God or Nothing
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19-05-2012, 05:36 PM
RE: God or Nothing

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein
Those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music - Friedrich Nietzsche
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19-05-2012, 05:40 PM
RE: God or Nothing
Okay, so the number itself doesn't exist but it is a predictor. I get what you are saying now.

My use of "exists" is incorrect.

“Science is simply common sense at its best, that is, rigidly accurate in observation, and merciless to fallacy in logic.”
—Thomas Henry Huxley
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19-05-2012, 05:44 PM
RE: God or Nothing
(19-05-2012 05:11 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(19-05-2012 04:56 PM)Thomas Wrote:  The number 0 was invented by the Chinese and Indians. The west borrowed it around the same time as they borrowed algebra. (I believe)
Was it invented or discovered?
Given to the Indians by God...

[Image: zeroofgod.jpg]


here it is carved on a temple wall. From the BBC program about 0 and 1. It's on youtube somewherez. Wink

(Figures a Western preacherman wouldn't know about Eastern godliness. Tongue)

[Image: klingon_zps7e68578a.jpg]
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19-05-2012, 06:01 PM
RE: God or Nothing
Zero is an indicator of the value of nothing and it is also the integer previous to 1. Sheesh. Dodgy




Hmm... Consider Zero is the anti-number... Atheist is an indicator of the value of no God.


Bit much?
Unsure

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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19-05-2012, 07:14 PM
RE: God or Nothing
(19-05-2012 05:44 PM)houseofcantor Wrote:  
(19-05-2012 05:11 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  Was it invented or discovered?
Given to the Indians by God...

[Image: zeroofgod.jpg]


here it is carved on a temple wall. From the BBC program about 0 and 1. It's on youtube somewherez. Wink

(Figures a Western preacherman wouldn't know about Eastern godliness. Tongue)
Is that your thumb, Johnny?

This Western preacherman only knows about Indians of the Cowboy, not the kind you're referring to. Hobo

It was just a fucking apple man, we're sorry okay? Please stop the madness Laugh out load
~Izel
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19-05-2012, 07:48 PM
RE: God or Nothing
(19-05-2012 06:42 AM)Anjele Wrote:  The concept of a god, or supreme being who is in charge, has been around since people started wanting their questions answered.

Where does the rain come from? It's not always raining...sometimes it doesn't rain for weeks, why. Man had to figure out why back when they didn't have the scientific skills, equipment, or knowledge to answer the question. Man doesn't like unknowns, he needs an answer. So it must be a rain god. This god gives rain for drinking and so the plants we eat will grow and the animals can survive. When there is not rain and it's desperately needed but not forthcoming, man decided they must appease the god who must be angry with them and is punishing them. So they pray, they sing, they beat drums and dance, they go so far as to offer animal and human sacrifices. When the rain finally comes, as it always will, they chalk it up to the rain god answering their pleas for rain.

Does a god really make sense...to people who don't know better it does. Now we have the knowledge of how weather systems work.

Replace rain with nearly anything. When the answer is unknown, man creates a god (or some other supernatural entity or force)to fill in that missing piece. Gods are created by man, which is why so many of the gods of the past and present look like man in drawings, painting, descriptions. Notice that list doesn't contain photos...he doesn't show up for photo shoots so that there is real evidence.

Does a god exist, or did he ever? I don't have 100% proof that one didn't. But I also don't have 100% proof that he did or does.

Unknowns are covered by the creation and belief in a god for some people. That's where the whole faith thing comes in. Belief in an unseen god that controls what we can see but we don't understand. But that doesn't make it fact.
Hey Angie, I read this and thought.....WOW! You nailed it! In fact, I liked it so much I pinched it and added it to my blog, http://www.markfulton.org/god-in-context-2 Hope you don't mind, Mark
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19-05-2012, 08:12 PM
 
RE: God or Nothing
(19-05-2012 12:15 AM)Likos02 Wrote:  Why must we rely on the being of god for existance? Because people are Afraid of the alternative. People are Afraid of Non-existance, people are afraid of not Knowing. So people fill the void of not knowing with god to make themselves Feel Better.

That may certainly be the case. With me, I'm afraid my life won't matter. But that's all irrelevant. Those fears may lead us to ask the question, but the answer to the question is not dependent on the motivation for asking it.

Quote:What says that god MUST exist? Man Says that god must exist, Man asserts that he's there, even though he refuses to show himself.

That He refuses to show Himself is a matter of opinion. In my opinion, He's quite obvious. And God must exist, because otherwise what does exist has no reason for coming into existence. If there is no reason for the universe to bang into existence, then it seems far more likely that nothingness would remain eternally.

Quote:Why must there be a reason for the universe to exist? Why cant we just...Be? People are so hung up that we are here for a reason. They try to rationalize WHY we are here. What if we are just here, for no reason at all? Why is that so hard to accept that we possibly just got LUCKY.

Because nothing in the universe appears to exist, form, or move for no reason at all. Everything has a cause, and every cause a cause before it. But we know that can't continue in an infinite regress of causes, becuase given the nature of infinity, nothing would ever actualize if there was never a first cause. And that leads me to my observation: if anything at all exists, there must be a God, because it's just so much easier for noting to remain eternally.
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19-05-2012, 08:17 PM
 
RE: God or Nothing
(19-05-2012 12:29 AM)LadyJane Wrote:  Why can't nothing have existed? I don't claim to say everything always existed. I also don't claim something made things exist, that can happen all on its own. How? Don't know yet, but because I don't know doesn't mean a God HAS to exist. They don't equal. Not knowing does not equal God, it just equals not knowing.



Okay, but what you're describing is not a rational thought process. It is as faith based as any religious claim. And it's not for a lack of knowledge that I'm saying God has to exist. It's because all things that exist have a reason for existing a cause, and logically if we go back far enough, we would have to have an uncaused cause that is eternal and apparently intelligent and apparently willful. It's not a "god of the gaps" solution, it's a puzzle and it looks like there is only one possible piece that can fit.
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19-05-2012, 08:18 PM
RE: God or Nothing
(19-05-2012 07:48 PM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  
(19-05-2012 06:42 AM)Anjele Wrote:  The concept of a god, or supreme being who is in charge, has been around since people started wanting their questions answered.

Where does the rain come from? It's not always raining...sometimes it doesn't rain for weeks, why. Man had to figure out why back when they didn't have the scientific skills, equipment, or knowledge to answer the question. Man doesn't like unknowns, he needs an answer. So it must be a rain god. This god gives rain for drinking and so the plants we eat will grow and the animals can survive. When there is not rain and it's desperately needed but not forthcoming, man decided they must appease the god who must be angry with them and is punishing them. So they pray, they sing, they beat drums and dance, they go so far as to offer animal and human sacrifices. When the rain finally comes, as it always will, they chalk it up to the rain god answering their pleas for rain.

Does a god really make sense...to people who don't know better it does. Now we have the knowledge of how weather systems work.

Replace rain with nearly anything. When the answer is unknown, man creates a god (or some other supernatural entity or force)to fill in that missing piece. Gods are created by man, which is why so many of the gods of the past and present look like man in drawings, painting, descriptions. Notice that list doesn't contain photos...he doesn't show up for photo shoots so that there is real evidence.

Does a god exist, or did he ever? I don't have 100% proof that one didn't. But I also don't have 100% proof that he did or does.

Unknowns are covered by the creation and belief in a god for some people. That's where the whole faith thing comes in. Belief in an unseen god that controls what we can see but we don't understand. But that doesn't make it fact.
Hey Angie, I read this and thought.....WOW! You nailed it! In fact, I liked it so much I pinched it and added it to my blog, http://www.markfulton.org/god-in-context-2 Hope you don't mind, Mark
Wow, quite a compliment coming from you.

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19-05-2012, 08:23 PM
 
RE: God or Nothing
(19-05-2012 12:40 AM)Likos02 Wrote:  
(19-05-2012 12:35 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  We're not so special or complex as to require a deliberate process to bring us about, and surely a deliberate process would have produced better results?



This is one of my main arguements. If god made us in his image then why are there truly fucked up people in the world? If god wanted us all in heaven with him, then why didnt he make us inherently good? Why does the All Powerfull God give us the means to defy him if he wanted us in heaven? And then why does he punish us?



You're thinking too religiously about God. I think if we're going to figure anything out, we're going to have to drop all the religious notions.
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