Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
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02-01-2012, 02:38 PM
Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
I had a debate with my parents at dinner tonight about religion; they (mostly my father) maintained the usual thing we all heard several times: The first of the biggest mass murders in history was all atheists Hitler, Stalin, Mao and so forth.
Then there´s the because of the bible Slavery was abandoned

Now I tried to counter the first about Hitler saying he wasn´t an atheist he was a catholic I said it was plainly written in main kamph.
Unfortunately I haven´t read it so he got me there with his denials yet he left an open hole there: basically what he said read it and show me the passages that supports the claim that Hitler was a Catholic.

I tired another tactic with the Well if Hitler was an Atheist why did his army say Gott ist mit uns and had it decorated on their banner and why do we have a picture with Hitler shaking hands with the pope?

Their answer all armies at that time swore by that, the Pope shaking hands with Hitler was more of an alliance then any proof of Hitlers supposed Catholicism.
Then there was the Priest Hitler had killed something they claim a Catholic would never do.

As for the rest I can´t remember the exact arguments used against that.

Now for the other argument that it was because of the Bible that slavery was abolished.
Now I heard several times that it wasn´t because of the Bible, but despite the Bible that slavery was abolished.
Also I hear several times in the Thinking Atheist Podcast show that there are in fact several passages in the New Testament that in fact supports or at least encourage slavery.

Now what I am asking here is would it be possible that you could help me find the facts that Hitler was in fact a Catholic plus the passages in the New Testament that supports or encourage slavery.
Why the new and not the old? Because my parents is of the belief that the Old Testament doesn´t count that only the new one should be looked at.

So please help.

Also on a side notice since there is the belief, that some of the greatest mass murders in history was atheists how about a list of people who has given some of the greatest contributions to society who have in fact been atheists.

Ps Sorry if the grammar is a bit of English is not my native language and . and , was never my strong side.

PPS Please don´t use any Wikipedia links they aren´t that well trusted in the house so my argument wouldn´t have any great merit at all if i used that.
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02-01-2012, 02:58 PM
RE: Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
Try this http://popeorhitler.com/ it has many quotes from hitler about christianity.

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02-01-2012, 03:07 PM
RE: Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
Hitler's religious view

Slavery in the New Testement

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02-01-2012, 03:10 PM
RE: Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
I would deal with your father's arguments a bit differently.
One thing is that he wasn't an atheist (Well, we can never be sure what the person really beliefs. We can be deceived), but even if he was - so what? It doesn't explain anything. It usually leads to hearing something about atheists being morally inferior to theists (I think it's better to be a good person just for the sake of being good person than being good because there is someone watching my every step).
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02-01-2012, 03:48 PM
RE: Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
(02-01-2012 03:10 PM)imralav Wrote:  I would deal with your father's arguments a bit differently.
One thing is that he wasn't an atheist (Well, we can never be sure what the person really beliefs. We can be deceived), but even if he was - so what? It doesn't explain anything. It usually leads to hearing something about atheists being morally inferior to theists (I think it's better to be a good person just for the sake of being good person than being good because there is someone watching my every step).

Hitler was a a christian atheist haha because only atheists can be the " real" christians, ironically enough

See humanism, secularism, materialism , socialism , the materialistic form of liberalism, nazism, fascism, religious & secular fundamentalism ..............= degenerate lower forms of christianity as Niezsche so well put it concerning humanism at least

because christianity was an idea , an ideal that could never be realised on the reality ground, degenerate forms of it neither
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02-01-2012, 03:56 PM
RE: Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
You can look here for a similar thread from a long ass time ago (I think it was my first post on this forum). Some of the opinions expressed there are from members that aren't on here anymore so it's worth perusing.

First off, I own a copy of Mein Kampf and it clearly states several times that he is doing God's work in his destruction of the Jews, but theists usually have a convoluted response in their pockets for just such an occasion (well Hitler only claimed that to get the people on his side!). You could go into "without religion to use as a tool, these type of genocides wouldn't have anything 'divinely inspired' to hide behind" or you could go into "if he were an atheist, why did he target a specific denomination when real atheists make no separation between the various fairy tales."

But really, I think the main rebuttal here is "reason for their actions." Stalin and Pol Pot and such might have been atheists, but they weren't killing in the name of atheism. They weren't trying to abolish religious beliefs for the sake of atheism, they were spreading communism or socialism or killing for power or maybe just had homicidal tendencies. You cannot kill in the name of a lack of belief. I cannot kill others in the name of my lack of belief in unicorns, unless I am a crazy person.

Why did these people commit these actions? What was their motivation?

And if you think you can flip the script and say, "Well then how can you blame religious killings on Christians?" It's not the same situation. Religious men didn't happen to be Christian AND murderers; rather they were killing with the specific purpose of pleasing their god. Witch hunts, the beheading of the non-religious, the Inquisition, 9/11... these are things that could not have taken place without serious delusions instilled by religious indoctrination. Stalin or Pol Pot could have very easily have been Hindus or Catholics or Scientologists and I wouldn't have been surprised, because their actions were not religious in nature.

And finally (this is longer than my usual posts), the only semi-plausible response I could see a theist giving to "they didn't kill in the name of atheism" would be "well they lacked the moral teachings which are only attainable through Christ, and so they didn't know any better." But once again, this just leads into yet another fruitless moral argument. All I can say is when i observe the needless slaughter of millions of people, the actions seemed to sync up perfectly with the moral teachings of the Bible. God commanded the genocide of roughly 25 million unsuspecting people just because they weren't part of his chosen Jewish mafia. They had the bad luck of being born in a different part of the world with a different genetic makeup and so they were slaughtered in the name of racial supremacy... sounds exactly like Hitler to me.



Actually, I'm going to use that in a sig or a FB post I think.

"If I asked you who commanded his people to kill millions of innocent civilians who were unlucky enough to have born in a different part of the world with a different genetic makeup, all in the name of racial supremacy... you'd probably think Hitler, but it was actually God." Or maybe make a quote and end it "-Hitler ...just kidding, God." Dammit, all the parts are there I just can't arrange it comedically. Damn you, marijuana!

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02-01-2012, 04:11 PM (This post was last modified: 02-01-2012 04:24 PM by Infidel.)
RE: Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
Pictures are worth far more than words.[These pictures are on a Christian website BTW] Yes he was definetly a Catholic, and had a treaty (concordat) signed with the Pope. He was also influenced by eugenics and social darwinism. His ideas on eugenics originated in the USA!

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02-01-2012, 04:16 PM
RE: Hitler’s religious views and the encouragement of slavery in the new testament
(02-01-2012 03:48 PM)AbdelZ Wrote:  Hitler was a a christian atheist haha because only atheists can be the " real" christians, ironically enough

So he believed in a god that he didn't believe in? Now your posts are getting ridiculous!

Why put a list of things most of which hitler clearly wasn't?.

Remind me again of how Islam treats women as 2nd class citizens or property.

Get off your high horse it doesn't suit you.

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