11-2017, 03:26 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 12:20 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  
Since this is a 'thinking' group, I will presume that all are functioning under the fact that it is not within anyone's power to persuade those set in their beliefs, who do not wish to be persuaded in any other direction.

Just the reverse actually. We are a thinking group exactly because we have questioned our own assumptions and continue to challenge other people's assumptions as well, regardless of what we or they might prefer to believe.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 7 users Like Thoreauvian's post
24-11-2017, 04:50 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 02:06 PM)dancefortwo Wrote:  
(24-11-2017 12:20 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  


I happened upon this site while looking up a scriptural reference for my Sunday school class. Since this is a 'thinking' group, I will presume that all are functioning under the fact that it is not within anyone's power to persuade those set in their beliefs, who do not wish to be persuaded in any other direction. With this as a foundation of thought, my only purpose is to expose other 'thinking minds' a distinct foundation of Knowledge different from their own. My years of study to gain understanding on the vocation of my Faith in God my Eternal Father and His Son Jesus Christ, have afforded me great personal revelation from which to draw from and I give gratitude and Glory to Him for these gifts. The post by 'TheInquisition' stated he was wondering in the Scripture Genesis 3:22, about the use of the word, 'us'. The numerous times these ancient, personal journals, which we call the Bible, were translated and reformatted, (most note worth for this was Constantine), its easily understood why so much of it is difficult to understand or flat out doesn't make sense. The most difficult parts are of written visions and dreams which ancient people's had of our day and their attempt to try to describe those things without a context to draw from. Outside of these translative difficulties... 'us' is a straight translation. It means 'us', 'we', more than 'just me' or 'just I'. There are 'Lords' many and 'Gods' many in the Divine Order of creation. Gods with a little 'g'.... as 'godhood' is a state of mastery. When 'God', with a big 'G', said to those who where with Him, who were those who had participated in the creation of this universe; when He said of Adam and Eve 'the man is become as one of us', this is a reference to 'Knowledge', the eating of that tree was the key that unlocked their understanding, as is indicated by the rest of the scripture. There were 2 trees in the garden. The Tree of Life, meaning 'eternal life' and the Tree of 'the Knowledge of good and evil' . Which one did they eat of? The tree that gave them Knowledge. This is the short answer. No truly reflective 'thinker' can dissuade from our life's body of evidence, that Knowledge is what is required to progress, to advance... in this world or any world... neither in any estate or educative institution, be that one of brick and mortar or the gray matter of the human mind. It was the necessary step to 'start the ball rolling' in this 2nd stage of our progression called 'Mortality'.

Provide evidence of this nonsense. Hint: The bible isn't evidence, it's a claim.

There sure are a lot of fruit cakes this time of year

I'm going to keep a tally, this is #2 just today, no wonder they call it Black Friday.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-11-2017, 06:06 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 01:01 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(24-11-2017 12:20 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  


I happened upon this site while looking up a scriptural reference for my Sunday school class. Since this is a 'thinking' group, I will presume that all are functioning under the fact that it is not within anyone's power to persuade those set in their beliefs, who do not wish to be persuaded in any other direction. With this as a foundation of thought, my only purpose is to expose other 'thinking minds' a distinct foundation of Knowledge different from their own. My years of study to gain understanding on the vocation of my Faith in God my Eternal Father and His Son Jesus Christ, have afforded me great personal revelation from which to draw from and I give gratitude and Glory to Him for these gifts. The post by 'TheInquisition' stated he was wondering in the Scripture Genesis 3:22, about the use of the word, 'us'. The numerous times these ancient, personal journals, which we call the Bible, were translated and reformatted, (most note worth for this was Constantine), its easily understood why so much of it is difficult to understand or flat out doesn't make sense. The most difficult parts are of written visions and dreams which ancient people's had of our day and their attempt to try to describe those things without a context to draw from. Outside of these translative difficulties... 'us' is a straight translation. It means 'us', 'we', more than 'just me' or 'just I'. There are 'Lords' many and 'Gods' many in the Divine Order of creation. Gods with a little 'g'.... as 'godhood' is a state of mastery. When 'God', with a big 'G', said to those who where with Him, who were those who had participated in the creation of this universe; when He said of Adam and Eve 'the man is become as one of us', this is a reference to 'Knowledge', the eating of that tree was the key that unlocked their understanding, as is indicated by the rest of the scripture. There were 2 trees in the garden. The Tree of Life, meaning 'eternal life' and the Tree of 'the Knowledge of good and evil' . Which one did they eat of? The tree that gave them Knowledge. This is the short answer. No truly reflective 'thinker' can dissuade from our life's body of evidence, that Knowledge is what is required to progress, to advance... in this world or any world... neither in any estate or educative institution, be that one of brick and mortar or the gray matter of the human mind. It was the necessary step to 'start the ball rolling' in this 2nd stage of our progression called 'Mortality'.

Welcome to TTA.

That didn't really explain the "us" though, did it?

Anyway, good luck with the sermon. I'm hoping that you are using Genesis references for and as metaphor.

Would hate to think that you would stoop so low as to lie to children.

Yes

Actually it did. Seeing as you had a difficult time comprehending what you read, I went back to highlight it for you. It will be in blue.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-11-2017, 06:21 PM (This post was last modified: 24-11-2017 06:40 PM by Alchemy Begins.)
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(29-12-2014 09:21 AM)Free Wrote:  
(29-12-2014 08:35 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  "The man has now become like one of us" (Genesis 3:22) is a quote attributed to god in the Genesis myth, but I was wondering how the word "us" is actually being used here.

I realized how this myth can be interpreted not as a choice that a man makes to disobey god, but as a warning from the writers of the myth, the priests, scribes and the educated elite of that era.

Do not try to seek real knowledge, because "you will become like one of us".

Is this an actual call out to those that would see past their myth and realize that they were not telling the truth?

It seems like a reasonable point of view to me, the phrase "The man has now become like one of us" is peculiar because it admits that god is not alone, he's part of a pantheon, but it makes more sense when interpreted to mean that the scribes and priests that constructed this myth were simply advising those that don't believe their myth that they would be cast out of their ignorant bliss and become like one of them.

They would know that these tales were created for controlling the ignorant masses, but you also wouldn't be allowed into their scholarly pantheon.

Best to believe and stay in your blissful garden of ignorance.

So what do you think?

Right off the bat, in the very first verse of Genesis, in Gen 1:1, you will see the following:

Gen 1:1 - "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth."

However, when we look at the words closely in the ancient Hebrew, the word "God" is written as "Elohim," which is actually plural. Therefore...

Gen 1:1 - "In the beginning the gods created the heavens and the earth."

The Jews find this to be extremely embarrassing and prefer to not even discuss it. They cannot change the text one iota as per their beliefs, and therefore they are stuck with it.

This is precisely why you see in Gen 1:26 - And God said, Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness.

Even in Gen 1:26 the word "God" is again "Elohim," plural meaning "the gods." Hence ...

Gen 1:26 And the gods said, Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness.

The problem the Jews have with all this is obvious; they proclaim monotheism yet their most ancient religious record clearly demonstrates polytheism, and it does it right on the very first verse of Gen 1:1.

Correct, Elohim is not the name of God, it is an achieved level of mastery. It would be more correct to say 'The Elohim' as in a group of 'achieved individuals'. Similar to one saying the Generals or the Professors. The Elohim are those men and women who have been through our same level of existence as we a doing on this Earth. They 'passed this mortal class' and continued to the next stages of progression until they to have gained a mastery of the knowledge that is required to do as God's or the Elohim do. Understanding that there are many gods is different from the acknowledgement and worship of the God who is our Father. A brief parallel... I have many men in my life who are all 'fathers', yet they are not my Dad, and he is the only one I give my Fathers day card to, similarily to monotheistic form of worship . At the same time this does not negate any other Fathers, 'Fatherhood'.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
24-11-2017, 06:30 PM
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 06:21 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  Correct, Elohim is not the name of God, it is an achieved level of mastery. It would be more correct to say 'The Elohim' as in a group of achieve individuals. Similar to one saying the Generals or the Professors. The Elohim are those men and women who have been through our same level of existence as we a doing on this Earth. They 'passed this mortal class' and continued to the next stages of progression until they to have gained a mastery of the knowledge that is required to do as God's or the Elohim do. Understanding that there are many gods is different from the acknowledgement and worship of the God who is our Father. A brief parallel as, I have many men in my life who are all fathers, yet they are not my Dad, and he is the only one I give my Fathers day card to. .

Do you have any evidence for any of this? Why should your interpretation be accepted over the simpler explanation that this started out as just another imaginary pantheon?

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
America July 4 1776 - November 8 2016 RIP
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 2 users Like unfogged's post
24-11-2017, 06:42 PM (This post was last modified: 24-11-2017 07:54 PM by dancefortwo.)
RE: Genesis-The man has now become like one of us?
(24-11-2017 06:21 PM)Alchemy Begins Wrote:  
(29-12-2014 09:21 AM)Free Wrote:  Right off the bat, in the very first verse of Genesis, in Gen 1:1, you will see the following:

Gen 1:1 - "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth."

However, when we look at the words closely in the ancient Hebrew, the word "God" is written as "Elohim," which is actually plural. Therefore...

Gen 1:1 - "In the beginning the gods created the heavens and the earth."

The Jews find this to be extremely embarrassing and prefer to not even discuss it. They cannot change the text one iota as per their beliefs, and therefore they are stuck with it.

This is precisely why you see in Gen 1:26 - And God said, Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness.

Even in Gen 1:26 the word "God" is again "Elohim," plural meaning "the gods." Hence ...

Gen 1:26 And the gods said, Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness.

The problem the Jews have with all this is obvious; they proclaim monotheism yet their most ancient religious record clearly demonstrates polytheism, and it does it right on the very first verse of Gen 1:1.

Correct, Elohim is not the name of God, it is an achieved level of mastery. It would be more correct to say 'The Elohim' as in a group of 'achieved individuals'. Similar to one saying the Generals or the Professors. The Elohim are those men and women who have been through our same level of existence as we a doing on this Earth. They 'passed this mortal class' and continued to the next stages of progression until they to have gained a mastery of the knowledge that is required to do as God's or the Elohim do. Understanding that there are many gods is different from the acknowledgement and worship of the God who is our Father. A brief parallel... I have many men in my life who are all 'fathers', yet they are not my Dad, and he is the only one I give my Fathers day card to, similarily to monotheistic form of worship . At the same time this does not negate any other Fathers, 'Fatherhood'.

What the hell are you blathering on about? <----This should be read in the best Monty Python-ish voice possible.

Shakespeare's Comedy of Errors.... on Donald J. Trump:

He is deformed, crooked, old, and sere,
Ill-fac’d, worse bodied, shapeless every where;
Vicious, ungentle, foolish, blunt, unkind,
Stigmatical in making, worse in mind.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes dancefortwo's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: