Gun Control thoughts
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05-09-2016, 08:37 PM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
“By law, the system must remain intricate, thorny, and all but impenetrable.”

I didn’t know this and I wonder how many of you do. It’s mind-bending.

"There's no telling how many guns we have in America—and when one gets used in a crime, no way for the cops to connect it to its owner. The only place the police can turn for help is a Kafkaesque agency in West Virginia, where, thanks to the gun lobby, computers are illegal and detective work is absurdly antiquated. On purpose. Thing is, the geniuses who work there are quietly inventing ways to do the impossible.”

http://www.gq.com/story/inside-federal-b...-many-guns

"So here's a news flash, from Charlie: “We ain't got a registration system. Ain't nobody registering no damn guns.”
There is no national database of guns. We have no centralized record of who owns all the firearms we so vigorously debate, no hard data regarding how many people own them, how many of them are bought or sold, or how many even exist.
What we have instead is Charlie.”

"The National Tracing Center is not allowed to have centralized computer data.
“That's the big no-no,” says Charlie.
That’s been a federal law, thanks to the NRA, since 1986: No searchable database of America’s gun owners."

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
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05-09-2016, 08:51 PM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(05-09-2016 08:37 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  “By law, the system must remain intricate, thorny, and all but impenetrable.”

I didn’t know this and I wonder how many of you do. It’s mind-bending.

"There's no telling how many guns we have in America—and when one gets used in a crime, no way for the cops to connect it to its owner. The only place the police can turn for help is a Kafkaesque agency in West Virginia, where, thanks to the gun lobby, computers are illegal and detective work is absurdly antiquated. On purpose. Thing is, the geniuses who work there are quietly inventing ways to do the impossible.”

http://www.gq.com/story/inside-federal-b...-many-guns

"So here's a news flash, from Charlie: “We ain't got a registration system. Ain't nobody registering no damn guns.”
There is no national database of guns. We have no centralized record of who owns all the firearms we so vigorously debate, no hard data regarding how many people own them, how many of them are bought or sold, or how many even exist.
What we have instead is Charlie.”

"The National Tracing Center is not allowed to have centralized computer data.
“That's the big no-no,” says Charlie.
That’s been a federal law, thanks to the NRA, since 1986: No searchable database of America’s gun owners."

And if there were a central database of that sort, what purpose would it serve?
Criminal ownership would not be in there, so what problem would be solved?

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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05-09-2016, 10:12 PM (This post was last modified: 06-09-2016 05:38 AM by DLJ.)
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(05-09-2016 08:51 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(05-09-2016 08:37 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  “By law, the system must remain intricate, thorny, and all but impenetrable.”

I didn’t know this and I wonder how many of you do. It’s mind-bending.

"There's no telling how many guns we have in America—and when one gets used in a crime, no way for the cops to connect it to its owner. The only place the police can turn for help is a Kafkaesque agency in West Virginia, where, thanks to the gun lobby, computers are illegal and detective work is absurdly antiquated. On purpose. Thing is, the geniuses who work there are quietly inventing ways to do the impossible.”

http://www.gq.com/story/inside-federal-b...-many-guns

"So here's a news flash, from Charlie: “We ain't got a registration system. Ain't nobody registering no damn guns.”
There is no national database of guns. We have no centralized record of who owns all the firearms we so vigorously debate, no hard data regarding how many people own them, how many of them are bought or sold, or how many even exist.
What we have instead is Charlie.”

"The National Tracing Center is not allowed to have centralized computer data.
“That's the big no-no,” says Charlie.
That’s been a federal law, thanks to the NRA, since 1986: No searchable database of America’s gun owners."

And if there were a central database of that sort, what purpose would it serve?
Criminal ownership would not be in there, so what problem would be solved?

If you're not on the database ... you're a criminal.

QED.

(data integrity notwithstanding)

Drinking Beverage

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06-09-2016, 05:29 AM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(05-09-2016 08:51 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(05-09-2016 08:37 PM)Full Circle Wrote:  “By law, the system must remain intricate, thorny, and all but impenetrable.”

I didn’t know this and I wonder how many of you do. It’s mind-bending.

"There's no telling how many guns we have in America—and when one gets used in a crime, no way for the cops to connect it to its owner. The only place the police can turn for help is a Kafkaesque agency in West Virginia, where, thanks to the gun lobby, computers are illegal and detective work is absurdly antiquated. On purpose. Thing is, the geniuses who work there are quietly inventing ways to do the impossible.”

http://www.gq.com/story/inside-federal-b...-many-guns

"So here's a news flash, from Charlie: “We ain't got a registration system. Ain't nobody registering no damn guns.”
There is no national database of guns. We have no centralized record of who owns all the firearms we so vigorously debate, no hard data regarding how many people own them, how many of them are bought or sold, or how many even exist.
What we have instead is Charlie.”

"The National Tracing Center is not allowed to have centralized computer data.
“That's the big no-no,” says Charlie.
That’s been a federal law, thanks to the NRA, since 1986: No searchable database of America’s gun owners."

And if there were a central database of that sort, what purpose would it serve?
Criminal ownership would not be in there, so what problem would be solved?

^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^


..............

What purpose does it serve to pass a law that's only followed by the law abiding citizen --- who isn't the problem in the first place?????

.....

I suspect it's so hand wringers can say "We're DOING SOMETHING!!!!"....

.....


....

.......................................

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06-09-2016, 07:12 AM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(05-09-2016 10:12 PM)DLJ Wrote:  
(05-09-2016 08:51 PM)Chas Wrote:  And if there were a central database of that sort, what purpose would it serve?
Criminal ownership would not be in there, so what problem would be solved?

If you're not on the database ... you're a criminal.

QED.

(data integrity notwithstanding)

Drinking Beverage

Facepalm

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Science is not a subject, but a method.
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06-09-2016, 07:12 AM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(06-09-2016 05:29 AM)onlinebiker Wrote:  
(05-09-2016 08:51 PM)Chas Wrote:  And if there were a central database of that sort, what purpose would it serve?
Criminal ownership would not be in there, so what problem would be solved?

^^^^^^ THIS ^^^^^^^


..............

What purpose does it serve to pass a law that's only followed by the law abiding citizen --- who isn't the problem in the first place?????

.....

I suspect it's so hand wringers can say "We're DOING SOMETHING!!!!"....

.....


....

Did you guys read the article? A database would make the tracing centre's work of identifying the place of purchase of a particular gun used in a crime a lot easier. Currently they perform the traces by hand and they *still* bring criminals to book.

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06-09-2016, 07:31 AM (This post was last modified: 06-09-2016 07:49 AM by Chas.)
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(06-09-2016 07:12 AM)morondog Wrote:  Did you guys read the article? A database would make the tracing centre's work of identifying the place of purchase of a particular gun used in a crime a lot easier. Currently they perform the traces by hand and they *still* bring criminals to book.

Quote:Say there's a murder. Blood everywhere, a dead guy on the floor. The cops come in with their yellow tape, chalk line, the little booties, cameras, swabs, the fingerprint dust. One of them finds a gun on the floor. The gun! He lifts it with his pinkie, examines it, takes note of the serial number. Back at the station, they run a trace on the gun. A name pops up. It's the wife! Or: It's the business partner! It's somebody's gun, and this is so exciting because now they know who did it.

How often do you suppose a gun's legal owner leaves the gun at the scene? Consider

A good approximation would be 'never'.

Why do you think criminals generally use firearms obtained illegally?

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06-09-2016, 07:37 AM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(06-09-2016 07:31 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(06-09-2016 07:12 AM)morondog Wrote:  Did you guys read the article? A database would make the tracing centre's work of identifying the place of purchase of a particular gun used in a crime a lot easier. Currently they perform the traces by hand and they *still* bring criminals to book.

Quote:Say there's a murder. Blood everywhere, a dead guy on the floor. The cops come in with their yellow tape, chalk line, the little booties, cameras, swabs, the fingerprint dust. One of them finds a gun on the floor. The gun! He lifts it with his pinkie, examines it, takes note of the serial number. Back at the station, they run a trace on the gun. A name pops up. It's the wife! Or: It's the business partner! It's somebody's gun, and this is so exciting because now they know who did it.

How often do you suppose a gun's legal owner leaves the gun at the scene? Consider

A good approximation would be 'never'.

Why do you think criminals generally use firearms obtained illegally?

No waiting period and a serious discount on second-hand products?

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06-09-2016, 07:58 AM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
Guns in America: For every criminal killed in self-defense, 34 innocent people die
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06-09-2016, 08:02 AM
RE: Gun Control thoughts
(06-09-2016 07:58 AM)Gawdzilla Wrote:  Guns in America: For every criminal killed in self-defense, 34 innocent people die

Apples and oranges.

First, remove the suicides from those numbers.

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