God is love? Not in this Universe.
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10-07-2013, 06:38 PM (This post was last modified: 10-07-2013 07:53 PM by childeye.)
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 05:46 PM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  Childeye, I'm going to ask a set of questions to see a furthered explanation on your response to Starcrash. It will take a few replies back and forth but I think we can do this.

Okay, first question. It's a simple yes or no answer, but if you want to add anything to the answer afterwards, that's cool.

Quote:I appreciate your statement that I would do away with evil if given the power to do it.

Yes or no, would you do away with evil if you had the power to?
Yes I would do away with evil if I had the power to. Perhaps you and I even do have the power to do so in some capacity. However, I can also conceive that it is possible that evil could be done away with by doing nothing, since evil is not a Holy thing and therefore not eternal.
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10-07-2013, 07:42 PM (This post was last modified: 10-07-2013 10:19 PM by childeye.)
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 06:19 PM)cjlr Wrote:  Okay. You are aware of the existence of antisocial personality disorder, right? Such feelings (whatever their attribution) are not universal.
Yes I am aware of this. Such an occurrence I would see as a form of corruption.

(10-07-2013 05:50 PM)childeye Wrote:  God is Love and Love is not a moral belief or a religion or a superstition. Love is a real Spirit we all experience...

Quote:Okay. See above.
When I said Love is a Spirit we all experience, perhaps I should have added the caveat of we all experience this Love in either the results of it's presence or absence.

(10-07-2013 05:50 PM)childeye Wrote:  ... hence scripture ...

Quote:Whoa there. Back it on up. Scripture?

Feelings don't write scripture. What scripture (and what is scripture)?
By scripture I mean writings or testimonies about God. Humans write scriptures but the sentiments expressed are inspired by certain feelings or thoughts being conveyed.

(10-07-2013 05:50 PM)childeye Wrote:  says God is the Eternal Spirit of Love.

Quote:I am not aware of any well-known scripture that says that. Neither Christian, nor Muslim, nor Jewish, nor Hindu, nor Buddhist, nor Shinto, nor nothing. It's, at best, a statement firmly in the realm of shallow new age beliefs.

1 John 4:8
New International Version (NIV)
8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.
(2 Tim. 1:7). Our errand being one of grace, the Lord will hear us when we ask his presence in it. Now, his Spirit is not "the spirit of fear :" it is the "spirit of love, and of power, and of a sound mind"


(10-07-2013 05:50 PM)childeye Wrote:  Therefore, I have never said that people are willing to sacrifice themselves for their moral beliefs, even though that does occur in the world. I am saying that Love causes a person to will to sacrifice themselves for others.

Quote:In which case you make even less sense, because you haven't even presented a cogent definition of love. 'Love' doesn't cause things.
There are many instances where Love caused people to sacrifice them selves to save others. Here where I live, a man was shot and killed when he put his body in front of a gunman to protect a little girl. I think that was Love. I can see Love in many aspects, but mostly I describe Love as empathy.

Quote: Love is a collection of biochemical processes occurring in human beings which create a unique type of subjective experience. It may indeed be among the reasons one performs certain acts, up to and including self-sacrifice.
I am aware that there are those who believe Love is just a biochemical process. Certainly, there are things happening in the brain when one ponders certain thoughts or beliefs which produce emotions. However studies have also shown that Love or recognition of what is right and wrong behavior are also inherited genetically. Also psychopathy can be traced genetically. From what I understand the guy who shielded the little girl had only a split second of time to think about it.

(10-07-2013 05:50 PM)childeye Wrote:  The term "God" is just a word pertaining to the Highest moral authority. Nonetheless, God resides in each man who knows Love, even because He is Spirit.

Quote:Allowing, for the sake of argument, that there is a singular and universal morality - so what?

What are the consequences of this belief? People experience and react to their own feelings regardless.

It is my experience that what we believe to be true affects what we feel and therefore how we act. For example, there can be much fear generated in the unknown and lies can be introduced in uncertainty. A good example is the Travon Martin, George Zimmerman murder trial. An excellent example of where the unknowns and prejudices can result in unintended behaviors desires and outcomes that were all based upon ignorance. Actually you have touched on a very deep subject in Christianity concerning the saving power of the knowledge of God. I am rather reluctant to go too deep. But I will say there are many consequences of believing in God as the Love seen on the cross of the Christ. There is a Spirit that comes from believing in the True Image of God which is the Christ. A Line of reasoning proceeds on the premise that this is the True Character of God that cannot be overcome by any lie. That line of reasoning reveals all lies in hypocrisy.
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10-07-2013, 09:44 PM (This post was last modified: 10-07-2013 10:03 PM by childeye.)
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 10:41 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  No one said there was no love in the universe. Your post is irrelevant, and you are dishonestly attempting to change the subject, and assume definitions not in question.

I assume you are taking issue with my equating God with Love.
Quote:You perversely continue to attempt to redine the meanings of words, and IMPOSE YOUR personal, idiosyncratic meanings onto others, and onto others discussions, and dishonestly attempt to represent those false notions as the actual legitimate position(s) of theists. Either you are really a "heretic", (and your position lies out side that held by communities of believers), or you are simply utterly ignorant of their actual position(s).
Or your wrong and God is Love. Okay, so tell me how many theists do you know who have said God is not Love?

Quote:1. Your argument is bullshit by theological argument.
a. Colossians 3:14 : "And above all, put on love, the bond of perfection" ..
Please try and understand BuckyBall, I enjoy talking with you, but I don't want to get you mad at me. So I'm just honestly saying why I believe the way I do. In my view if you're wrong about God not existing and being Love, then you should be glad you are wrong and glad that God is real and is good. So please consider why I say this scripture only backs up what I am saying that God is Love and don't get mad. Look at Colossians 3:9-10 and let's get some perspective of why he says the words "above all put on love"( some translations have charity). In 3:9-10 he is talking about the change that takes place when one dies to one's self so as to live in Christ. This is expressed in terms of putting off the old man and putting on the new man. And the new man is renewed "in knowledge" after the "Image of Him" Who created him. Then he goes on describing the Character of God, as seen in the Image the Creator sent (The Christ), in 10:12-13. Please note that all of the attributes described in 10:12-13 are all done out of a pure Love.

Quote:Saul of Tarsus, (the founder of your cult) told you love was a VIRTUE, (the chief among many). He did NOT say "Love is the god"'.
Love is a virtue which is why he also said that the fruit of the Spirit is Love wherein he is conveying that if you are led by the Spirit of God you will Love.
Quote:b. Jebus told you "love the Lord your God with all you heart, soul, mind and strength. And the second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself."
He is not said to have said "Love is the deity".
He didn't say God is not Love and it is possible to Love Love with all your heart mind and soul.
Quote:c. In Romans 12:9, Saul said "Love must be sincere. Hate what is evil; cling to what is good. Be devoted to one another in brotherly love. Honor one another above yourselves." He did not say "Love is a deity".
This is all non sequitur.
Quote:d. If it makes any linguistic sense to say "I love the god" the emotion is not the deity, in your cult. In the Gospel of John he said "For anyone who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen. And he has given us this command: Whoever loves God must also love his brother".
They clearly are NOT the same concept, which is what you are attempting to assert.
Sorry, but you are mistaken. In spiritual understanding it is possible for God to be in us even while we are in Him. It is also possible therefore for Him to cause us to Love Him with sincere praise. That is why Jesus said, Yea; have ye never read, Out of the mouth of babes and sucklings thou hast perfected praise?

You are not quoting from the Gospel of John either by the way. You are quoting from 1 John 4:20. Ironically, In 1 John chapter 4, it does clearly state that God is Love and clearly asserts what you claim cannot be asserted. 7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. 8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love. 9 In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him. 10 Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins. 11 Beloved, if God so loved us, we ought also to love one another. 12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us. 13 Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, because he hath given us of his Spirit. 14 And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world. 15 Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God. 16 And we have known and believed the love that God hath to us. God is love; and he that dwelleth in love dwelleth in God, and God in him.

Quote:2. Your continued perverse nonsense is also an example of :
a. the syllogistic fallacy of the illicit major,
b. the red herring fallacy,
c. the pathetic fallacy,
d. the definist fallacy,
e. the genetic fallacy,
f. the etymological fallacy,
g. the thought-terminating cliche generalization
I don't think it is a logical fallacy to Love Love as God. What's wrong with Loving Love? What's wrong with cherishing Love? What's wrong with serving Love? What's wrong with being led by Love?Nothing.
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10-07-2013, 09:50 PM
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 07:42 PM)childeye Wrote:  Humans write scriptures but the sentiments expressed are inspired by certain feelings or thoughts being conveyed.

No shit, Sherlock. Tongue

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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10-07-2013, 10:54 PM (This post was last modified: 10-07-2013 11:10 PM by Starcrash.)
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 05:06 PM)childeye Wrote:  Thank you for your thoughtful response. I would first like to answer the question you pose at the end. The reason I am adamant is because I believe Love is good and not evil. It is therefore beyond my comprehension that an evil person could create such a wonderful and beautiful Spirit. It would be like saying ignorance conceived knowledge or death conceived life or nothing conceived something. These binary terms are not equal. Therefore I see what I view as corruption of what was once pure and I ponder how and why. I did watch the video.

I appreciate your statement that I would do away with evil if given the power to do it. I equally appreciate your statement about God coexisting with evil being problematic for a loving god to exist from the worldview. These are valid sentiments. However, in my view and knowing what I know, what we are seeing as coexistence of God and evil, is actually corruption taking it's course. Why does God not stop it? Because in the end evil will destroy evil and what is not evil will be refined. Moreover, our worldview is from a place in time and space which words describe a temporal place of existence. This means to me that when we ask why doesn't God put an end to evil, we are missing the likely probability that God is doing exactly that in the course of all fleshy or temporal existence. To a being outside of time, it would appear as only a moment, while to us who are in time, it is our combined lifetimes. Scripture is full of nuances implying exactly that. We are not here to experience life, but to experience death so that we may know how to value life.

It is "beyond your comprehension that an evil person could create a wonderful and beautiful Spirit", and yet doesn't seem to be beyond your comprehension that a good person could create the depths of evil that exist (and as pointed out in the video, are shockingly common)? The problem here is that you see them as "binary terms"... why have you determined that God must be completely good or completely evil? Why can't he be some of both? Or, as I've argued, why can't good and evil be completely natural constructs that don't require a god's existence to explain?

Now your argument takes into account a standard that you typically wouldn't adhere to under other circumstances -- what you're arguing is "the end justifies the means". You're saying that it's alright for people to endure pain, suffering, and evil just because those things will go away eventually. This isn't something that you would accept unless you had to in order to preserve your belief in God. You argue that God's in the process of getting rid of evil, though it still leaves us with the question of why he created it in the first place if he wanted it gone (if he created everything that exists, then logically he also created evil, as evil is part of "everything that exists"), or why He seems incapable of getting rid of it sooner. Even we mere humans know how to stop an evil act that we're watching in real time.

Finally, these arguments about "God's time" are always made to nullify arguments about real time, and it doesn't take into account where we actually exist. To a child getting raped, a few minutes would feel like eternity, in the same way that you claim that it would feel only like a moment to a god outside of time. And the bible makes it clear that God doesn't see it from the point of view that you're attributing to Him -- to someone who "has the very hairs of your head numbered", do you think the time spent suffering means little to Him, just because He sees time differently? Please don't try to minimize suffering by looking at it from an absurd perspective. Even if it were true that God didn't see pain the way that we do, that would be all the more reason to see him as uncaring or selfish.

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10-07-2013, 11:08 PM
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 09:44 PM)childeye Wrote:  
(10-07-2013 10:41 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  2. Your continued perverse nonsense is also an example of :
a. the syllogistic fallacy of the illicit major,
b. the red herring fallacy,
c. the pathetic fallacy,
d. the definist fallacy,
e. the genetic fallacy,
f. the etymological fallacy,
g. the thought-terminating cliche generalization
I don't think it is a logical fallacy to Love Love as God. What's wrong with Loving Love? What's wrong with cherishing Love? What's wrong with serving Love? What's wrong with being led by Love?Nothing.

I don't think Bucky Ball was claiming that "it is a logical fallacy to love love as God", so you kinda missed the point -- but only one of these fallacies apply to your argument, so you're not entirely wrong to be confused about why they were suggested. When you say "God is Love", you're using a thought-terminating cliche... it's cliche because it's a phrase used so often that it's accepted as a truism, yet it's thought-terminating because it's merely asserted as if widely believed and offered without any evidential or philosophical support. I'm not going to waste my time explaining what the rest of these fallacies mean or why they don't fit, but I empathize with you, childeye. I've had plenty of opponents try to dismiss my arguments by just naming fallacies without even an explanation about *why* they came to that conclusion.

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11-07-2013, 07:54 PM (This post was last modified: 17-07-2013 03:41 AM by Filox.)
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 10:54 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  
(10-07-2013 05:06 PM)childeye Wrote:  Thank you for your thoughtful response. I would first like to answer the question you pose at the end. The reason I am adamant is because I believe Love is good and not evil. It is therefore beyond my comprehension that an evil person could create such a wonderful and beautiful Spirit. It would be like saying ignorance conceived knowledge or death conceived life or nothing conceived something. These binary terms are not equal. Therefore I see what I view as corruption of what was once pure and I ponder how and why. I did watch the video.

I appreciate your statement that I would do away with evil if given the power to do it. I equally appreciate your statement about God coexisting with evil being problematic for a loving god to exist from the worldview. These are valid sentiments. However, in my view and knowing what I know, what we are seeing as coexistence of God and evil, is actually corruption taking it's course. Why does God not stop it? Because in the end evil will destroy evil and what is not evil will be refined. Moreover, our worldview is from a place in time and space which words describe a temporal place of existence. This means to me that when we ask why doesn't God put an end to evil, we are missing the likely probability that God is doing exactly that in the course of all fleshy or temporal existence. To a being outside of time, it would appear as only a moment, while to us who are in time, it is our combined lifetimes. Scripture is full of nuances implying exactly that. We are not here to experience life, but to experience death so that we may know how to value life.

It is "beyond your comprehension that an evil person could create a wonderful and beautiful Spirit", and yet doesn't seem to be beyond your comprehension that a good person could create the depths of evil that exist (and as pointed out in the video, are shockingly common)? The problem here is that you see them as "binary terms"... why have you determined that God must be completely good or completely evil? Why can't he be some of both? Or, as I've argued, why can't good and evil be completely natural constructs that don't require a god's existence to explain?
You make good points and ask all the right questions in my opinion. Yes it is extremely important to me to see in binary terms. That is how I determine right from wrong. Evil is not good and good is not evil. Dark is not Light and Light is not dark. God is the Light to me, which is why I cannot count Him as both good and evil. There is where I determine is holiness. He constitutes the good and all that is contrary to Him is not good. I could not imagine Him as sometimes trustworthy and sometimes not. He is the absolute Truth that will never lead you astray nor fail you. Certainly there are degrees between dark and Light, but I do not believe in a God that is darkness or that there is some sort of balance found in the middle. Darkness is simply the absence of Light. So you see, God to me is the constructor of what is seen in the natural. However, He is not necessary to me to explain good and evil as we see it. He is necessary to navigate it.

I equate God with spiritual Truth as opposed to spiritual lies. This means that what constitutes my character and my behavior is based upon what I believe to be true. All the emotions that impede my well-being and affect my countenance are oftentimes based upon lies sown in my ignorance. Yes I believe there is a such thing described as the devil. The Spirit of Truth reveals these lies as hypocrisy wherein the devil is made impotent to influence me in my own outlook, mindset and behavior. In the Truth of God I find my true self and in true servitude to God I find true freedom.

Quote:Now your argument takes into account a standard that you typically wouldn't adhere to under other circumstances -- what you're arguing is "the end justifies the means". You're saying that it's alright for people to endure pain, suffering, and evil just because those things will go away eventually. This isn't something that you would accept unless you had to in order to preserve your belief in God.
Not exactly. God is simply letting us find out He was right and trustworthy all along. If He were to stop the process, the ignorance where lies are sown would never be brought into the Light and corruption would never be healed. Death would continue to reign.

Quote:You argue that God's in the process of getting rid of evil, though it still leaves us with the question of why he created it in the first place if he wanted it gone (if he created everything that exists, then logically he also created evil, as evil is part of "everything that exists"), or why He seems incapable of getting rid of it sooner.
Please excuse my tendency for bringing up binary terms, but I count the ability to sin (do or go or be contrary to God) a disability. I say this so that you might understand that evil does not actually exist. What we see when we view evil are events that lead in a direction away from life towards death. We are seeing less existence of what is good, even as the deeper the darkness is, it is not actually more darkness but less Light. We are seeing corruption of what was Holy. Corruption caused by distrust in what was always True and trustworthy. All evil in this sense is based upon a lie that has been believed to be true. Now we are getting into some deeper theology here which concerns the devil.

Quote: Even we mere humans know how to stop an evil act that we're watching in real time.
Yes that is true in certain circumstances. But here we are talking about stopping the actual spirit or attitude that precedes the act. Can we do that without God/Truth? Can we do that without faith? And here again binary terms must be addressed or the real Truth which actually has the power to defeats the lies that support those attitudes cannot be properly calculated nor articulated. Suppose those who serve money as their god define the words success/failure, prosperity/poverty, good/evil differently than those who serve Love. They will not even agree on what good and evil is.
Quote:Finally, these arguments about "God's time" are always made to nullify arguments about real time, and it doesn't take into account where we actually exist. To a child getting raped, a few minutes would feel like eternity, in the same way that you claim that it would feel only like a moment to a god outside of time. And the bible makes it clear that God doesn't see it from the point of view that you're attributing to Him -- to someone who "has the very hairs of your head numbered", do you think the time spent suffering means little to Him, just because He sees time differently? Please don't try to minimize suffering by looking at it from an absurd perspective. Even if it were true that God didn't see pain the way that we do, that would be all the more reason to see him as uncaring or selfish.
Okay, that's a fair point. Thank you for pointing out how that could be taken. I assure you, I had no intention of diminishing the cost of anyone's suffering. I sincerely believe no one suffers more than God since He is Love. But try and understand that I am a Christian who found Truth and hope and Life at a cross of great suffering and death. I speak from a mind that reasons upon the belief that God's character is one that would share in our suffering and yet forgive those who caused it saying, "forgive them for they know not what they do". He would not return evil for evil. In that paradox is where the power to defeat evil is.
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11-07-2013, 08:03 PM
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 10:54 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  It is "beyond your comprehension that an evil person could create a wonderful and beautiful Spirit", and yet doesn't seem to be beyond your comprehension that a good person could create the depths of evil that exist (and as pointed out in the video, are shockingly common)? The problem here is that you see them as "binary terms"... why have you determined that God must be completely good or completely evil? Why can't he be some of both? Or, as I've argued, why can't good and evil be completely natural constructs that don't require a god's existence to explain?


You make good points and ask all the right questions. Yes it is extremely important to me to see everything in binary terms. That is how I determine right from wrong. Evil is not good and good is not evil. Darkness is not Light and Light is not darkness. God is the Light to me, which is why I cannot count Him as both good and evil. There in faith is where I determine what is holiness. He constitutes the good and all that is contrary to Him is not good. I could not imagine Him as sometimes trustworthy and sometimes not. He is the absolute Truth that will never lead me astray nor fail me. There will be no broken heart where I have entrusted in Him. Certainly there are degrees between dark and Light, but I do not believe in a God that is darkness or that there is some sort of balance found in the middle. Darkness is simply the absence of Light, but God is the Light. So you see, God to me is the constructor of what is seen in the natural. He knows all the workings as only a Creator can. However, He is not necessary to me to explain good and evil as we see it. He is necessary to navigate it.

I equate God with spiritual Truth as opposed to spiritual lies. This means that what constitutes my character, my attitude and my behavior is based upon what I believe to be true. All the emotions that impede my well-being and affect my countenance are oftentimes based upon lies that have been sown in my ignorance of Him. Yes I believe there is a such thing described as the devil. The Spirit of Truth reveals these lies as hypocrisy wherein the devil is made impotent to influence me in my own outlook, mindset and behavior. In the Truth of God I find my true self and in true servitude to God I find my true freedom.

Quote:Now your argument takes into account a standard that you typically wouldn't adhere to under other circumstances -- what you're arguing is "the end justifies the means". You're saying that it's alright for people to endure pain, suffering, and evil just because those things will go away eventually. This isn't something that you would accept unless you had to in order to preserve your belief in God.
Not exactly. God is simply letting us find out He was right and trustworthy all along. If He were to stop the process, the ignorance where lies are sown would never be brought into the Light and corruption would never be healed. Death would continue to reign.

Quote:You argue that God's in the process of getting rid of evil, though it still leaves us with the question of why he created it in the first place if he wanted it gone (if he created everything that exists, then logically he also created evil, as evil is part of "everything that exists"), or why He seems incapable of getting rid of it sooner.
Please excuse my tendency for bringing up binary terms, but I count the ability to sin (do or go or be contrary to God) a disability. I say this so that you might understand that evil does not actually exist. What we see when we view evil are events that lead in a direction away from life towards death. We are seeing less existence of what is good, even as the deeper the darkness is, it is not actually more darkness but less Light. We are seeing corruption of what was Holy. Corruption caused by distrust in what was always True and trustworthy. All evil in this sense is based upon a lie that has been believed to be true. Now we are getting into some deeper theology here which concerns the devil.

Quote: Even we mere humans know how to stop an evil act that we're watching in real time.
Yes that is true in certain circumstances. But here we are talking about stopping the actual spirit or attitude that precedes the act. Can we do that without God/Truth? Can we do that without faith? And here again binary terms must be addressed or the real Truth which actually has the power to defeats the lies that support those attitudes cannot be properly calculated nor articulated. Suppose those who serve money as their god define the words success/failure, prosperity/poverty, good/evil differently than those who serve Love. They will not even agree on what good and evil is.
Quote:Finally, these arguments about "God's time" are always made to nullify arguments about real time, and it doesn't take into account where we actually exist. To a child getting raped, a few minutes would feel like eternity, in the same way that you claim that it would feel only like a moment to a god outside of time. And the bible makes it clear that God doesn't see it from the point of view that you're attributing to Him -- to someone who "has the very hairs of your head numbered", do you think the time spent suffering means little to Him, just because He sees time differently? Please don't try to minimize suffering by looking at it from an absurd perspective. Even if it were true that God didn't see pain the way that we do, that would be all the more reason to see him as uncaring or selfish.
Okay, that's a fair point. Thank you for pointing out how that could be taken. I assure you, I had no intention of diminishing the cost of anyone's suffering. I sincerely believe no one suffers more than God since He is Love. But try and understand that I am a Christian who found Truth and hope and Life at a cross of great suffering and death. I speak from a mind that reasons upon the belief that God's character is one that would share in our suffering and yet forgive those who caused it saying, "forgive them for they know not what they do". He would not return evil for evil. In that paradox is where I believe the power to defeat evil is. I therefore do not ask to be let down from my own personal cross.
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11-07-2013, 08:11 PM
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 07:42 PM)childeye Wrote:  God is Love and Love is not a moral belief or a religion or a superstition. Love is a real Spirit we all experience...

However studies have also shown that Love or recognition of what is right and wrong behavior are also inherited genetically. Also psychopathy can be traced genetically. From what I understand the guy who shielded the little girl had only a split second of time to think about it.

The term "God" is just a word pertaining to the Highest moral authority. Nonetheless, God resides in each man who knows Love, even because He is Spirit.

What are the consequences of this belief? People experience and react to their own feelings regardless.

Nope.
You continue to impose your capricious idiosyncratic definition of words and concepts on others, and expect them to accept your strange unusual usage as valid.
What "studies" exactly are you referring to above. Cite them please. I want to read them.

(10-07-2013 07:42 PM)childeye Wrote:  "God is Love and Love is not a moral belief or a religion or a superstition"
"The term "God" is just a word pertaining to the Highest moral authority."

You have no clue what you are saying. You just contradicted yourself.
And BTW, I stand by my list of fallacies.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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11-07-2013, 08:18 PM
RE: God is love? Not in this Universe.
(10-07-2013 11:08 PM)Starcrash Wrote:  I don't think Bucky Ball was claiming that "it is a logical fallacy to love love as God", so you kinda missed the point -- but only one of these fallacies apply to your argument, so you're not entirely wrong to be confused about why they were suggested. When you say "God is Love", you're using a thought-terminating cliche... it's cliche because it's a phrase used so often that it's accepted as a truism, yet it's thought-terminating because it's merely asserted as if widely believed and offered without any evidential or philosophical support. I'm not going to waste my time explaining what the rest of these fallacies mean or why they don't fit, but I empathize with you, childeye. I've had plenty of opponents try to dismiss my arguments by just naming fallacies without even an explanation about *why* they came to that conclusion.
I appreciate your thoughtful sentiment. I believe God is Love as in the highest power of goodness. That is my honest assessment. It is not cliché to me and I definitely don't use it to terminate thought. At least I don't think I do.
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