Holocaust denial
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03-08-2017, 11:48 AM
RE: Holocaust denial
@Emma

Whatever effors were undertaken they failed - Khmer Rogue, Darfur, Hutu and Tutsi. Don't remember how Yugoslavia was clasified.

Genocides aren't ignored - people write about them. But that's after the fact. Ignoring them when they happen I suppose is convenient as it allow to not make effort.

Lastly - remember "never again" slogan? To sound honrst it should sound "we will look in different directon when this will happen, again and again".


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The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

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03-08-2017, 12:25 PM
RE: Holocaust denial
(03-08-2017 11:48 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  @Emma

Whatever effors were undertaken they failed - Khmer Rogue, Darfur, Hutu and Tutsi. Don't remember how Yugoslavia was clasified.

Genocides aren't ignored - people write about them. But that's after the fact. Ignoring them when they happen I suppose is convenient as it allow to not make effort.

Lastly - remember "never again" slogan? To sound honrst it should sound "we will look in different directon when this will happen, again and again".


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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Problem_from_Hell

"A Problem from Hell": America and the Age of Genocide is a book by Samantha Power, at that time Professor of Human Rights Practice at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government, which explores America's understanding of, response to, and inaction on genocides in the 20th century from the Armenian genocide to the "ethnic cleansings" of the Kosovo War. It won the J. Anthony Lukas Book Prize and the Pulitzer Prize for General Non-Fiction in 2003.

Power observes that American policymakers have been consistently reluctant to condemn mass atrocities as genocide or take responsibility for leading an international military intervention. She argues that without significant pressure from the American public, policymakers avoid the term "genocide" altogether.

----


Here in America, our spineless politicians, Democrats and Republicans have a long history of not responding when these things happen. On the other hand, when they respond, as in Libya, it still goes awry. The book is grim reading of past failures.

One wonders how Trump will deal with such problems.

Yog Sothoth! Yog Sothoth! Come back old ones! Yog Sothoth!

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03-08-2017, 01:11 PM
RE: Holocaust denial
(03-08-2017 12:25 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:  
(03-08-2017 11:48 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  @Emma

Whatever effors were undertaken they failed - Khmer Rogue, Darfur, Hutu and Tutsi. Don't remember how Yugoslavia was clasified.

Genocides aren't ignored - people write about them. But that's after the fact. Ignoring them when they happen I suppose is convenient as it allow to not make effort.

Lastly - remember "never again" slogan? To sound honrst it should sound "we will look in different directon when this will happen, again and again".


Wysłane z mojego 6045K przy użyciu Tapatalka

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Problem_from_Hell

"A Problem from Hell": America and the Age of Genocide is a book by Samantha Power, at that time Professor of Human Rights Practice at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government, which explores America's understanding of, response to, and inaction on genocides in the 20th century from the Armenian genocide to the "ethnic cleansings" of the Kosovo War. It won the J. Anthony Lukas Book Prize and the Pulitzer Prize for General Non-Fiction in 2003.

Power observes that American policymakers have been consistently reluctant to condemn mass atrocities as genocide or take responsibility for leading an international military intervention. She argues that without significant pressure from the American public, policymakers avoid the term "genocide" altogether.

----


Here in America, our spineless politicians, Democrats and Republicans have a long history of not responding when these things happen. On the other hand, when they respond, as in Libya, it still goes awry. The book is grim reading of past failures.

One wonders how Trump will deal with such problems.
Only those who seriously think that USA is infallible beacon of moral righteousness could be surprised by it inaction. Pragmatism is winning the day as it often had.
(03-08-2017 12:25 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:  
(03-08-2017 11:48 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  @Emma

Whatever effors were undertaken they failed - Khmer Rogue, Darfur, Hutu and Tutsi. Don't remember how Yugoslavia was clasified.

Genocides aren't ignored - people write about them. But that's after the fact. Ignoring them when they happen I suppose is convenient as it allow to not make effort.

Lastly - remember "never again" slogan? To sound honrst it should sound "we will look in different directon when this will happen, again and again".


Wysłane z mojego 6045K przy użyciu Tapatalka

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Problem_from_Hell

"A Problem from Hell": America and the Age of Genocide is a book by Samantha Power, at that time Professor of Human Rights Practice at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government, which explores America's understanding of, response to, and inaction on genocides in the 20th century from the Armenian genocide to the "ethnic cleansings" of the Kosovo War. It won the J. Anthony Lukas Book Prize and the Pulitzer Prize for General Non-Fiction in 2003.

Power observes that American policymakers have been consistently reluctant to condemn mass atrocities as genocide or take responsibility for leading an international military intervention. She argues that without significant pressure from the American public, policymakers avoid the term "genocide" altogether.

----


Here in America, our spineless politicians, Democrats and Republicans have a long history of not responding when these things happen. On the other hand, when they respond, as in Libya, it still goes awry. The book is grim reading of past failures.

One wonders how Trump will deal with such problems.
Only those who seriously think that USA is infallible beacon of moral righteousness could be surprised by it inaction. Pragmatism is winning the day as it often had.

The first revolt is against the supreme tyranny of theology, of the phantom of God. As long as we have a master in heaven, we will be slaves on earth.

Mikhail Bakunin.
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03-08-2017, 01:14 PM
RE: Holocaust denial
(03-08-2017 12:25 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:  Here in America, our spineless politicians, Democrats and Republicans have a long history of not responding when these things happen. On the other hand, when they respond, as in Libya, it still goes awry. The book is grim reading of past failures.

You can't compare the situation in Lybia or Syria for that matter to genocide. Both situations are civil war with many casualties but not with the intent of social cleansing.

In the case of former Yugoslavia it was Bosnia rather than Kosowo. I guess, Kosovo comes to mind to Americans because that's when NATO involvement started. But the Bosnian conflict, complete with ethnic cleansing and concentration camps already raged for years at that time. They still unearth mass graves of Bosnian muslims, killed by Serbian seperatists. Sarajevo was a killing field for years on end, with snipers shooting random civilians in the streets. That's why Mladic and Karadžić stand trial at the Hague. Both are considered responsible for the massacres.

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03-08-2017, 03:21 PM
RE: Holocaust denial
(26-04-2017 04:44 AM)Deesse23 Wrote:  Just listened to a small discussion between two co workers across my desk (in the lab). Was something about poilitics. I then mentioned "this is as stupid as Sean Spicer saying that Assad was worse than Hitler. Yet we all know that Hitler gassed 6mio (partially of his own countrymen) people". One of the two guys turned to me and said matter.of.fact.style. "I doubt it was 6mio".

Me: "5mio then? Seriously?"
He: "Well, i doubt it was really an holocaust at all. Lets have a look at the protocols of the Nuremberg trials, and bla bla bla"

He then tried to keep arguing with the argument of global conspiracy and called himself a "sceptic". At this point i told him that the problem is not my political correctness, political affiliation or love of Jews, neither what is "being taught" in any school, but his standard for believing things, no matter what. If his standard is so high as to be *sceptic* about holocaust, i said, then he must be sceptic of gravitation as well, or probably the Vietnam war, since we have just as much evidence for this. He didnt like to have his (double) standard questioned. He further went along the line of "having special knowledge" and "mainstream is wrong" bla bla bla, you know the routine.

At the end i clearly told him (just to take that argument from persecution from him) that i respect his right for a stupid belief but not his bullshit belief itself. As long as i am around and he is trying to sell this irrational bullshit to others (another colleague who is sometimes influenced by this idiot), in public, i will not allow him to do this unwithspoken. I will not give credit to his bullshit by even starting a discussion about this. I flat out denied when he tried to start such an argument.
He can think and say whatever he likes, but he has to take the consequences, thats what i clearly told him.
Although public denial of holocaust is illegal here, i wont run to the police i told him, i dont give a fuck, but i will call him out for his bullshit, in front of everyone.

What i learned is: No matter if you are a studied person, no matter if you are a capable engineer, no matter if you are an all nice and reasonable person otherwise, you still can hold a shitload of irrational beliefs (i admit he is also into chemtrails n stuff, a very classic conspiracy theorist with "i have special knowledge you havent). I guess thats why the (alt) right is not entirely full of uneducated, unemployed skinheads.

Thanks to you guys (i think) i handeled this correctly. Thumbsup Would have probably been different a few years ago.

I ran into someone like this too. It may have been the Single Malts that slowed me down but I thought he was just hung up on numbers. I had read some stats from legitimate sources and made the mistake of countering with that it could be a little lower or a little higher that the 6 million. Turned out he thought at most a few thousand were killed. Frusty

" Generally speaking, the errors in religion are dangerous; those in philosophy only ridiculous."
David Hume
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08-08-2017, 07:56 PM
RE: Holocaust denial
The problem with this topic is that it's something no one should talk about because it only shows how insensitive you are. But, some people don't take advice and just have to:



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