Has atheism become religion?
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14-07-2013, 09:18 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
(07-07-2013 12:34 PM)Raven11 Wrote:  Considering the fact that many atheists are starting to act like this is a religion to them.

I think you confuse religion with passion. There is nothing wrong with being passionate.

(07-07-2013 12:34 PM)Raven11 Wrote:  From atheist churches

I agree that is a little strange.

(07-07-2013 12:34 PM)Raven11 Wrote:  defending the lack of belief

What's the problem with that?

(07-07-2013 12:34 PM)Raven11 Wrote:  insulting those who aren't atheists

I don't see how it would turn atheism into a religion.

(07-07-2013 12:34 PM)Raven11 Wrote:  all the way down to the atheist monument.

I agree that the monument is unecessary, even though the context makes it a bit understandable IMO. I think atheists should try to promote and spread knowledge and education instead of building monuments.

(07-07-2013 12:34 PM)Raven11 Wrote:  Has atheism become a religion, why or why not?

It has not.

"Examine the religious principles, which have, in fact, prevailed in the world. You will scarcely be persuaded, that they are any thing but sick men's dreams." - David Hume
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15-07-2013, 01:13 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
No, it hasn't and never will. I'll pinpoint a few things, my apologies if I'm repeating what's been already said:

The gatherings are not much different from all others who share a common interest, such as geeks, fashion victims, car fanatics etc... It's a human trait to form groups dedicated to something they share, nothing unusual and wrong with it.

Monuments isn't anything unusual either, you got lots of them symbolizing some kind of victory over oppression and they're all over the place. They don't have to have some religious meaning whatsoever.

As for the so called heroes (Dawkins, Hitchens etc...), they are just a few representatives of the group who speak out in public. Other than that, they are just humans like everybody else. Many of us agree with what they say, but agreeing doesn't automatically mean "worshipping". People don't pray to any of them for the cure of cancer or the newest iPhone under the xmas tree.

Oh yeah, and then there's this thing why raise the voice in the first place? Well, as some grew up religious and according to the damage that it has done to their lives, it's their damn right to talk about it in order to cope and come to terms with it.

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15-07-2013, 04:48 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
Atheism is not a religion because It is state of disbelief.
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15-07-2013, 06:17 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
(15-07-2013 04:48 AM)Riqposso Wrote:  Atheism is not a religion because It is state of disbelief.

You are 100% correct, but try explaining that to someone who is certain that the whole planet Earth is 6000 years old... I tried multiple times, now I don't post in this section anymore. That is how much luck I had.

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15-07-2013, 06:52 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
(15-07-2013 06:17 AM)Filox Wrote:  ...now I don't post in this section anymore.

Dodgy

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15-07-2013, 10:50 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
(13-07-2013 01:36 PM)Chas Wrote:  Atheism is simply not believing in any god.
The lack of belief in gods is often the result of critical thinking, which includes skepticism.
I have no problem understanding that so long as I understand what your interpretation of the term god is. I do not define God the same. Hence to me you do believe in a god, only it is a false one in my view.
Quote:Critical thinking leads to an acceptance of the scientific method for discovering knowledge of the natural world. Science requires evidence.
This, in turn, reinforces skepticism and critical thinking.
If you also contemplated critically how you critically think, and if you also were equally skeptical about your skepticism, I would say you are well balanced in your reasoning. Science however by it's current definition is a study of what is our physical world and how it works. To trust in science for answers to the meaning of our existence, would not address the issue.
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15-07-2013, 11:23 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
(13-07-2013 02:04 PM)Buddy Wrote:  There have been many imaginary gods in history. Today there are millions, if not billions of imaginary gods.
Of course. But logically speaking, whatever the source of the energy that created the universe, it is not imaginary. It is possible to imagine what or who it is. The singularity that preceded the big bang precedes our existence in the order of time. Hence we obviously couldn't have imagined it. But since we are here in the course of time, it is quite possible that we were imagined by God ( the source of the energy that created the universe).

Quote: Every religious person has there own personal god that carries out duties to that particular person.
I don't think we should conflate religion with God, perhaps gods, images of God, and false gods.

Quote:All based on hearsay and a vivid imagination.
Not necessarily.
Quote:There is a lot of conflation going on.
True, also much misunderstanding accordingly.
Quote: An Atheist will describe god by your definition, as they only exist by your imagination and your description.
But by my definition of God I did not imagine Him as in conjure up. As I explained, that would be impossible. It could be also misrepresented in human language that nothing is realized without some sense of imagery.
Quote:Don't assume.
Easier said than done. There is also the accusation that I should have assumed this or that.

Quote:Atheists simply deny any gods exist outside the human imagination. That is all. That is strictly based on reason. It is the same as stating goblins do not exist except in fiction.
Assuming you are speaking for all atheists and I knowing I shouldn't assume, I will say that it is not reason at all. That is a conclusion made without reason. As you imagine that all gods are figments of man's imaginations, you are imagining not reasoning. Reasoning requires considering the opposing points equitably. Hence I find atheism a fundamental contradiction in reasoning and logic, even as I assume you know what you are talking about concerning atheism.
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15-07-2013, 11:41 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
(15-07-2013 11:23 AM)childeye Wrote:  Assuming you are speaking for all atheists and I knowing I shouldn't assume, I will say that it is not reason at all. That is a conclusion made without reason. As you imagine that all gods are figments of man's imaginations, you are imagining not reasoning. Reasoning requires considering the opposing points equitably. Hence I find atheism a fundamental contradiction in reasoning and logic, even as I assume you know what you are talking about concerning atheism.

Oh, you're going to have to do better than that...

There is absolutely no evidence for any supernatural agency in the real world, up to an including god(s). There are no events, explainable by supernatural means, which are not, at minimum, equally explicable by purely natural means. Further, supernatural explanations admit of no useful predictions by definition. Therefore not believing in such existence is perfectly reasonable.

The deist prime-mover figure - for which there is an arguable case - fits no definition of God beyond the trivial. It does not intervene. It does not direct. It is not even necessarily supernatural. We literally don't know for sure - that's the point - but it bears absolutely no resemblence to the far more elaborate, far more extensive, far more detailed, far more contradictory, and far more falsifiable claims made by any established religion.

You've stated your own - ah, interesting - theology, and it is quite obvious that the conclusion does not follow from the premises. It is not reasonable.

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15-07-2013, 11:43 AM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
I guess I would have to ask the person who asked if atheism is a religion what they thought a religion was. They should also define what they think atheism is and compare the two for similarities. The answer will be self evident, I think.

The general consensus of definitions describing religions list as their top preference things like, " Religion may be defined broadly as the human quest for, experience of, and response to the holy or sacred. This universal human activity expresses itself in at least three ways: in thought (the intellectual expression), in action (the practical expression), and in fellowship (the communal expression)." ref: here

Atheism is generally defined as "the negation of theism, the denial of the existence of God(s)." ref: Here

They seem to be polar opposites to my way of thinking. As for atheist "churches", it is beyond me why they would name their gatherings after something that has been anathema to non-believers since the dawn of time. Huh

The same test can be used on religion and atheism for those who wish to call atheism a "belief". If you find yourself having to exempt any part (or the whole) of your tenets/dogma/beliefs from rigorous scrutiny for the purpose of maintaining it, then it must be rejected as flawed.

If you believe in telekinesis, raise my hand. Dodgy
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15-07-2013, 12:39 PM
RE: Has atheism become religion?
(15-07-2013 11:23 AM)childeye Wrote:  
(13-07-2013 02:04 PM)Buddy Wrote:  There have been many imaginary gods in history. Today there are millions, if not billions of imaginary gods.
Of course. But logically speaking, whatever the source of the energy that created the universe, it is not imaginary. It is possible to imagine what or who it is. The singularity that preceded the big bang precedes our existence in the order of time. Hence we obviously couldn't have imagined it. But since we are here in the course of time, it is quite possible that we were imagined by God ( the source of the energy that created the universe).

Quote: Every religious person has there own personal god that carries out duties to that particular person.
I don't think we should conflate religion with God, perhaps gods, images of God, and false gods.

Quote:All based on hearsay and a vivid imagination.
Not necessarily.
Quote:There is a lot of conflation going on.
True, also much misunderstanding accordingly.
Quote: An Atheist will describe god by your definition, as they only exist by your imagination and your description.
But by my definition of God I did not imagine Him as in conjure up. As I explained, that would be impossible. It could be also misrepresented in human language that nothing is realized without some sense of imagery.
Quote:Don't assume.
Easier said than done. There is also the accusation that I should have assumed this or that.

Quote:Atheists simply deny any gods exist outside the human imagination. That is all. That is strictly based on reason. It is the same as stating goblins do not exist except in fiction.
Assuming you are speaking for all atheists and I knowing I shouldn't assume, I will say that it is not reason at all. That is a conclusion made without reason. As you imagine that all gods are figments of man's imaginations, you are imagining not reasoning. Reasoning requires considering the opposing points equitably. Hence I find atheism a fundamental contradiction in reasoning and logic, even as I assume you know what you are talking about concerning atheism.
There you are contradicting yourself again. Too many times to count.
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