Get out of my country
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28-08-2015, 08:41 PM
RE: Get out of my country
Look, Alla, I realize you (like every Ukranian I have met) were traumatized by the Soviet regime's legacy, but you do not have your facts straight, and your comparisons are bunk. Let go of your hate.

You're not entirely wrong that people here are "afraid" to be called socialists, but that has a lot to do with deliberate propaganda from the super-wealthy that has misled people into understanding what socialism in the modern/European context really means. I actually admire Sanders for not running away from the word, but I know it will get him creamed by hordes of people who don't (or won't) understand the distinction.

And I don't disagree with you that government is corrupt in many ways, and that the government is currently controlled by wealthy elites and those who serve them, but that is not a reason to say the government should not be in charge of things. When they do a bad job, we can (even if we rarely do) throw them out in the next election, and replace them with someone better for us; if we leave it to private enterprise, the only recourse we have is the lawsuit, and that just hands power to whomever can hire the best lawyers (hint: it's not the average Joe).

I have already pointed out for you one direct benefit that the ACA has given me, where private insurance completely failed me, before. In reply, you answered with the "cannot keep their plans/doctors" thing, a Fox propaganda that has been fully debunked, as you have already been shown-- yet you keep saying it!

I'll make it very simple for you: the people who "could not keep their plans/doctors" were the people who had REALLY SHITTY coverage that did not meet the standards required under the law, a condition that is known as being under-insured.

You (and Fox) are trying to imply that this means the government lied, and we're all subject to having our coverage forcibly changed. Wrong. Every one of the other things you said is a result of similarly misleading propaganda. For someone who comes from a Soviet-bloc region, I'm surprised you're so susceptible to propaganda.

People asked you to cite your sources for your assertions about the ACA, but you did not. You just threw them out there like they're true, when they're provably wrong, and you repeat them again anyway.

What kind of person DOES that?

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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28-08-2015, 08:55 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 08:41 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  People asked you to cite your sources for your assertions about the ACA, but you did not. You just threw them out there like they're true, when they're provably wrong, and you repeat them again anyway.

What kind of person DOES that?

An ignorant, indoctrinated, delusional one? Consider

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28-08-2015, 09:01 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 08:41 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  For someone who comes from a Soviet-bloc region, I'm surprised you're so susceptible to propaganda.

USSR obviously didn't encourage free thinking. Countries freed after it's fall also weren't so much interested in truth but rather with narrative that will be useful to them.

According to Zarys historii historiografii polskiej* and Upadek komunizmu i historiografia [w:] Historycy polscy i ukraińscy wobec problemów XX wieku*
there is much of historical literarute that is just soviet propaganda in reverse, which considering situation may not be surprising.

In short being from Soviet-bloc region does not mean that one is immune to propaganda. Such person probably is more suspectible to it as free thinking wasn't valued in USSR and neither is it valued in todays Poland and I suspect quite a few other countries of Eastern Europe.

*As far as I'm aware there is noe english version of these books.

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28-08-2015, 09:02 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 08:31 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I like that response. "4 years."

Also known as The Great Depression.

It was more like 10 years. The recovery began in 1933, but it only ended with the advent of World War II.

Of course, while WWII brought prosperity to U.S. industry, Europe and Japan didn't fare quite so well. No

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28-08-2015, 09:11 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 07:44 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(28-08-2015 07:36 PM)Alla Wrote:  I can't believe that Obama put us in such big debt.

Please refer to A few quick facts on US government debt. You sound silly and uninformed every time you say this.

Obama criticized Bush then he did the same what all CORRUPT politicians do.

When CORRUPT BIG government says: we have to "invest" in people it means only one thing: "let's squeeze all those idiots and waste more money".

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28-08-2015, 09:30 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 09:11 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(28-08-2015 07:44 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  Please refer to A few quick facts on US government debt. You sound silly and uninformed every time you say this.

Obama criticized Bush then he did the same what all CORRUPT politicians do.

When CORRUPT BIG government says: we have to "invest" in people it means only one thing: "let's squeeze all those idiots and waste more money".

Obama has increased the debt at half the rate Bush did. You didn't read Pappy's thread did you?

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28-08-2015, 09:34 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 08:41 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I actually admire Sanders for not running away from the word, but I know it will get him creamed by hordes of people who don't (or won't) understand the distinction.
And I respect him for not running from the word. I really do. I believe he is honest man and that he wants to help people. I really felt bad when he was rudely interrupted. That was not fair.
Even though I can't stand Warren I respect her for her fights against what she thinks is wrong. I think she is strong leader. I like strong leaders even if I disagree with them.
(28-08-2015 08:41 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  And I don't disagree with you that government is corrupt in many ways, and that the government is currently controlled by wealthy elites and those who serve them, but that is not a reason to say the government should not be in charge of things. When they do a bad job, we can (even if we rarely do) throw them out in the next election, and replace them with someone better for us; if we leave it to private enterprise, the only recourse we have is the lawsuit, and that just hands power to whomever can hire the best lawyers (hint: it's not the average Joe).
I agree with you. with every word you said. I think that people on both sides are tired of establishment.
(28-08-2015 08:41 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I have already pointed out for you one direct benefit that the ACA has given me, where private insurance completely failed me, before.
And I think I said that I believe you. I believe that there are people who benefit from it. Isn't it that EVERYBODY had to benefit from Obamacare?
(28-08-2015 08:41 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  I'll make it very simple for you: the people who "could not keep their plans/doctors" were the people who had REALLY SHITTY coverage that did not meet the standards required under the law, a condition that is known as being under-insured.
I have heard this argument. But under Obamacare not shitty coverage supposed to cost less. People were more happy with their affordable shitty coverage than with Obama's more expensive not shitty coverage.
Please tell me is this true or false:
1)under Obama people who lost their coverage have to pay more for new better coverage?
2)did people who were happy with their coverage knew that they will loose it and will be FORCED to have better but more expensive coverage?
3)did some people lost their doctors?
4)if yes, were they told by Obama that this will happen to them?
(28-08-2015 08:41 PM)RocketSurgeon76 Wrote:  People asked you to cite your sources for your assertions about the ACA, but you did not. You just threw them out there like they're true, when they're provably wrong, and you repeat them again anyway.

What kind of person DOES that?

Yes, it is true that I just threw words. Please answer my questions.

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28-08-2015, 09:36 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 09:30 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(28-08-2015 09:11 PM)Alla Wrote:  Obama criticized Bush then he did the same what all CORRUPT politicians do.

When CORRUPT BIG government says: we have to "invest" in people it means only one thing: "let's squeeze all those idiots and waste more money".

Obama has increased the debt at half the rate Bush did. You didn't read Pappy's thread did you?
OK it doesn't change the fact that Obama said:" it is irresponsible, it is unpatriotic". Did he talk about himself?

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28-08-2015, 09:43 PM
RE: Get out of my country
Alla, you did not even know about The Great Depression. You are too ignorant and should just go away. What is the point of debating such an ignorant person??? Anyone who does is wasting their time.
Seriously, go join the Dumb ass forum or something.

NOTE: Member, Tomasia uses this site to slander other individuals. He then later proclaims it a joke, but not in public.
I will call him a liar and a dog here and now.
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28-08-2015, 09:55 PM
RE: Get out of my country
(28-08-2015 09:43 PM)Banjo Wrote:  Alla, you did not even know about The Great Depression. You are too ignorant and should just go away. What is the point of debating such an ignorant person??? Anyone who does is wasting their time.
Seriously, go join the Dumb ass forum or something.
You are free not to read my posts. Seriously. Good-bye

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