God is Real: Worshippable?
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21-10-2012, 10:44 AM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
(21-10-2012 09:28 AM)Cardinal Smurf Wrote:  
(20-10-2012 05:35 PM)Chas Wrote:  I'd go sign up with Satan's minions to depose the evil prick.

But, didn't god make satan? Doesn't that make satan nothing more than a sock puppet? In fact, the Calvinist description of existence sounds to me like we all are sock puppets and this existence is nothing more than a puppet show for god. But why? How can it be entertaining if he already knows the ending? How can we be "companions" when we are just saying/doing exactly what he intended.

Yeah, sounds like a pointless existence to me. Revolution also would be pointless...he'd see it coming.

This is true however just because you can see it coming doesn't mean you can stop kt.
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21-10-2012, 11:02 AM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
Well,

I'd add God's existence to the list of things I know to be true and I'd adjust my worldview accordingly.

I don't think I'd be all pissed at God because at the heart of it, he'd just be a force in the universe, like gravity and sugar. I wouldn't bash my head against the wall too much because I'd be pretty sure I'd have less chance of eliminating God than I would eliminating electromagnetic radiation. I don't hate sharks for hunting and I wouldn't hate God for deciding what is good and what is evil, who lives and who dies and all the rest.

I think the notion that he's an abject prick deserving of our hate is a pretty culturally biased position and one that I neither understand nor share.

I think that my relationship with God would change, but I don't know if I'd join any particular religion. I'm pretty sure I'd make sure I wasn't going to burn in hell, but I'd bet good money that hell wouldn't be the Evangelical version Cool Bunch of nutters they are.

And on a totally personal note, I didn't grow up with an earthly father, so I think I'd be interested in cultivating a relationship with my heavenly one. Seems like he could be a cool guy if you got to know him. It'd probably be hard to get past the "damnit, he's forcing me to eat brussel sprouts" phase, but such is the parent child relationship.

I think that in the end, for me, I have a relationship with all of creation. If God is a part of that, so be it. I don't know that I'd currently call that relationship worship per se, although it certainly isn't some kind of blind fealty, but I believe very deeply in having loving sacred relationships with creation.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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21-10-2012, 11:12 AM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
(21-10-2012 11:02 AM)Ghost Wrote:  Well,

I'd add God's existence to the list of things I know to be true and I'd adjust my worldview accordingly.

I don't think I'd be all pissed at God because at the heart of it, he'd just be a force in the universe, like gravity and sugar. I wouldn't bash my head against the wall too much because I'd be pretty sure I'd have less chance of eliminating God than I would eliminating electromagnetic radiation. I don't hate sharks for hunting and I wouldn't hate God for deciding what is good and what is evil, who lives and who dies and all the rest.

I think the notion that he's an abject prick deserving of our hate is a pretty culturally biased position and one that I neither understand nor share.

I think that my relationship with God would change, but I don't know if I'd join any particular religion. I'm pretty sure I'd make sure I wasn't going to burn in hell, but I'd bet good money that hell wouldn't be the Evangelical version Cool Bunch of nutters they are.

And on a totally personal note, I didn't grow up with an earthly father, so I think I'd be interested in cultivating a relationship with my heavenly one. Seems like he could be a cool guy if you got to know him. It'd probably be hard to get past the "damnit, he's forcing me to eat brussel sprouts" phase, but such is the parent child relationship.

I think that in the end, for me, I have a relationship with all of creation. If God is a part of that, so be it. I don't know that I'd currently call that relationship worship per se, although it certainly isn't some kind of blind fealty, but I believe very deeply in having loving sacred relationships with creation.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt

Hey Ghostly-one,
I'm glad to read a rational response to this thread. I often hear/read atheists say that even if there was a god they would hate it and not worship it. That just seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face. The way the god of the bible is described, it's not an entity that one can face and go away unchanged. Sure, some may choose to arrogantly reject it, but what does that get you but an eternity in the Biblical trash heap o' fire? I think if I were faced with the majesty that is supposed to be god I would not be able to help myself but to fall to my knees in worship. If I could truly understand the power and ability of this entity, I would be filled with so much awe that such an amazing being would choose to love me and choose to spend eternity with me, passing along its power to my newly glorified body. Frankly, I really don't get the anger and angst that would lead someone to refuse such a being.

But unlike you, I am convinced this being does not and cannot exist, therefore I'm not too worried about being faced with the situation. Drinking Beverage

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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21-10-2012, 12:22 PM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
You guys make no sense whatsoever.

Don't hate a shark for hunting. That makes sense. I was talking about the God written about, including all of his acts of murder. Murder isn't hunting. Pretty sure it has nothing to do with hunger and more to do with ego, but whatever.

Also it isn't arrogant to turn away from God. To deny something that someone thinks is magnificent isn't arrogance, it's a difference of opinion.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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21-10-2012, 01:08 PM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
(21-10-2012 12:22 PM)lucradis Wrote:  You guys make no sense whatsoever.

Don't hate a shark for hunting. That makes sense. I was talking about the God written about, including all of his acts of murder. Murder isn't hunting. Pretty sure it has nothing to do with hunger and more to do with ego, but whatever.

Also it isn't arrogant to turn away from God. To deny something that someone thinks is magnificent isn't arrogance, it's a difference of opinion.

Yabut, you're wrong.

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
~Izel
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21-10-2012, 01:11 PM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
(21-10-2012 01:08 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(21-10-2012 12:22 PM)lucradis Wrote:  You guys make no sense whatsoever.

Don't hate a shark for hunting. That makes sense. I was talking about the God written about, including all of his acts of murder. Murder isn't hunting. Pretty sure it has nothing to do with hunger and more to do with ego, but whatever.

Also it isn't arrogant to turn away from God. To deny something that someone thinks is magnificent isn't arrogance, it's a difference of opinion.

Yabut, you're wrong.

Gee, another strong argument. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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21-10-2012, 01:57 PM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
Hey, Lucradis.

I think you missed my point.

I don't get angry at a shark for hunting because that's just what sharks do. I don't get mad at electromagnetic radiation for my vision, my microwave oven, electrocuting people or destroying the ozone layer because that's just what it does. I can't imagine myself getting angry at God for everything that God does, things I like and things I hate, because that's just what God does (keeping with the "hey, I exist" scenario).

My basic assumption is that God is essentially neutral and does what he does because he's a manager/steward. You seem to accuse him of malevolence and attribute it to a rapacious ego. I suppose that's the source of our disconnect.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt
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21-10-2012, 02:21 PM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
That's why I wrote, God that had been written about.
The God from the old testament was an angry God.

Anyway I'm fine with disagreeing. However I gotta ask, would you hate a guy who murdered your kids? You know even though it's what he does?

p.s. the android auto correct is fucking terrible.

"I think of myself as an intelligent, sensitive human being with the soul of a clown which always forces me to blow it at the most important moments." -Jim Morrison
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21-10-2012, 02:25 PM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
(21-10-2012 02:21 PM)lucradis Wrote:  p.s. the android auto correct is fucking terrible.

Terrible is such a slut...
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21-10-2012, 03:56 PM
RE: God is Real: Worshippable?
(21-10-2012 01:57 PM)Ghost Wrote:  Hey, Lucradis.

I think you missed my point.

I don't get angry at a shark for hunting because that's just what sharks do. I don't get mad at electromagnetic radiation for my vision, my microwave oven, electrocuting people or destroying the ozone layer because that's just what it does. I can't imagine myself getting angry at God for everything that God does, things I like and things I hate, because that's just what God does (keeping with the "hey, I exist" scenario).

My basic assumption is that God is essentially neutral and does what he does because he's a manager/steward. You seem to accuse him of malevolence and attribute it to a rapacious ego. I suppose that's the source of our disconnect.

Peace and Love and Empathy,

Matt

Poor analogies. Those things are not sentient. That makes all the difference.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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