Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
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19-12-2014, 10:32 AM
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 08:44 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  Could it be that this has all been a cruel hoax perpetrated by Satan?

I had just been debating asking him how he could know that it was god speaking and not satan. I would assume that his version satan has the power to deceive people so I don't know how any theist could ever claim that they were hearing god with any certainty.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
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19-12-2014, 11:12 AM
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 09:47 AM)DLJ Wrote:  "More's-the-pity"

So English. I love that saying. I can hear Maggie Smith saying it. Tongue

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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19-12-2014, 12:13 PM
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 11:12 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  ...
I can hear Maggie Smith saying it. Tongue

Dame Maggie Smith

Angry

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19-12-2014, 12:24 PM
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 12:13 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(19-12-2014 11:12 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  ...
I can hear Maggie Smith saying it. Tongue

Dame Maggie Smith

Angry

Oops.
See 5:49




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19-12-2014, 12:55 PM (This post was last modified: 19-12-2014 01:13 PM by Dark Phoenix.)
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(18-12-2014 01:18 PM)Gordon Wrote:  Dark Phoenix. You're freakin posts are too long and convoluted. You sound like a manic person with pressured speech. Don't waste your time writing to me that way, because I'm not going to waste my time reading it. But I will respond to this bit, you idiot:

Quote:I already considered your powers of revelation fraudulent and dishonest, but you make it easier for me by claiming common cause with the likes of Joseph Smith Jr. and Mohammad.

I have no common cause with either of those people. Asshole. Censored

I see. In that case, allow me to break it down for you.

I am already very skeptical of anyone claiming to receive divine revelation. I would need some really extraordinary reasons to believe that.

When you get asked a question and then respond with something like "Funny, God just told me this when I was jogging yesterday." or "God and I were just discussing this last night." it seems really suspicious to me. This is exactly what I would expect from someone who makes up answers on the spot. If you really talked to a god, I wouldn't expect you to have always just discussed the matter at hand. You might, say, need to go ask him first.

I mention Joseph Smith and Mohammad because they both claimed to have very convenient, spur of the moment, revelations. For example, their sexual desires and god's desire for them to take new wives, were simultaneous. The Mormon church recently issued an official explanation for Joseph's polygamy and polyandry. They claim that an angel of god came down and threatened Joseph with a sword in order to convince him to take more women into his bed. How many of us really believe this is what god wanted, rather than just what Joseph wanted?

So, when I notice you speaking for god at a moments notice, on subject you could not have known would come up, I get extra suspicious.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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19-12-2014, 01:36 PM (This post was last modified: 19-12-2014 01:45 PM by Gordon.)
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 08:44 AM)Full Circle Wrote:  Eddy,

Has it occured to you that the reason your presence gets so much attention wherever you go is the same reason rubber-neckers slow down when they see a car crash? Morbid curiosity.

Yeah, so? Drinking Beverage

Quote:As for your belief that you will turn into Christ or a Christ sounds to me an awful lot like Mormonism, just an observation.

But that has nothing to do with this life. Jesus prayed that we (his followers) would all be one, and that we would be one with him as he is one with the Father. A perfect unity. There is no way that can happen here. He had to have been talking about our existence on the astral plane.



Quote:You say you’ve been at this for twenty years, don’t you think that if God had selected you to re-write the gospels so as to bring His true words to the world He would have been crystal clear and done so by now?

Don’t you think that the fact that you are still getting nebulous messages on how to proceed and what the truth is speaks more to a human misunderstanding of how the mind works instead of a failure of God to be clear? After all he did give Moses the tablets, you would think if the Veridicanism message was so important He would have been more forthcoming after twenty long, arduous years.

But I had to grow. I was only 28 when it first came to me (as I was driving on an on-ramp, in fact, to the 91 freeway in Riverside, California, 1993). I was raised as a Pentacostal Christian. It took a lot of work. The very first notion was that Jesus was the truth. Not telling the truth, but the truth, the foundation of truth.

Quote:Could it be that this has all been a cruel hoax perpetrated by Satan?

Yes. But if God has allowed that to be the case, then there's nothing I can do about it. I have faith that God has not done that. That's all I can say about it.

Quote:Could it be that neither God or Satan has anything to do with what you hear and it is all in your head?

Yes. But then again, I have no control over that. If God has ignored me, or if there is no God, and if I am off on some trip in my own head, well what is there to do about it?

And I suppose if it never bears any fruit, then that was the case. Jesus said we would know a tree by the fruit that it produces. If Veridicanism bears no fruit, then perhaps it was all a false teaching, or the mere product of an organism being psychologically stimulated by his environment.

My problem is that I'm not sure what the fruit is supposed to look like. Followers? Readers? Opposition from the Christian Church? Converting atheists to theists? Miracles? I just don't know. I believe God will reveal it to me, but right now I have to get the VGJC finished. Everything hinges on that.

Quote:Lashing out at the world for your confusion is sad but understandable.

mmmm.

Quote:I have nothing but pity for you.

Good. Thumbsup Most people have nothing but contempt.

(19-12-2014 12:55 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  I am already very skeptical of anyone claiming to receive divine revelation. I would need some really extraordinary reasons to believe that.

Like what?

Quote:When you get asked a question and then respond with something like "Funny, God just told me this when I was jogging yesterday." or "God and I were just discussing this last night." it seems really suspicious to me. This is exactly what I would expect from someone who makes up answers on the spot.

But that's exactly how it works! When I'm alone, God and I talk. For 41 years it's been that way. It may make you suspicious, but that's how it goes. I kind of pity the people who don't have that. I mean, why would they go to church? Why would they pray? Why even believe in God if you can't hear Him?

Quote:If you really talked to a god, I wouldn't expect you to have always just discussed the matter at hand. You might, say, need to go ask him first.


I've said that before. In fact, I just said it (or something like that) a day or so ago in response to a question on theodicy. But I can turn to God right now, right this instant. He's always there, always has been.

But if you have a question for God, and it makes you feel better, I can wait 24 hours before responding. [Image: nixweiss.gif]

Quote:I mention Joseph Smith and Mohammad because they both claimed to have very convenient, spur of the moment, revelations. For example, their sexual desires and god's desire for them to take new wives, were simultaneous. The Mormon church recently issued an official explanation for Joseph's polygamy and polyandry. They claim that an angel of god came down and threatened Joseph with a sword in order to convince him to take more women into his bed.

Jesus was pretty asexual. In fact, we have to speculate about his missing years from 18-30 in order to even suggest he might have had a wife or sexual partners. I'm not a real sexual person. So, frankly what cult leaders do is not something I really care about.

Quote:So, when I notice you speaking for god at a moments notice, on subject you could not have known would come up, I get extra suspicious.

So, don't believe me. Don't give me the deed to your house, and definitely don't accept when you come over and I offer you some Kool-aid. You should be fine. [Image: koolaid.gif]
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19-12-2014, 02:30 PM
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 01:36 PM)Gordon Wrote:  
(19-12-2014 12:55 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  I am already very skeptical of anyone claiming to receive divine revelation. I would need some really extraordinary reasons to believe that.

Like what?

Great question. I can give a tentative answer, but I need some time to really ponder on what I think about this. For now, I suspect that it might not be possible for me to believe, given the world I live in.

1. I think I would need proof beyond a reasonable doubt that a God exists. It would have to be a god who can exist, so not the god of traditional monotheism. I can lay out my argument for the nonexistence of that kind of god if you would like me to, but for the sake of answering your question I will leave that up to you.

2. I think I would need proof beyond a reasonable doubt that you are actually talking to a god. I would go a long way if you could explain how it is you tell the difference between god and your own thoughts. It would go even further for me if you could explain how you identify what god you are speaking to.

3. I would need to see some consistency in mystical experience around the world. I should see a world where everyone experiences the same god and where religions revealed through that god are consistent in their unified message. I should not be seeing competing revelations with unverifiable claims. I should not be seeing competing scripture with demonstrable human flaws.

If I can think of other things, I will post them too.

Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, just as it is the spirit of a spiritless situation. The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is required for their real happiness.

-Karl Marx
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19-12-2014, 03:10 PM (This post was last modified: 19-12-2014 03:52 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 01:36 PM)Gordon Wrote:  But that has nothing to do with this life. Jesus prayed that we (his followers) would all be one, and that we would be one with him as he is one with the Father. A perfect unity. There is no way that can happen here. He had to have been talking about our existence on the astral plane.

No ignorant one. There was no Jesus of Nazareth. He never existed. You have no evidence he did. No one does. The "one with the Father" meme was a favorite theme of the early Jewish diaspora, (which of course you know nothing about as you know NOTHING about the history of any of the major religions ... which is why you feel free to just make up your bullshit) which was trying to figure out what it meant to be Jewish after the destruction of the temple. Maybe you could get into a low-level community college class in History if you begged them to accept you.

There have been thousand of nut cases who say god talks to them. You are but one of the sad many. You're all insane. On some level you know that. It's seriously ironic someone in your field actually suffers from what they claim to be treating.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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19-12-2014, 03:57 PM
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
(19-12-2014 02:30 PM)Dark Phoenix Wrote:  
(19-12-2014 01:36 PM)Gordon Wrote:  Like what?

Great question. I can give a tentative answer, but I need some time to really ponder on what I think about this. For now, I suspect that it might not be possible for me to believe, given the world I live in.

1. I think I would need proof beyond a reasonable doubt that a God exists. It would have to be a god who can exist, so not the god of traditional monotheism. I can lay out my argument for the nonexistence of that kind of god if you would like me to, but for the sake of answering your question I will leave that up to you.

2. I think I would need proof beyond a reasonable doubt that you are actually talking to a god. I would go a long way if you could explain how it is you tell the difference between god and your own thoughts. It would go even further for me if you could explain how you identify what god you are speaking to.

3. I would need to see some consistency in mystical experience around the world. I should see a world where everyone experiences the same god and where religions revealed through that god are consistent in their unified message. I should not be seeing competing revelations with unverifiable claims. I should not be seeing competing scripture with demonstrable human flaws.

If I can think of other things, I will post them too.

From a cosmic existential point of view (way prior Big Bang ) we have an ineffable eternity, so our proofs belong to the pragmatic area of science and logic, which rules that domain. While Christians may like to feel that God is provable and hard line atheists opt for the opposite it is a belief thing, as distinct from a 'know thing'.

I don't know how Gordon communicates.....word, intuition, emotion, other........either way he seems to be pondering within other possible realms. Whether these have a material basis, demonic, or otherwise is not for me to say.

To go beyond the pale is not an unhealthy pursuit, in my opinion, providing one does not try to coerce others, He seems to have indicated that he is still in investigation mode.

While he has been aggressive at times, this may well be somewhat justified. One only has to look at some of the abuse rendered in his personal profile to make that claim.
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19-12-2014, 04:01 PM
RE: Gordonic Derrangement- Not Pleased to Meet You Twice
What do you hope to achieve here Gordon?

How will you know when you have achieved it?

What progress have you made so far?
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