History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
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18-03-2017, 07:46 AM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
(18-03-2017 07:44 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  
(18-03-2017 07:37 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  Inter species horizontal transfer of genetic material and endosymbiosis makes it a lot messier than a bush. Separate branches have been coming together to form new species throughout the history of life.

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Yes, this is more what I was thinking. What is
endosymbiosis?

http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary...mbiosis_03

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18-03-2017, 07:50 AM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
(18-03-2017 07:46 AM)Popeyes Pappy Wrote:  
(18-03-2017 07:44 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Yes, this is more what I was thinking. What is
endosymbiosis?

http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary...mbiosis_03
Thanks, I will read it!
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18-03-2017, 10:53 AM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
(18-03-2017 07:38 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Anyway, what is sort of the trust of this thread is to dispel the often misinformed cultural-centric repetition that human history is "cyclical" or "linear" or "always leading to progress". There're many different cultures in the world with different histories and entirely different approaches to life--and human activity isn't always progressive. You could say that industrial societies have invented electricity and computers and that is "progress", but they also invented the nuclear bomb and porn, etc.

OK.... although whether or not something is "progress" depends entirely on what values you are using to measure it I don't disagree agree with your general claim that neither history nor evolution is strictly linear or cyclical. I'm not sure anybody here holds that to be true. Maybe I'm just confused that you seem to have started off arguing a point instead of asking whether people agree or not.

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18-03-2017, 11:44 AM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
(18-03-2017 10:53 AM)unfogged Wrote:  
(18-03-2017 07:38 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Anyway, what is sort of the trust of this thread is to dispel the often misinformed cultural-centric repetition that human history is "cyclical" or "linear" or "always leading to progress". There're many different cultures in the world with different histories and entirely different approaches to life--and human activity isn't always progressive. You could say that industrial societies have invented electricity and computers and that is "progress", but they also invented the nuclear bomb and porn, etc.

OK.... although whether or not something is "progress" depends entirely on what values you are using to measure it I don't disagree agree with your general claim that neither history nor evolution is strictly linear or cyclical. I'm not sure anybody here holds that to be true. Maybe I'm just confused that you seem to have started off arguing a point instead of asking whether people agree or not.
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18-03-2017, 02:38 PM (This post was last modified: 18-03-2017 04:11 PM by Fred Hampton.)
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
I'm seein' horse here:

[Image: seaDragon2.jpg]

Er, scratch that, BIRDS, er, PLANTS:

[Image: Leafy_Sea_Dragon_(290117243).jpg]
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18-03-2017, 02:47 PM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
(18-03-2017 03:52 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Recorded human history, for one, is never all inclusive No and actual human history also proceeds in myriad non linear, non cyclical "directions" also based on adaptation to the resources of the material world.

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!

I think you need to read some history, mate. Big Grin

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18-03-2017, 04:09 PM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
(18-03-2017 02:47 PM)Banjo Wrote:  
(18-03-2017 03:52 AM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Recorded human history, for one, is never all inclusive No and actual human history also proceeds in myriad non linear, non cyclical "directions" also based on adaptation to the resources of the material world.

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!

I think you need to read some history, mate. Big Grin
Which one?
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18-03-2017, 06:09 PM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
History in my opinion is raw material. It can be linear if you study a certain element in a certain way. It can be unchanging, cyclical or chaotic if you study other ones. History is full of histories and depending how you look at them, why and who told them and why, you will very different understanding of it.

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18-03-2017, 06:47 PM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
Yeah, perhaps history does have Brownian motion to it.
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18-03-2017, 07:05 PM
RE: History Is Not Linear or Cyclical
(18-03-2017 04:09 PM)Fred Hampton Wrote:  Which one?

Human.

I've studied many cultures, from Europe to Asia and beyond. It is as Nietzsche called it, The eternal recurrence.

The same shit happens over and over again. Just slightly different.

Stalin differs in no real way to Constantine.

It's all the same. People get into trouble when they study just one period or area. Yes, the Flavians and Julian's differed. But not by much ultimately.

[EDIT]

I should point out I have the advantage of having read histories for 48 years now.

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