Hope
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20-04-2017, 11:03 AM
Hope
Last night I told a family member I didn't believe in god anymore. He asked me so I was honest with him. He asked me "I feel sorry for you because there is no hope in your future."

I told him "I do have hope. I look around and see all the amazing things science has accomplished. There are diseases my daughter will never get thanks to humans. Humans did that, not a god. I look to the future with hope for mankind because there are great humans in the world trying to make things better. I no longer look at the world and think 'why did god let this happen?' I now look at the world and think 'look how humans are trying to cure cancer and eradicate diseases.'"

Right or wrong, that was my answer in the spur of the moment lol.
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20-04-2017, 11:31 AM
RE: Hope
Too bad so many look to something outside themselves - something they are not - thinking that will somehow save them from what we do to each other.

Your family member may feel he has hope. Ironically, his hope is just as reliable and unreliable as yours. At least your hope has a human face.

If he is a christian, I have to wonder how he missed the whole point of his Jesus being a human. The further from church ... the closer to god. Wink

A new type of thinking is essential if mankind is to survive and move to higher levels. ~ Albert Einstein
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20-04-2017, 11:44 AM
RE: Hope
Hi qpmomma.

I have never understood this sentiment from xians. "How do you get out of bed every morning?" The idea is that without gawd there is no hope and no purpose in life, especially in yours.

WTF! And...yet, there is nothing about me that announces to people I know casually that I am an atheist. What do they expect us to look like? How do they think we behave?

According to them, we should look wretched and behave much like zombies who wander in search of something...anything...that will fill that empty spot that those living in hope of heaven have. Or...just stay in bed, moaning with despair.

Reinforce your declaration by reading such inspired books as "The God Delusion" by Richard Dawkins. I reread it recently and it was like a breath of fresh air upon the idiocies of deity belief.

Good to meet you.

-Jeanne

"The Ox is slow, but the Earth is patient."
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20-04-2017, 11:46 AM
RE: Hope
So, to put it bluntly, the only "hope" worth having, is that somehow, miraculously, *your* precious, irreplaceable self will continue to live, long after even the heat death of the universe?

I much rather live in a hopeless world, then; one, as you very well put it, in which people eradicate diseases, (try to) take care of each other, to learn, to evolve, to become better, both as individuals and as a society, instead of grovelling on their knees before some megalomaniacal, worship-demanding sky monster, all the while bemoaning what unworthy wretches they are. Ah, but they have *hope*. The thing with feathers. Tar and feathers, more likely.

Yeah, I'll keep putting my hope in my fellow man and you can keep your god. All of them. And all the hatred and suffering they've brought into this world.

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderĂ²."
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20-04-2017, 12:15 PM (This post was last modified: 20-04-2017 12:25 PM by Thoreauvian.)
RE: Hope
(20-04-2017 11:46 AM)Vera Wrote:  So, to put it bluntly, the only "hope" worth having, is that somehow, miraculously, *your* precious, irreplaceable self will continue to live, long after even the heat death of the universe?

Surviving death only to face either an eternity in hell or an eternity in heaven worshipping some weird deity doesn't seem much to hope for either.
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20-04-2017, 12:24 PM (This post was last modified: 20-04-2017 01:30 PM by Vera.)
RE: Hope
(20-04-2017 12:15 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  Surviving death only to face an eternity doesn't seem much to hope for either.

Fixt.

Yep, take this from a certified apeirophobe (hehe) - nothing scarier in this universe than eternity. No matter if spent in a lake of fire or fucking hordes of virgins. Or even fucking hordes of virgins *in* a lake of fire. Drinking Beverage

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderĂ²."
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20-04-2017, 01:08 PM
RE: Hope
(20-04-2017 11:03 AM)qpmomma Wrote:  Last night I told a family member I didn't believe in god anymore. He asked me so I was honest with him. He asked me "I feel sorry for you because there is no hope in your future."

I told him "I do have hope. I look around and see all the amazing things science has accomplished. There are diseases my daughter will never get thanks to humans. Humans did that, not a god. I look to the future with hope for mankind because there are great humans in the world trying to make things better. I no longer look at the world and think 'why did god let this happen?' I now look at the world and think 'look how humans are trying to cure cancer and eradicate diseases.'"

Right or wrong, that was my answer in the spur of the moment lol.

It makes me wonder, is he so stuck in looking forward to Heaven that he doesn't see the present? What about working to make this world a better place, and to help those who need it now?

(20-04-2017 12:24 PM)Vera Wrote:  
(20-04-2017 12:15 PM)Thoreauvian Wrote:  Surviving death only to face either an eternity doesn't seem much to hope for either.

Fixt.

Yep, take this from a certified apeirophobe (hehe) - nothing scarier in this universe than eternity. No matter if spent in a lake of fire or fucking hordes of virgins. Or even fucking hordes of virgins *in* a lake of fire. Drinking Beverage

Never realized there was a term for that. But no kidding, the thing that scares me the most is just the concept of eternity. I've broken down crying before, more than once, while trying to conceptualize it. I can remember curling in a ball in 5th grade or so in bed and just laying awake all night due to it.

Need to think of a witty signature.
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20-04-2017, 01:24 PM
RE: Hope
Living in fear of eternal punishment if you disagree with the Creator seems to be an equally hopeless affair.

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20-04-2017, 01:26 PM
RE: Hope
(20-04-2017 01:08 PM)Shai Hulud Wrote:  Never realized there was a term for that. But no kidding, the thing that scares me the most is just the concept of eternity. I've broken down crying before, more than once, while trying to conceptualize it. I can remember curling in a ball in 5th grade or so in bed and just laying awake all night due to it.

Hug

I only found out there was a name for this very recently. And was stunned, really, because it was *exactly* as you describe it. I would lie awake in bed, terrified beyond what words can describe at the mere thought of going on forever, and ever, and ever, with no end in sight.

Wanna know how I kicked it? Tongue

(But sorry you are going through this. It's the most terrible thing I've ever experienced!)

"E se non passa la tristezza con altri occhi la guarderĂ²."
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20-04-2017, 01:44 PM
RE: Hope
(20-04-2017 11:03 AM)qpmomma Wrote:  I no longer look at the world and think 'why did god let this happen?

Ever since I can remember, I never looked at the world that way. God was driven out of me by zealous priests at a very young age. My father's fascination with science did the rest. So I was always aware that humans did it. The good, the bad and the ugly.

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