Harmless Eccentricity?
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17-12-2014, 11:44 AM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 10:34 AM)unfogged Wrote:  
(17-12-2014 10:06 AM)666wannabe Wrote:  I am interested in the views of others on this forum.

Pretty much in agreement. I used to be an apatheist because I really don't care what anybody believes as long as they don't try to enforce it without good reasons. I have become much more open and vocal about not buying into it because of the increasing push from the religious to force others to live by their beliefs with no demonstrable evidence that those beliefs are justified.

If you don't want to get gay married, don't. If you think masturbation is wrong, don't. If you think it is bad to work on your Sabbath, don't. Leave everybody else alone to live their own lives as they see fit and we'll return the favor.

Amen

If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities.--Voltaire.

"To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." --Thomas Paine.
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17-12-2014, 11:47 AM (This post was last modified: 17-12-2014 12:04 PM by 666wannabe.)
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 10:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  Well, what are you going to do? Gravity and sunlight also cause sever damage to societies. Religion is part of being human. You can gripe about it, but it's not going to change. You either fight the satanic religions or you succumb to them, but don't think for one minute that atheism is going to win out.

The slaughter of the school children in Peshawar? They'd slaughter atheists even faster. And if atheists were to take over, they'd slaughter millions, too? Why? Because atheism is just another religion. It makes the state God rather than a marble statue.

The difference is that gravity and sunlight do far more good than harm (along with water and fire), besides, only a religious (magical) thinker would believe that he/she could violate the law of gravity with impunity.

If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities.--Voltaire.

"To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." --Thomas Paine.
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17-12-2014, 12:01 PM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 10:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  Well, what are you going to do? Gravity and sunlight also cause sever damage to societies. Religion is part of being human. You can gripe about it, but it's not going to change. You either fight the satanic religions or you succumb to them, but don't think for one minute that atheism is going to win out.

The slaughter of the school children in Peshawar? They'd slaughter atheists even faster. And if atheists were to take over, they'd slaughter millions, too? Why? Because atheism is just another religion. It makes the state God rather than a marble statue.

Utter bullshit you friggin jackass.

“Truth does not demand belief. Scientists do not join hands every Sunday, singing, yes, gravity is real! I will have faith! I will be strong! I believe in my heart that what goes up, up, up, must come down, down, down. Amen! If they did, we would think they were pretty insecure about it.”
— Dan Barker —
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17-12-2014, 12:19 PM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
My primary problem with religion is it promotes as its highest values, faith, ignorance, obedience, and exclusivenes,; and celebrates people who embrace these values. These values are in direct opposition to knowledge, experimentation, questioning, and inclusiveness, all of which are requirements of healthy individuals and societies.
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17-12-2014, 02:05 PM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 10:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  Religion is part of being human.

Religion is part of being human. Gotcha.


(17-12-2014 10:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  You can gripe about it, but it's not going to change.

It's going no where. It's a part of us. Check.


(17-12-2014 10:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  You either fight the satanic religions or you succumb to them, but don't think for one minute that atheism is going to win out.

Atheism will not win out. Of course not. Because religion isn't going away. Check.


(17-12-2014 10:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  Because atheism is just another religion. It makes the state God rather than a marble statue.

...because atheism is... another religion? Wait. I thought religions weren't going away and atheism was going to lose out.

What the actual fuck? You couldn't even maintain a cognizant stream of thought for two short paragraphs. Jesus Christ, learn to troll better. This is just sad.
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17-12-2014, 03:40 PM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 10:06 AM)666wannabe Wrote:  It is my belief that if religion were simply a harmless eccentricity, there would be no reason for anyone to oppose it. I believe that, within reasonable limits, people should have the liberty to believe what they will. However, religion, as evidenced by the recent slaughter of innocent school children in Peshawar, is not just a harmless eccentricity. Religious thinking causes severe damage to societies and to individuals.

I am starting this thread in order to enumerate and discuss the damages that religion does. I am convinced that the damages far outweigh to good done by religion.

There are, at a minimum, 4 categories of these damages:
1. Political, for example, anti-human rights legislation passed at the urging of the religious right.
2. Social, for example, homophobia, misogyny, and all forms of bias and prejudice aimed at anyone who does not fit the religious mold.
3. Psychological, for example, the feeling of existential guilt inculcated by the belief that it is our fault that we are not perfect beings--as "God" intended us to be.
4. Intellectual, for example, the bible based belief that faith (the will to believe) can be evidence for anything. (Hebrews 11:1), According to this belief, one could conclude that my will to believe that my significant other is being faithful to me is better evidence than the love letter from her boyfriend that I found in her coat pocket. It is just bad (dare I say, ridiculous) epistemology.

I am interested in the views of others on this forum.

I have heard consequences described for those four areas for atheists and the atheist worldview as well as for the religious worldview, but that is beside the point to me since you wrote "It is my belief that if religion were simply a harmless eccentricity..."

Are you saying that a worldview that 80% of people or more have worldwide is an eccentricity or an aberration? That makes no sense to me.

I'm told atheists on forums like TTA are bitter and angry. If you are not, your posts to me will be respectful, insightful and thoughtful. Prove me wrong by your adherence to decent behavior.
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17-12-2014, 03:40 PM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 10:28 AM)Vosur Wrote:  
(17-12-2014 10:16 AM)Gordon Wrote:  Gravity and sunlight also cause sever damage to societies.
*severe

[Image: 0t82Piy.png]
*Sever

It's an approximate measurement of how much ass Lucy Liu can kick in ninety minutes.

[Image: 1e4u5WH.png?1]

Soulless mutants of muscle and intent. There are billions of us; hardy, smart and dangerous. Shaped by millions of years of death. We are the definitive alpha predator. We build monsters of fire and stone. We bottled the sun. We nailed our god to a stick.

In man's struggle against the world, bet on the man.
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17-12-2014, 08:01 PM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 03:40 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  [quote='666wannabe' pid='702171' dateline='1418832397']

I have heard consequences described for those four areas for atheists and the atheist worldview as well as for the religious worldview, but that is beside the point to me since you wrote "It is my belief that if religion were simply a harmless eccentricity..."

Are you saying that a worldview that 80% of people or more have worldwide is an eccentricity or an aberration? That makes no sense to me.

I am saying that belief that faith can serve as evidence is aberrant epistemology, but as long as this remains a harmless eccentricity, it presents no problem.

If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities.--Voltaire.

"To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." --Thomas Paine.
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18-12-2014, 07:36 AM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
(17-12-2014 03:40 PM)The Q Continuum Wrote:  Are you saying that a worldview that 80% of people or more have worldwide is an eccentricity or an aberration? That makes no sense to me.

It doesn't surprise me that reality makes no sense to you.

Does it also make no sense to you that very very large numbers of humans have two arms and two legs ?

Large populations can have the same worldview and that worldview can be wrong. Flat earth, Sun orbiting earth with earth as the center of the universe, and any number of superstitions, beliefs in afterlife, ghosts and of course my favorite, that I deserve an eternity of punishment for not buying into bullshit

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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18-12-2014, 11:11 AM
RE: Harmless Eccentricity?
Gordon,

Of that 80% (which is questionable to begin with), how many profess beliefs that are genuine and how many profess beliefs for other reasons, such as the mistaken belief that the benefits of teaching children to believe makes them behave more morally? Or those that profess to believe because that it is a very good way to increase your influence and/or bank account? Or those (children) that profess belief in order to avoid punishment from their families. Or those whose profession of belief is simply traditional and they don't want to rock the boat. Those that truly believe, I would venture, is far less than that statistic suggests.

If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities.--Voltaire.

"To argue with a man who has renounced the use and authority of reason is like administering medicine to the dead." --Thomas Paine.
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