God's pledge of eternal salvation
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20-01-2012, 10:48 AM
 
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
(20-01-2012 10:45 AM)kineo Wrote:  This aggression will not stand, man.

Every time I see your avatar Denicio, I want to go back and watch that movie.

CAREFUL man, theres a beverage here!

In the essesnce of full disclosure...i AM an Ordained Dudist, btw.

One of the best movies ever made.

...and that rug REALLY DID tie that room together........
D
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20-01-2012, 11:12 AM
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
(20-01-2012 10:12 AM)Denicio Wrote:  KC missed my point entirely. Not all that unexpected.

No need to be snarky... I just thought you were talking about what I had previously said in the "Bible Not 100% Literal" topic.

Quote:But brings up another, bigger issue. "Based on the Character of God". Again, the OT is God's Resume. WHY would you want to spend a second with this maniac? I dont care how cool, gruvy, accommodating, wise, caring, loving and dude-like the BUTLER is (Jesus) if the the MASTER of the house is a whimsical killer......why bother?

D

I'm basing this on what is said about Him being unchanging and about what is said about eternity.

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20-01-2012, 11:22 AM
 
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
(20-01-2012 11:12 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  I'm basing this on what is said about Him being unchanging and about what is said about eternity.

And WOW, what a doosey! For YOUR sake i hope he's changed. If he's STILL the Charles Manson of the OT....that guy is out of control. And for all eternity.....

D
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20-01-2012, 11:41 AM
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
The problem with KC is that he's a nice guy. I don't have that problem. This has a simple answer - the OP does not understand god.

God is eternal, the words of god obviously entropic; and this if-then loop is an infinite halting state only for those locked into patterns of cause and circumstance. Tongue

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20-01-2012, 01:07 PM
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
(20-01-2012 09:12 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Ummm, yes "because the Bible so" is a VALID answer. You can't say, "Hey, you know that stuff that's said in that book that you believe is infallible... yeah, what if, it isn't true and God does something different?"

The Bible clearly defines what is going to happen and how it ends... and it lasts for eternity.

This is a pet peeve of mine... you start a theological debate and throw theology out the door and say that theology isn't valid. It's a trap topic.

So saying "because Mohammed said so" and "because Moroni said so" are VALID answers? At what point does it become invalid? "Because Zeus said so?" "Because Crom said so?"

"All that is necessary for the triumph of Calvinism is that good Atheists do nothing." ~Eric Oh My
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20-01-2012, 01:21 PM
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
(20-01-2012 01:07 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  
(20-01-2012 09:12 AM)kingschosen Wrote:  Ummm, yes "because the Bible so" is a VALID answer. You can't say, "Hey, you know that stuff that's said in that book that you believe is infallible... yeah, what if, it isn't true and God does something different?"

The Bible clearly defines what is going to happen and how it ends... and it lasts for eternity.

This is a pet peeve of mine... you start a theological debate and throw theology out the door and say that theology isn't valid. It's a trap topic.

So saying "because Mohammed said so" and "because Moroni said so" are VALID answers? At what point does it become invalid? "Because Zeus said so?" "Because Crom said so?"

Okay... let me break this down...

(20-01-2012 06:45 AM)jimmygun Wrote:  My question to those that hope for eternal salvation is...Why do you assume that god won't change his mind and allow rebellion in heaven as he did with Lucifer? If that scene is repeated then all bets are off again.

These concepts to an atheist:

1) Eternal salvation = false
2) God = false
3) Rebellion in heaven = false
4) Lucifer = false

All these concepts come from the Bible which atheists believe is false.


However, the question is being asked as if these concepts are true; therefore, giving the Bible validity.

The WHOLE basis of this conversation is on whether or not the Bible is believed to be true or not.

Since the question asker asked this question, we enter into the assumption that the authoritative source for the question is the Bible.

So, if the Bible says contrary to the asked question, then there doesn't need to be anymore discussion; moreover, defeating any other type of argument since the authority says differently.

Again... you can't ask a theological question and refuse theology.

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20-01-2012, 01:36 PM
 
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
(20-01-2012 01:21 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  The WHOLE basis of this conversation is on whether or not the Bible is believed to be true or not.

Actually the basis of the conversation from the OP is more of a "How do you know god is not gonna go Palin Rogue and change his mind?" so to speak. SO its about something happening OUTSIDE the bible and what is written.

If god was unaware that Luicifer pulled his stunt, how do you know that god wont see another mutiny happen? He's missed the 1st one, which is just plain sloppy.

If god has to follow his divine plant to the letter (and the OP's mutiny an impossiblity)...sounds like he's bound by his own book. Not only am i MORE moral than this guy, but i have MORE FREEWILL than he does too!!!

D
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20-01-2012, 02:00 PM
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
(20-01-2012 01:36 PM)Denicio Wrote:  
(20-01-2012 01:21 PM)kingschosen Wrote:  The WHOLE basis of this conversation is on whether or not the Bible is believed to be true or not.

Actually the basis of the conversation from the OP is more of a "How do you know god is not gonna go Palin Rogue and change his mind?" so to speak. SO its about something happening OUTSIDE the bible and what is written.

If god was unaware that Luicifer pulled his stunt, how do you know that god wont see another mutiny happen? He's missed the 1st one, which is just plain sloppy.

If god has to follow his divine plant to the letter (and the OP's mutiny an impossiblity)...sounds like he's bound by his own book. Not only am i MORE moral than this guy, but i have MORE FREEWILL than he does too!!!

D


What KC is saying is that if you are going to bring up an arguement based on the bible being true then it doesn't make sense to argue the validity of the bible. The point is what if God changed his mind. If there is a God to change his mind about salvation then we must be assuming the bible is true. So a counter arguement should also assume the bible is true. It's a hypothetical kind of question.

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20-01-2012, 02:18 PM
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
KC arent you scared of going to muslim hell?
did you know that muslims have a boner for jesus too?
but in their version jesus endorses mohammed as gods latest candidate
but muslims think jesus will have a second coming too Smile
high time you might wanna reconsider your theology

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20-01-2012, 02:26 PM
RE: God's pledge of eternal salvation
I think what they say in response is:

1. OK we accept that God wrote the Bible and ostensibly this means you go to heaven.
2. BUT do you really trust this capricious God to follow his own Bible to the letter?

Problem for me is it's kinda easy to predict what will be said in response to this:

"Of course, absolutely. In James 3 vs 13 it says 'I the LORD will always follow my word exactly. This is my true word.'"...

(Plz note I not know what James 3 vs 13 really says Tongue )
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