How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
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22-09-2012, 02:18 PM
How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
So I have started my lessons for GCSE RE. The Unit is Belief in God. My question is about religious experiences. Miracles, Numinous you know that kind of stuff. So in the lesson, my teacher was showing us videos of miracles. Like a baby was declared dead after the doctors tried to bring him to life for 30 mins and the parents gave the baby a kangroo hug. After two hours the baby started to breath and the mother gave a bit of breastmilk and he was alive. The doctor couldn't believe it. Blah Blah. The teacher asked us if it was a miracle. I said no because this kind of stuff happens all the time. Well I hear about it a lot. She asked me if I thought it was luck. I said yes. But I was kind of doubting myself. I mean normally if a baby doesn't breath or show signs of life for about 30 mins, its pretty much dead. How could you debunk miracles? Saying it was luck, it didn't seem like a good enough answer.

Anyway the question I have is 'Explain how a religious experience may lead someone to a belief in God'
My answer: 'People have experiences that effect their emotions that it will make them believe there isn't a rational explaination to explain what they have experienced. Therefore they will interpret is as something supernatural and that it has to do something with God.

I don't think my answers isn't good enough and I never had a 'religious experience' so I wouldn't know. I know to some extent that there is psychology involved. I do have one of those things where your brain starts to go dizzy unexpectedly and your reality shifts a bit and the mind goes fuzzy. I don't what they are or my brain is trolling with me.

If you could help, I will be grateful and give you a virtual massage. Big Grin

P.S its kind of weird that quite a lot of non religious people picked R.E. I guess they have the same reasons as me.

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22-09-2012, 02:23 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
(22-09-2012 02:18 PM)tazmin98 Wrote:  So I have started my lessons for GCSE RE. The Unit is Belief in God. My question is about religious experiences. Miracles, Numinous you know that kind of stuff. So in the lesson, my teacher was showing us videos of miracles. Like a baby was declared dead after the doctors tried to bring him to life for 30 mins and the parents gave the baby a kangroo hug. After two hours the baby started to breath and the mother gave a bit of breastmilk and he was alive. The doctor couldn't believe it. Blah Blah. The teacher asked us if it was a miracle. I said no because this kind of stuff happens all the time. Well I hear about it a lot. She asked me if I thought it was luck. I said yes. But I was kind of doubting myself. I mean normally if a baby doesn't breath or show signs of life for about 30 mins, its pretty much dead. How could you debunk miracles? Saying it was luck, it didn't seem like a good enough answer.

Anyway the question I have is 'Explain how a religious experience may lead someone to a belief in God'
My answer: 'People have experiences that effect their emotions that it will make them believe there isn't a rational explaination to explain what they have experienced. Therefore they will interpret is as something supernatural and that it has to do something with God.

I don't think my answers isn't good enough and I never had a 'religious experience' so I wouldn't know. I know to some extent that there is psychology involved. I do have one of those things where your brain starts to go dizzy unexpectedly and your reality shifts a bit and the mind goes fuzzy. I don't what they are or my brain is trolling with me.

If you could help, I will be grateful and give you a virtual massage. Big Grin

P.S its kind of weird that quite a lot of non religious people picked R.E. I guess they have the same reasons as me.

Religious experience varies form religious groups. Is it the christian religion your question is based on, or every religion in the world? If it's the latter, that's one big answer.

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22-09-2012, 02:28 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
It's good to start with a mind that is trained to look beyond the baloney.



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22-09-2012, 02:30 PM (This post was last modified: 22-09-2012 03:08 PM by Chas.)
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
(22-09-2012 02:18 PM)tazmin98 Wrote:  So I have started my lessons for GCSE RE. The Unit is Belief in God. My question is about religious experiences. Miracles, Numinous you know that kind of stuff. So in the lesson, my teacher was showing us videos of miracles. Like a baby was declared dead after the doctors tried to bring him to life for 30 mins and the parents gave the baby a kangroo hug. After two hours the baby started to breath and the mother gave a bit of breastmilk and he was alive. The doctor couldn't believe it. Blah Blah. The teacher asked us if it was a miracle. I said no because this kind of stuff happens all the time. Well I hear about it a lot. She asked me if I thought it was luck. I said yes. But I was kind of doubting myself. I mean normally if a baby doesn't breath or show signs of life for about 30 mins, its pretty much dead. How could you debunk miracles? Saying it was luck, it didn't seem like a good enough answer.

Anyway the question I have is 'Explain how a religious experience may lead someone to a belief in God'
My answer: 'People have experiences that effect their emotions that it will make them believe there isn't a rational explaination to explain what they have experienced. Therefore they will interpret is as something supernatural and that it has to do something with God.

I don't think my answers isn't good enough and I never had a 'religious experience' so I wouldn't know. I know to some extent that there is psychology involved. I do have one of those things where your brain starts to go dizzy unexpectedly and your reality shifts a bit and the mind goes fuzzy. I don't what they are or my brain is trolling with me.

If you could help, I will be grateful and give you a virtual massage. Big Grin

P.S its kind of weird that quite a lot of non religious people picked R.E. I guess they have the same reasons as me.

A religious experience is internal to a person and is therefore not objective evidence.
There is no way to tell if that person experienced anything other than a transient emotional state.

It is not that any one's experience can be debunked, it is that it just isn't objective evidence of anything. All religious experiences are of no evidentiary value.

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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22-09-2012, 02:37 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
(22-09-2012 02:23 PM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  
(22-09-2012 02:18 PM)tazmin98 Wrote:  So I have started my lessons for GCSE RE. The Unit is Belief in God. My question is about religious experiences. Miracles, Numinous you know that kind of stuff. So in the lesson, my teacher was showing us videos of miracles. Like a baby was declared dead after the doctors tried to bring him to life for 30 mins and the parents gave the baby a kangroo hug. After two hours the baby started to breath and the mother gave a bit of breastmilk and he was alive. The doctor couldn't believe it. Blah Blah. The teacher asked us if it was a miracle. I said no because this kind of stuff happens all the time. Well I hear about it a lot. She asked me if I thought it was luck. I said yes. But I was kind of doubting myself. I mean normally if a baby doesn't breath or show signs of life for about 30 mins, its pretty much dead. How could you debunk miracles? Saying it was luck, it didn't seem like a good enough answer.

Anyway the question I have is 'Explain how a religious experience may lead someone to a belief in God'
My answer: 'People have experiences that effect their emotions that it will make them believe there isn't a rational explaination to explain what they have experienced. Therefore they will interpret is as something supernatural and that it has to do something with God.

I don't think my answers isn't good enough and I never had a 'religious experience' so I wouldn't know. I know to some extent that there is psychology involved. I do have one of those things where your brain starts to go dizzy unexpectedly and your reality shifts a bit and the mind goes fuzzy. I don't what they are or my brain is trolling with me.

If you could help, I will be grateful and give you a virtual massage. Big Grin

P.S its kind of weird that quite a lot of non religious people picked R.E. I guess they have the same reasons as me.

Religious experience varies form religious groups. Is it the christian religion your question is based on, or every religion in the world? If it's the latter, that's one big answer.

Christianity

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22-09-2012, 03:56 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
Why is a miracle considered evidence *for* God? If it truly happened, it may be considered evidence against our current understanding, but why would one consider it evidence for a giant invisible malevolent being who want's us to believe he sent his visible son to be nailed to some dead wood in order to absolve us of some theoretical wrongdoing by our ancestors?

That would be my argument.
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22-09-2012, 04:03 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
(22-09-2012 02:30 PM)Chas Wrote:  A religious experience is internal to a person and is therefore not objective evidence.
There is no way to tell if that person experienced anything other than a transient emotional state.

It is not that any one's experience can be debunked, it is that it just isn't objective evidence of anything. All religious experiences are of no evidentiary value.
Word.

As for the video of the Baby, do you have a source on that? Based on all those years of biology, I think I can safely say that it's entirely impossible for a human whose brain has been deprived of oxygen for several hours to become active again as if nothing happened. The damage done after reviving someone after a couple of minutes can already be devastating.

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22-09-2012, 04:03 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
(22-09-2012 02:18 PM)tazmin98 Wrote:  So I have started my lessons for GCSE RE. The Unit is Belief in God. My question is about religious experiences. Miracles, Numinous you know that kind of stuff. So in the lesson, my teacher was showing us videos of miracles. Like a baby was declared dead after the doctors tried to bring him to life for 30 mins and the parents gave the baby a kangroo hug. After two hours the baby started to breath and the mother gave a bit of breastmilk and he was alive. The doctor couldn't believe it. Blah Blah. The teacher asked us if it was a miracle. I said no because this kind of stuff happens all the time. Well I hear about it a lot. She asked me if I thought it was luck. I said yes. But I was kind of doubting myself. I mean normally if a baby doesn't breath or show signs of life for about 30 mins, its pretty much dead. How could you debunk miracles? Saying it was luck, it didn't seem like a good enough answer.

Anyway the question I have is 'Explain how a religious experience may lead someone to a belief in God'
My answer: 'People have experiences that effect their emotions that it will make them believe there isn't a rational explaination to explain what they have experienced. Therefore they will interpret is as something supernatural and that it has to do something with God.

I don't think my answers isn't good enough and I never had a 'religious experience' so I wouldn't know. I know to some extent that there is psychology involved. I do have one of those things where your brain starts to go dizzy unexpectedly and your reality shifts a bit and the mind goes fuzzy. I don't what they are or my brain is trolling with me.

If you could help, I will be grateful and give you a virtual massage. Big Grin

P.S its kind of weird that quite a lot of non religious people picked R.E. I guess they have the same reasons as me.

The answer to the baby revival is a complicated one involving cardiac electrophisiology, which I can take you through, but you probably don't want that sort of detail. Suffice it to say, the baby wasn't really dead. Cardiac tissue is muscle, and as such generates spontaneous contractions. It happens all the time, and is witnessed by all of us who are exposed to cardiac monitors, and cardiac events. Let me know how much detail you need. There are many "revival" events. Some longer than others. None are miracles.

There is no such thing as "luck" or "chance". They are common fallacies. There is only "probability", which sometimes can be computed.

Almost all the other internal "religious" experiences, (joy, happiness, contentment, wonder, etc etc) are neuro-physiological responses to chemical releases. Two of the important ones are beta-endorphins, and Dopamine. You can look them up, and ask questions. They pretty much explain everything going on in your brain, which you interpret, as "religious".

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22-09-2012, 04:05 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
(22-09-2012 02:28 PM)Erxomai Wrote:  It's good to start with a mind that is trained to look beyond the baloney.

Thanks for the vid. That will help me in future questions Thumbsup

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22-09-2012, 04:07 PM
RE: How could you debunk 'religious experiences'
There simply is no way to debunk anyone's personal religious experience, since it's not evidence based. You could give plausible explanations though. Miracles often aren't really miraculous, just because a doctor cannot explain it does not mean that something supernatural happened. Baby's are sometimes declared dead when they aren't (which is the most plausible explanation for this "miracle"), people do sometimes recover from cancer spontaneously, these things happen but are by no means miraculous. However, some people will interpret this as something supernatural and it will give them a feeling of joy and comfort to think that a higher power intervened on their behalf. Partly it's a misunderstanding of how the world works (akin to the argument from ignorance) and partly the desire to be part of something bigger than them...
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