"God is outside of time and space"
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28-12-2011, 12:40 AM
"God is outside of time and space"
There was some post in Egor's clusterfuck of a thread (I think it was something Bucky said) that made me think about the whole "God exists outside of time and space" argument.

I realized that something that exists outside the parameters of time cannot possibly affect anything within the confines of time. For something to affect events in an existence that is set in the boundaries of past, present, and future, it would either have to also adhere to past, present, and future or else have set all these events in motion in one timeless instance, which would negate the entire purpose of praying since the decisions have already been made.

God can't intervene on an event, then intervene on a later event. That would mean that he had a first intervention, then a second, which are numerical terms suggesting a subsequent nature. To intervene before another intervention would imply that there is a "before" and an "after," which are applications of time.

Shoot, my weed wore off. Someone pick this up and run with it.

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28-12-2011, 12:45 AM
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
So if god is outside of time and space, where the fuck is he? It sounds like a load of crap to me. That's my running done!

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28-12-2011, 01:21 AM (This post was last modified: 28-12-2011 01:25 AM by GirlyMan.)
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
(28-12-2011 12:40 AM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  Shoot, my weed wore off. Someone pick this up and run with it.

You're obviously not getting any of Stark's pharmaceutical quality shit if it wears off that quick.

(28-12-2011 12:40 AM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  There was some post in Egor's clusterfuck of a thread (I think it was something Bucky said) that made me think about the whole "God exists outside of time and space" argument.

God don't exist outside of time and space, God invented and continually redefines time and space.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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28-12-2011, 02:31 AM
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
(28-12-2011 01:21 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  God don't exist outside of time and space, God invented and continually redefines time and space.
NO! I'm not converting dammit...

On the other hand...
This is a nice theory on what I think is the key to life's big mystery... "The way we perceive, and are obliged to follow, time"

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Disclaimer: Don’t mix the personal opinion above with the absolute and objective truth. Remember to think for yourself. Thank you.
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28-12-2011, 03:40 AM (This post was last modified: 28-12-2011 03:56 AM by GirlyMan.)
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
(28-12-2011 02:31 AM)The_observer Wrote:  
(28-12-2011 01:21 AM)GirlyMan Wrote:  God don't exist outside of time and space, God invented and continually redefines time and space.
NO! I'm not converting dammit...

Me neither, observant one, just doing due diligence.

(28-12-2011 02:31 AM)The_observer Wrote:  On the other hand...
This is a nice theory on what I think is the key to life's big mystery... "The way we perceive, and are obliged to follow, time"

We made time up to make sense out of this shit, ... time is more servant than savior.

As it was in the beginning is now and ever shall be, world without end. Amen.
And I will show you something different from either
Your shadow at morning striding behind you
Or your shadow at evening rising to meet you;
I will show you fear in a handful of dust.
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28-12-2011, 05:24 AM
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
Im willing to accept that for the sake of argument, but how do u get from a timeless, spaceless entity to books written in the bronze age
that treat women as if they are property, allows wifebeating and marital rape (in islam), or a god that cares about your foreskin.
If such a timeless spaceless god exsists, he probably doesnt even pay much attention to us if any. and also probably an apathetic entity
that is just experimentying with the universe.
another speculation that its not a good but rather a cruel and vain god, and purposefully 'revealed' all the religions to play a game with humanity and see how far they go, an explination that i find has way more ground in it than the explaination of the abrihamic faiths.

"Yeah, good idea. Make them buy your invisible apple. Insist that they do. Market it properly and don't stop until they pay for it." -Malleus
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28-12-2011, 05:32 AM
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
(28-12-2011 12:40 AM)Buddy Christ Wrote:  There was some post in Egor's clusterfuck of a thread (I think it was something Bucky said) that made me think about the whole "God exists outside of time and space" argument.

I realized that something that exists outside the parameters of time cannot possibly affect anything within the confines of time. For something to affect events in an existence that is set in the boundaries of past, present, and future, it would either have to also adhere to past, present, and future or else have set all these events in motion in one timeless instance, which would negate the entire purpose of praying since the decisions have already been made.

God can't intervene on an event, then intervene on a later event. That would mean that he had a first intervention, then a second, which are numerical terms suggesting a subsequent nature. To intervene before another intervention would imply that there is a "before" and an "after," which are applications of time.

Shoot, my weed wore off. Someone pick this up and run with it.

The problem is, even though your analysis is spot on from a logical sense, to the person of faith, they'll just respond, With God Anything Is Possible! Which includes existing outside of time and space and intervening in our time and space as much as He desires and he can make it work because God is God and is not bound to our human ways of understanding Time and Space.

Also, you can be a KC Calvinist and believe God set up everything in a deterministic universe and He doesn't really need to do any intervening because it was already planned out "before the foundations of the world were laid."

It gets asked, "Then where the hell is God?" The convoluted answer is...in another dimension. It comes down to Abbott's "Flatland," if you've ever read that. Two dimensional beings have no real meaningful way of interacting with a three dimensional being. That analogy is used by tons of Apologist Acrobats to "prove" that since God is existing "other-dimensionally", the fact that we are stuck in our dimensions of Time and Space means we will never comprehend the fullness of God. This is also the argument used to answer, "If God created the Big Bang, who created God?" Dumb question to the Theist. God is self-existing outside our Universe. The Universe is expanding. Ever wonder what it is expanding into? If it's expanding, then there is "something" beyond our universe that it is expanding into. Is that where God dwells? Maybe. Or maybe God dwells in Dark Matter which is described as being all around us...kind of like God, huh? Of course, we can never understand how God can be outside Creation and still intervene with it until He takes us out of here and gives us our new glorified bodies. Well, not US, because the majority of us are frying in Hell, except Egor. Sorry, KC and Sharks, you're going down too for being Lukewarm Christians. Jesus is gonna spew your sorry asses out for being neither hot nor cold.

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28-12-2011, 05:35 AM
RE: "God is outside of time and space"




FF to 2:20 in...answers everything... Tongue

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28-12-2011, 05:39 AM
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
(28-12-2011 05:35 AM)Seasbury Wrote:  



FF to 2:20 in...answers everything... Tongue


Stark should use this as a commercial. Big Grin

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
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28-12-2011, 08:26 AM
RE: "God is outside of time and space"
I was discussing quantum physics with my brother last night. We were talking about different dimensions. Lower dimensions cannot understand higher dimensions. We can see hypothetical evidence of it, though. A 2D object cannot exist on a 3D world because as soon as it enters into a 3D world it would be come 3D. A 3D object can enter a 2D world, but the 2D world cannot comprehend or even see the 3rd dimension; therefore, according to the world around it, it becomes 2D even though it's actually 3D. Using this same logic we move up dimensions.

Of course, I could be totally whacked out wrong, since this is all speculation by my brother and me.

(28-12-2011 05:32 AM)Erxomai Wrote:  Sorry, KC and Sharks, you're going down too for being Lukewarm Christians. Jesus is gonna spew your sorry asses out for being neither hot nor cold.

On a completely unrelated note, I HATE THIS SUNDAY SCHOOL LESSON. It drives me crazy. It's not even what the verse is talking about or the context of the "hot" and "cold".

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