Help with "you're taking that one passage out of context"
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17-07-2013, 08:56 AM
RE: Help with "you're taking that one passage out of context"
(17-07-2013 03:31 AM)Mark Fulton Wrote:  Firstly, what happened to KC? I really want him to elaborate like he promised.

...He was an educated, savvy, Greek-speaking sophisticate who knew a stack more about selling religion to the subjects of the Empire than the anti-Roman bumpkins from the backwater of Galilee!

LMAO! Sort of a bronze age L. Ron Hubbard.
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17-07-2013, 09:31 AM
RE: Help with "you're taking that one passage out of context"
Quote:You can cite verse, passage, chapter, or book and still be awash in magic, guilt, shame, false history, misogeny, homophobia, slavery, eternal damnation, racism, slaughter, narcissism, and general weirdness.

Not only that, but the reason there are so many Xian denominations is because of the differences of opinion about, and emphasis on, said verses, passages, chapters, and books. Some factions, like the Catholics, even have more books in their Bible (the Apocrypha) than, say, the Protestants. God can't seem to exert much control over his message, it seems.

As for "second biblical authors", we don't even know who really wrote most of the Bible in the first place, as we don't have the original documents. Plus, there is evidence that the books have been edited and added to by multiple authors over time (particularly in the OT, as the Jews wrestled back and forth between polytheism and monotheism).

Sometimes I wonder what you seek to accomplish here. Are you trying to shore up your own doubts, or simply earning points with your Xian peers by engaging with the heathens? Actually I'm kind of glad for your posts, because they inspire me to do more and more research - and I always find good stuff that makes your position as shaky as Ray Comfort would be in a wrestling match with AronRa.

You are underlining my points for me:

1. "Quoting chapter and verse" but still having bad doctrine is precisely what I'd spoken of in my last post... quoting more than one verse or a verse snippet... like "The Bible says there is no God" when it says in Psalm 14:1/Psalm 53:1 "The fool says in their heart, 'There is no God.'"

2. You speak as if I'm ignorant of Christianity's factions. There is a great de-emphasis on individual Bible study in Roman Catholicism. But as I've pointed out to Catholic friends, all 14,000 Protestant and non-denominational "schims" from the Roman church have commonalites, such as the Bible is superior to tradition, the mass is not transubstantiated, Christian may interpret the Bible and pray to God without having priests as intercessors, etc. I find much more cohesion that you do, especially where the Bible interpreters are genuinely born again.

3. Many scholars say there is textual evidence the Old Testament was redacted. I've never seen empirical evidence here, like changed Old Testaments, if you have some, please share them.

4. I appreciate your question as to why I post here. You likewise inspire me to learn more. I will say I'm not angry at freethinkers the way I've seen many freethinkers bitter and angry at the church and church members... but some people have been badly hurt in the past and I understand.
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17-07-2013, 12:10 PM
RE: Help with "you're taking that one passage out of context"
(17-07-2013 09:31 AM)PleaseJesus Wrote:  You are underlining my points for me:

I highly doubt it.

Quote:1. "Quoting chapter and verse" but still having bad doctrine is precisely what I'd spoken of in my last post... quoting more than one verse or a verse snippet... like "The Bible says there is no God" when it says in Psalm 14:1/Psalm 53:1 "The fool says in their heart, 'There is no God.'"

I don't believe anyone here is dumb, deluded, or dishonest enough to quote the Bible in the way that you describe in order to make a point. As for "bad doctrine", what doctrines do you mean? There are so many doctrinal conflicts between denominations that it boggles the mind (and that even includes so-called "core" doctrines like salvation, baptism, and damnation which, given the stakes involved, God should have been a lot clearer about). You're the one who suggests that people need to talk to the Bible's author to get info - if that works, then why is there so much conflict when it comes to Biblical interpretation and application?

Quote:2. You speak as if I'm ignorant of Christianity's factions. There is a great de-emphasis on individual Bible study in Roman Catholicism. But as I've pointed out to Catholic friends, all 14,000 Protestant and non-denominational "schims" from the Roman church have commonalites, such as the Bible is superior to tradition, the mass is not transubstantiated, Christian may interpret the Bible and pray to God without having priests as intercessors, etc. I find much more cohesion that you do, especially where the Bible interpreters are genuinely born again.

Less ignorant than deluded, like the rest of us who were formerly religious. ALL 14,000 Protestant and non-denominational "schisms" from the Roman church have commonalities, eh? Even if true, what does that prove? Nothing except that they differ from Catholicism, not that they teach any sort of Truth. As far as the bulk of this board is concerned, all denominations teach bogus information - that's why we are atheists. As for a "de-emphasis" on Biblical study - you know as well as I do that most Xians haven't read the Bible all the way through, and that instead they rely on their pastors and small group leaders to interpret it for them. Folk Xianity is a much more compelling force than actual study is in *any* denomination or faction.

Quote:3. Many scholars say there is textual evidence the Old Testament was redacted. I've never seen empirical evidence here, like changed Old Testaments, if you have some, please share them.

Perhaps if you'd read the books or watch the videos that other board members have suggested, you would have the empirical evidence you seek, as it is too comprehensive to put in one post. For a start, go to Youtube and check out Evid3nc3's videos on why he's not a Christian. He cites some books you should check out that, I'm afraid, aren't written by Ray Comfort or Josh McDowell, but were produced by actual Bible scholars.

Quote:4. I appreciate your question as to why I post here. You likewise inspire me to learn more. I will say I'm not angry at freethinkers the way I've seen many freethinkers bitter and angry at the church and church members... but some people have been badly hurt in the past and I understand.

Funny how you play the nice card now, when in the past you accused me of not having the "backbone" to leave abusive churches. Why should any Xian need backbone in what is supposed to be a loving environment that is supposed to accept and nuture all comers? The lack of love in most churches is yet another demonstration why there are no such things as sanctification, the Holy Spirit, or a saving Christ. It's all run by (mostly) men, and the sooner you realize that and bail on the madness, the sooner you can start living life to the fullest - because this life is all you've got.
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