Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
21-10-2013, 06:51 PM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
(21-10-2013 06:43 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  The dirtiest election was probably John Quincy Adams vs Old Hickory Andrew Jackson. That one had mudslinging on an unprecedented level and ended up with a back room deal that gave Adams the presidency and Jackson's supporters cried foul for four years.

True. 1824 is pretty much the definition of electoral clusterfuck.

Though 1876 was a right mess too.

I know it's Cracked (eeeeew) but hmm.

... this is my signature!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-10-2013, 02:06 PM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
I'm pretty sure that Dubya Bush was hated more than Obama, but no one was hated more than living troll VP Dick Cheney. I he's the reason no one really tried to assassinate Bush. The last thing anybody wanted was Cheney to have total power instead of just pulling the strings.

Obama doesn't seem to be as hated as, I dare say, he should be. Bush was hated for warring more than Obama seems to be. Bush was hated for raising the debt more than Obama seems to be--and Obama raised it faster.

Every president is pretty roundly hated, even Reagan was, and he was still very popular. I would argue, though, that the most despised US president of all time was probably Nixon based on public opinion--and that he seems to have been hated longer than anyone else.

The bigger problem is Republicans and Democrats, who always vehemently hate the opposing side--often to the point of raging hypocrisy. There were constant anti-war protests during Dubya's term, but almost none under Obama--despite him being every bit as much a warmonger. Clearly, people weren't anti-war so long as they were anti-the-guy-we-voted-for, and that's pretty pathetic. If you're really against war, you should be against it when the guy you voted for is doing it.

I'm personally of the mindset that Bush and Obama were the same kind of tyrannical power-hungry monster, drastically expanding the government, making Americans more paranoid and less safe, reducing freedoms to masses sadly eager to lose ever more, spreading war around everywhere they could.

But going back in time we have:

Lyndon Johnson expanded Vietnam into a full-blown nightmare.
Nixon spied on his perceived enemies and got caught, and started a new ever-present "war on drugs" which continues to cost us billions of dollars a year to constant losses.
Kennedy botched relations with Cuba and the Soviet Union and was about to be impeached when he was killed.
Reagan had the Iran-Contra affair and the 80's explosion of drug violence.
Bush Sr raised taxes after making it a point to base his campaign on precisely the opposite.
Carter had the Iran hostage crisis and was generally just considered kind of lame to my understanding.
Obama has wars, increased taxes, increased debts, a broken "health care" system, drone strikes against innocent people.
Bush Jr has wars, increased debts, anti-intellectualism, massively increased government, lacked basic communication skills.
Eisenhower added "under god" to a bunch of things where it didn't need to be.
Truman nuked Japan.

None of them are without their screw-ups and debacles. Except for maybe William Henry Harrison because he died in about a month, so he wasn't even president long enough to screw up too many things.

This is the signature.

http://www.FromNothingGameStudios.com
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-10-2013, 07:08 PM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
There are those that hate Reagen more than Bush or Obama, but I think you generally nailed it. In my opinion appearances had a lot to do with why Bush was more hated than Obama. Obama has largely continued the same practices that Bush implemented, and generally broadened them. Obama is a much better speaker and has better speech writers. Then are are those that love Obama because he is black and intelligent and would have loved him regardless of his policies. America isn't very well informed. They will just go off of feelings.

As far as I'm concerned though we haven't had a great president in this century, or the last. Certainly not since the Great Depression in my opinion.

Some are certainly worse than others. Since World War 2 alone I'd consider Johnson, Nixon, Bush, Bush Jr and Obama to be particularly bad. One thing all these people have in common is that they are/were particularly disgusting warmongers and saber-rattlers. This is not a coincidence.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-10-2013, 09:14 PM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
(29-10-2013 07:08 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  As far as I'm concerned though we haven't had a great president in this century, or the last. Certainly not since the Great Depression in my opinion.

Jimmy Carter.

(I'm not even kidding. And it's not just because his administration reintroduced craft beer!)

But he was too good for this sinful world, and was duly booted out come 1980.

... this is my signature!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-10-2013, 09:40 PM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
(29-10-2013 09:14 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(29-10-2013 07:08 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  As far as I'm concerned though we haven't had a great president in this century, or the last. Certainly not since the Great Depression in my opinion.

Jimmy Carter.

(I'm not even kidding. And it's not just because his administration reintroduced craft beer!)

But he was too good for this sinful world, and was duly booted out come 1980.

Jimmy Carter was okay. He also wasn't on my 'worst of' list. Mostly he was unmemorable, which I would call a success by comparison. As you mentioned, he legalized home-brewing again. Regrettably after his presidency he advocating fot ending the war on drugs. Jimmy is okay in my book.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-10-2013, 10:03 PM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
(29-10-2013 09:40 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Jimmy Carter was okay. He also wasn't on my 'worst of' list. Mostly he was unmemorable, which I would call a success by comparison. As you mentioned, he legalized home-brewing again. Regrettably after his presidency he advocating fot ending the war on drugs. Jimmy is okay in my book.

His post-official work shows him for (IMO) the best person to fill the office.

In my post facto and cynical reading of it, he was the only one in modern times to dare question the EXCEPTIONALISM FOREVER! attitude you sometimes (yeah, sometimes Rolleyes ) see down there.

Which shows in his foreign policy, arms reductions, standardisation of education; above all in the wildly transgressive suggestion that energy and ecological actions actually did have consequences. (and there's things like being the first administration to admit that gays existed, and, as mentioned, the beer). But he didn't get on well with his Congress and all anybody remembers is Iran.

And after saying "maybe we have to actually take a bit of a long-term view here, America, and say that things can't be the same forever," Reagan countered that with "NUH UH we can totally solve all our problems by ignoring them forever" and, well, here we are.

... this is my signature!
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
29-10-2013, 10:29 PM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
(29-10-2013 10:03 PM)cjlr Wrote:  
(29-10-2013 09:40 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Jimmy Carter was okay. He also wasn't on my 'worst of' list. Mostly he was unmemorable, which I would call a success by comparison. As you mentioned, he legalized home-brewing again. Regrettably after his presidency he advocating fot ending the war on drugs. Jimmy is okay in my book.

His post-official work shows him for (IMO) the best person to fill the office.

In my post facto and cynical reading of it, he was the only one in modern times to dare question the EXCEPTIONALISM FOREVER! attitude you sometimes (yeah, sometimes Rolleyes ) see down there.

Which shows in his foreign policy, arms reductions, standardisation of education; above all in the wildly transgressive suggestion that energy and ecological actions actually did have consequences. (and there's things like being the first administration to admit that gays existed, and, as mentioned, the beer). But he didn't get on well with his Congress and all anybody remembers is Iran.

And after saying "maybe we have to actually take a bit of a long-term view here, America, and say that things can't be the same forever," Reagan countered that with "NUH UH we can totally solve all our problems by ignoring them forever" and, well, here we are.

I'd argue that he grew (politically, and philosophically) after his tenure as president. Not to say he didn't face opposition in Congress, and not to say that he always got his way, but I think he was wiser in the decades after his 'retirement'. Also, not implying that he didn't have some good ideas in office either, just to clarify.

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
30-10-2013, 02:43 AM
Re: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
Carter got a lot of flack at the time but most of why that is flawed. People we mad because there was some economic lows and he basically called out the country saying it's going to be worse unless people get their heads out of their asses.

He was right, and a lot of his goals were long term beneficial solutions like cutting foreign oil independence. Then the Reagan team arrived and put in more immediate impact short term boosters.

"Allow there to be a spectrum in all that you see" - Neil Degrasse Tyson
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
30-10-2013, 07:31 AM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
(29-10-2013 07:08 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  There are those that hate Reagen more than Bush or Obama, but I think you generally nailed it. In my opinion appearances had a lot to do with why Bush was more hated than Obama. Obama has largely continued the same practices that Bush implemented, and generally broadened them. Obama is a much better speaker and has better speech writers. Then are are those that love Obama because he is black and intelligent and would have loved him regardless of his policies. America isn't very well informed. They will just go off of feelings.

As far as I'm concerned though we haven't had a great president in this century, or the last. Certainly not since the Great Depression in my opinion.

Some are certainly worse than others. Since World War 2 alone I'd consider Johnson, Nixon, Bush, Bush Jr and Obama to be particularly bad. One thing all these people have in common is that they are/were particularly disgusting warmongers and saber-rattlers. This is not a coincidence.

Theodore Roosevelt. The National Parks. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
30-10-2013, 08:36 AM
RE: Have Presidents Always Been Hated This Much?
Carter got a bad rap because people always forget that it can take years or decades for the consequences of actions to be felt. If something bad happens today, they blame the man currently in office, even if it's the direct result of something someone else did 10 years earlier.

Nixon's popularity was low after the Pentagon Papers scandal when Americans realized how bad the Vietnam War was. But the government didn't have enough money to pay for the War without raising taxes, which would have made Nixon even more unpopular. So, with the Nixon Shock, he effectively stole all the world's gold, and started printing money like crazy to pay for Vietnam, and also to buy votes. It worked like a charm. He was re-elected by a landslide despite all the scandals, because voters only cared about the present, and having a Fed print boatloads of money for everyone feels great in the present.

But, as the Austrian economists warned, this is a regressive consumption tax that wipes out the poor and middle class and leads to high inflation that destroys the economy because, without stable prices, businesses sign long term contracts or plan for the future. The effects hit several years later during Carter's time, and so everybody blamed Carter for the shitty economy, high inflation, and erosion of wealth.

Sadly, though, we never learn. Hollande's administration has admitted that, although they expected to lose France's old money with Hollande's 'soak the rich' pledge, they were surprised that young entrepreneurs fresh out of college start fleeing France in droves as well. But the economic activity of those young people won't be seen for 10 or 20 years. So, the real cost of Hollande's policies will be felt decades from now. But when that comes, the French will blame whoever is in charge at that time.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes frankksj's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: