God's Checklist 2.0
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20-03-2014, 07:23 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(19-03-2014 11:31 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  7 - Create a garden with a tree in it bearing fruit that when eaten provides knowledge of your objective moral standards, and create two sentient cognitive beings without knowledge or awareness of these standards and instruct them not to eat from the tree which would enlighten them (in other words, arrange it so that only AFTER they eat from the tree are they capable of understanding that doing so was a violation of objective moral standards).

For me this is a major logical flaw in the Genesis myth.

Given a random probability of a chance event happening, then over time the chance of that event happening tends towards 1.

So Adam & Eve may not supposed to have eaten the forbidden fruit on the first day, week, month, year or whatever. But eventually, they were going to eat it. It would just be a matter of time. Especially so if Adam & Eve were going to reproduce.

That means that eating the forbidden fruit would be inevitable in such a situation.
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20-03-2014, 07:43 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(20-03-2014 06:40 AM)RobbyPants Wrote:  Yeah, as an ex-Christian, it's weird looking back on the stuff that I believed and attempted to justify. I remember at one point feeling lucky for being born in an area of the world that mostly worships the "correct" god.

Everybody who believes in a god, believes in the correct god—just ask them.

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20-03-2014, 07:49 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(20-03-2014 07:23 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(19-03-2014 11:31 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  7 - Create a garden with a tree in it bearing fruit that when eaten provides knowledge of your objective moral standards, and create two sentient cognitive beings without knowledge or awareness of these standards and instruct them not to eat from the tree which would enlighten them (in other words, arrange it so that only AFTER they eat from the tree are they capable of understanding that doing so was a violation of objective moral standards).

For me this is a major logical flaw in the Genesis myth.

Given a random probability of a chance event happening, then over time the chance of that event happening tends towards 1.

So Adam & Eve may not supposed to have eaten the forbidden fruit on the first day, week, month, year or whatever. But eventually, they were going to eat it. It would just be a matter of time. Especially so if Adam & Eve were going to reproduce.

That means that eating the forbidden fruit would be inevitable in such a situation.

You've gone and made it all sensible and about the valid points and there we were, all just busy drooling over the very, very pretty boy. Big GrinBig Grin

But yep...that fruit was going to get eaten sooner or later. Not sure what Yahweh was up to there. Being a bit of a Evil_monster methinks.

"The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species." - Christopher Hitchens

"Remember kids, if you don't sin, then Jesus died for nothing. Have a great day!" - Ricky Gervais
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20-03-2014, 09:37 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(20-03-2014 07:43 AM)Jeffasaurus Wrote:  Everybody who believes in a god, believes in the correct god—just ask them.

Of course! I don't remember what it was, but I had a super-handy-wavy response for why they believed, yet were confused, and why I was totally correct.
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20-03-2014, 03:36 PM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(20-03-2014 07:23 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  
(19-03-2014 11:31 PM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  7 - Create a garden with a tree in it bearing fruit that when eaten provides knowledge of your objective moral standards, and create two sentient cognitive beings without knowledge or awareness of these standards and instruct them not to eat from the tree which would enlighten them (in other words, arrange it so that only AFTER they eat from the tree are they capable of understanding that doing so was a violation of objective moral standards).

For me this is a major logical flaw in the Genesis myth.

Given a random probability of a chance event happening, then over time the chance of that event happening tends towards 1.

So Adam & Eve may not supposed to have eaten the forbidden fruit on the first day, week, month, year or whatever. But eventually, they were going to eat it. It would just be a matter of time. Especially so if Adam & Eve were going to reproduce.

That means that eating the forbidden fruit would be inevitable in such a situation.
Agreed. I think of it as being akin to a father who assembles an oven, turns it on, tells two toddlers "don't touch", and then completely leaves the room to test whether they will obey. When the first child reaches for the oven, the father does nothing. The child gets burned and dares the other one to try it. The father does nothing. The other child gets burned. And, if that wasn't punishment enough, the father comes back and punishes them for being disobedient. And that, of course, leaves out the punishment for all their descendents, but it's already bad enough without that. Dodgy

"Religion has caused more misery to all of mankind in every stage of human history than any other single idea." --Madalyn Murray O'Hair
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20-03-2014, 05:31 PM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(20-03-2014 12:03 AM)morondog Wrote:  What's interesting about this list to me, is that it's not a distortion. It is a bald statement of what many Christians do actually believe as fact.

I wish I would have been given this transcript when I was in my teens.
It is my opinion that a vast majority of Christians have never taken a hard look at their own beliefs, at the entire dogma of their religion.

I know I blindly accepted the snippets I was taught through repetition and spectacle without questioning. I never had a Cliffs Note version of the overall picture and I don't think most church goers do either.

If only...I could have saved myself years of grief and wasted motion.

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
“Ocean: A body of water occupying about two-thirds of a world made for man - who has no gills.”~ Ambrose Bierce
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21-03-2014, 01:03 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(20-03-2014 12:03 AM)morondog Wrote:  What's interesting about this list to me, is that it's not a distortion. It is a bald statement of what many Christians do actually believe as fact.

Of course it's a distortion! It's deliberately distorted to call to attention the absurdity of it all. The core of the faith is a deliberate avoidance of this absurdity. Any attempt to remove this avoidance is a distortion.

(More seriously, various denominations disagree with some of these theological points, or simply don't hold them as necessary.)

(20-03-2014 07:23 AM)Mathilda Wrote:  Given a random probability of a chance event happening, then over time the chance of that event happening tends towards 1.

.....

*reluctantly forces math-nazi personality back into the closet*

....

*TWITCH*
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21-03-2014, 01:38 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
I died of laughter at 4:57

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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21-03-2014, 02:40 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(21-03-2014 01:38 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  I died of laughter at 4:57

Had to go back and check out 4:57 which is very funny. I also liked what followed directly after when God has to "instruct this small disappointment of a family" Laughat

But it's to be expected...the bible is comedy gold, particularly the OT.

"The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species." - Christopher Hitchens

"Remember kids, if you don't sin, then Jesus died for nothing. Have a great day!" - Ricky Gervais
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21-03-2014, 03:30 AM
RE: God's Checklist 2.0
(21-03-2014 02:40 AM)Eva Wrote:  
(21-03-2014 01:38 AM)LostandInsecure Wrote:  I died of laughter at 4:57

Had to go back and check out 4:57 which is very funny. I also liked what followed directly after when God has to "instruct this small disappointment of a family" Laughat

But it's to be expected...the bible is comedy gold, particularly the OT.

Yes, exactly. It would have been funny either way but his face completes the hilarity for me. That whole part is funny but at 4:57 his eyes and face just really had me laughing. Lol

Swing with me a while, we can listen to the birds call, we can keep each other warm.
Swing with me forever, we can count up every flower, we can weather every storm.
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