"How could you believe that?"
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07-12-2012, 10:33 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
I have discussed evolution with people who are of a belief in god and it doesn't come up, but that is because we stick to the science instead of the metaphysics.
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07-12-2012, 10:39 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 10:32 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote: I agree with Vosur, it is mixing it at some level (fine line or not).Honest answer? It's probably because they see the plain evidence of science and see the contradictions to science in the Bible. It's their attempt to reconcile the empirical evidence that is staring in front of them with the faith based claim of their Christianity. To a Christian, their faith based claim is unshakable. To a scientist, empirical based claims are unshakable. This presents a problem for Christian scientists that has to be reconciled. I faced this problem a while back when I struggled with accepting evolution and becoming an EC. So, the theological claim is a simple attempt to reconcile their faith and their rationale. ![]() |
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07-12-2012, 10:40 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 10:33 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote: I have discussed evolution with people who are of a belief in god and it doesn't come up, but that is because we stick to the science instead of the metaphysics.Yeah, that's what I mean. ![]() |
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07-12-2012, 10:46 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 07:54 AM)Ricochet180 Wrote: So, one of the questions that comes up is how anyone, knowing about dinosaurs, evolution, etc. could believe in creationism. (Not to mention deal with things like the flood.) Thought I'd throw what I did, years ago, out there to make it kinda-sorta make sense to me at the time. Some people just go on "faith it's true," but that didn't quite work for me even in the deepest indoctrination. I was told dinosaurs didn't exist. Period. It was an elaborate hoax perpetrated by archeologists. As the world view widened and we entered the "age of information" I doubt seriously they could still believe this. They probably believe now that they lived at the same time as humans --- But that was NOT what I was taught in school. |
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07-12-2012, 10:53 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 10:29 AM)kingschosen Wrote:Which mixes theology with science. Around and around you go.(07-12-2012 10:14 AM)Vosur Wrote: What? If you propose that god "authored" evolution, you're not keeping theology and science separate; you're mixing them together.Fine line, but no. When you don't know, the scientific method calls for saying "I don't know", not "God did it". You seem to be unable to grasp that. Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims. Science is not a subject, but a method. ![]() |
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07-12-2012, 10:53 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
"To a Christian, their faith based claim is unshakable. To a scientist, empirical based claims are unshakable."
Yes to the Christian, no to the scientist. Empirical evidence based claims are not unshakable, it just takes a really big quake that is also substantiated to send them tumbling. There was empirical evidence and working models to explain a geocentric model of the universe, but those weren't unshakable. Evolution isn't unshakable, but no alternative claim has ever gained traction or presented any evidence to bolster its claim. Were a better theory to come along and to contradict evolution, it would dropped like it was hot. |
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07-12-2012, 10:59 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 10:46 AM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote: I was told dinosaurs didn't exist. Period. It was an elaborate hoax perpetrated by archeologists.I seem to recall seeing or reading something at one point that was just... weird to think of, but seems to fit in some cases. That when someone holds a belief strongly, they can take evidence against it and turn it around so they think - despite the twists, folding, spindling and mutilating of the contradictory information - it supports their belief. Take that and realize there's a *lot more* information out there that, thanks to the internet, is now much more easily available. And think of just how much they may be "reinforcing" those beliefs. Bit scary. (And yes, I did get past all this and realize I was just trying to duct-tape and jerry-rig things together to make faith and science match up. Decided that science could at least defend its position with more than "Because I said so.") |
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07-12-2012, 11:58 AM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 10:53 AM)Chas Wrote:No, I get that.(07-12-2012 10:29 AM)kingschosen Wrote: Fine line, but no.Which mixes theology with science. Around and around you go. But that's the difference of having faith and not having faith. And, it's still not mixing theology with science. Using the scientific method, Christians can still say "I don't know". Because they don't; however, there is an overarching theme that God does know. ...and that is theology. ![]() |
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07-12-2012, 12:02 PM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 10:53 AM)TheBeardedDude Wrote: "To a Christian, their faith based claim is unshakable. To a scientist, empirical based claims are unshakable."I must not be communicating clearly. I'm sorry. Empirical evidence is, like you said, unshakable; however, it is replaced with new empirical evidence. The concept of empirical evidence is unshakable; not the individualized instances of it. Sorry for being so muddled. ![]() |
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07-12-2012, 12:05 PM
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RE: "How could you believe that?"
(07-12-2012 11:58 AM)kingschosen Wrote:But saying God did it is not science. You can't have it both ways.(07-12-2012 10:53 AM)Chas Wrote: Which mixes theology with science. Around and around you go.No, I get that. Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims. Science is not a subject, but a method. ![]() |
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