How did you get interested in history?
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28-04-2015, 08:31 PM (This post was last modified: 28-04-2015 08:52 PM by Res Publica.)
RE: How did you get interested in history?
(28-04-2015 06:54 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(28-04-2015 05:24 AM)Szuchow Wrote:  Sadly it is not much better in Poland. But then how many countries do otherwise? During my courses I had an opportunity to look on German textbooks and while I wouldn't call them propaganda they were certainly different than Polish ones.

Not sure I could tell you. I mean, I can understanding having a different perspective or emphasis from country to country in how they cover something like the First Word War and their involvement in it. But then there is the white-washing bullshit we get here in the States; like the myth-making behind Christopher Columbus, the lionization of the Founding Fathers, and the selective memory that forgets the socialism of Helen Keller and the racism of President Woodrow Wilson. Everyone is a hero, nobody has any flaws, and they're all so bland as to make them all uninteresting caricatures of human beings; and in the process of losing their flaws, they lose their humanity.

Before you hit the college level, American history is nothing but a boring string of mostly white dudes doing shit.

"The Constitution was handed down to guide us by a bunch of wise old dead white guys who invented our country! Now some flinch when I say that. Why! It's true-they were white guys! So were most of the guys that died in Lincoln's name opposing slavery in the 1860s. So why should I be ashamed of white guys? Why is "Hispanic Pride" or "Black Pride" a good thing, while "White Pride" conjures shaven heads and white hoods? Why was the Million Man March on Washington celebrated by many as progress, while the Promise Keepers March on Washington was greeted with suspicion and ridicule? I'll tell you why: Cultural warfare!" -Charlton Heston

Despite the self-hate and white guilt bullshit, America has been a white man's country until around the 1950's. Thus most of the great American achievements before this time tend to have been made by whites.

American history is a fascinating story of a people seeking liberty and having to fight for their place in the world. Only a self-hating leftist would be so dismissive.

And all countries need a national myth. It is important that all schoolchildren be taught the national myth, to instil them with a sense of pride and nationalism. It is best that the national myth not be questioned, by rather celebrated by all. When you go around telling people that the founding father were slaveowners or whatnot it is unnationalistic and destructive even if it is true. Liberals are largely responsible for the racial tension in America today because they fight efforts to instill the national myth in blacks by pointing out historical racism. This prevents blacks from becoming American patriots and harms the natural progression of America towards a multi-racial nationalism.

This is actually one of the things that Canada does right and America doesn't. Here in Canada when we talk about racism we discuss how bad it is South of the border and brag about our underground railroad. Because of this we don't have race issues like America does.

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28-04-2015, 08:36 PM
RE: How did you get interested in history?
(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  
(28-04-2015 06:54 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Not sure I could tell you. I mean, I can understanding having a different perspective or emphasis from country to country in how they cover something like the First Word War and their involvement in it. But then there is the white-washing bullshit we get here in the States; like the myth-making behind Christopher Columbus, the lionization of the Founding Fathers, and the selective memory that forgets the socialism of Helen Keller and the racism of President Woodrow Wilson. Everyone is a hero, nobody has any flaws, and they're all so bland as to make them all uninteresting caricatures of human beings; and in the process of losing their flaws, they lose their humanity.

Before you hit the college level, American history is nothing but a boring string of mostly white dudes doing shit.

"The Constitution was handed down to guide us by a bunch of wise old dead white guys who invented our country! Now some flinch when I say that. Why! It's true-they were white guys! So were most of the guys that died in Lincoln's name opposing slavery in the 1860s. So why should I be ashamed of white guys? Why is "Hispanic Pride" or "Black Pride" a good thing, while "White Pride" conjures shaven heads and white hoods? Why was the Million Man March on Washington celebrated by many as progress, while the Promise Keepers March on Washington was greeted with suspicion and ridicule? I'll tell you why: Cultural warfare!" -Charlton Heston

Despite the self-hate and white guilt bullshit, America has been a white man's country until around the 1950's. Thus most of the great American achievements before this time tend to have been made by whites.

American history is a fascinating story of a people seeking liberty and having to fight for their place in the world. Only a self-hating leftist would be so dismissive.

Well the ideas that formed the nation came from the French Enlightenment, and basically it's a nation of immigrants, so it's not "a people". You do have a way of twisting history.

I became interested because I traveled a lot as a kid, sometimes with a professor friend of my parents who inspired me.

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28-04-2015, 10:04 PM (This post was last modified: 29-04-2015 01:32 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: How did you get interested in history?
(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  
(28-04-2015 06:54 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  Not sure I could tell you. I mean, I can understanding having a different perspective or emphasis from country to country in how they cover something like the First Word War and their involvement in it. But then there is the white-washing bullshit we get here in the States; like the myth-making behind Christopher Columbus, the lionization of the Founding Fathers, and the selective memory that forgets the socialism of Helen Keller and the racism of President Woodrow Wilson. Everyone is a hero, nobody has any flaws, and they're all so bland as to make them all uninteresting caricatures of human beings; and in the process of losing their flaws, they lose their humanity.

Before you hit the college level, American history is nothing but a boring string of mostly white dudes doing shit.

"The Constitution was handed down to guide us by a bunch of wise old dead white guys who invented our country! Now some flinch when I say that. Why! It's true-they were white guys! So were most of the guys that died in Lincoln's name opposing slavery in the 1860s. So why should I be ashamed of white guys? Why is "Hispanic Pride" or "Black Pride" a good thing, while "White Pride" conjures shaven heads and white hoods? Why was the Million Man March on Washington celebrated by many as progress, while the Promise Keepers March on Washington was greeted with suspicion and ridicule? I'll tell you why: Cultural warfare!" -Charlton Heston


Yep, because nothing proves my point better than quoting the corporate shill and former mouthpiece for the NRA. A man whose job it was to sell fear, because fear sells guns, and gun manufactures wrote his paychecks.


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  Despite the self-hate and white guilt bullshit, America has been a white man's country until around the 1950's. Thus most of the great American achievements before this time tend to have been made by whites.


So instead of looking back and taking note of how incredibly privileged being a white-male made you in the United States, you just take pride in a history built with a stacked deck?


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  American history is a fascinating story of a people seeking liberty and having to fight for their place in the world. Only a self-hating leftist would be so dismissive.


And in fighting for their place, discrimination, slavery, war, and genocide where tools employed to clear the path for themselves. Only an ignorant fascist would be do dismissive.

See? I can hyperbole too!


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  And all countries need a national myth.


Myth
/miTH/
noun

- a traditional story, especially one concerning the early history of a people or explaining some natural or social phenomenon, and typically involving supernatural beings or events

- traditional stories or legends collectively

- a widely held but false belief or idea

- a misrepresentation of the truth

- a fictitious or imaginary person or thing

- an exaggerated or idealized conception of a person or thing


How well has myth-making worked out for humanity when used to propagate religion? Oh right...


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  It is important that all schoolchildren be taught the national myth, to instil them with a sense of pride and nationalism.


You're advocating lying to children to instill false beliefs in them.

We generally regard this material as propaganda, and it's usage as brainwashing. How very fascist of you.


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  It is best that the national myth not be questioned, by rather celebrated by all.


Yep, cause that never backfires.

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(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  When you go around telling people that the founding father were slaveowners or whatnot it is unnationalistic and destructive even if it is true.


It is true, and it serves to show that great things can be achieved despite our very human flaws. It shows the founding fathers were humans, that they too made compromises and mistakes just like the rest of us, and that we might also aspire to do such great things despite our own flaws. Placing them on a an unreachable pedestal, erasing their blemishes and mistakes from history, does nothing but further push them away into the realm of the untouchable and unobtainable.


Those who forget the mistakes of the past, are doomed to repeat them.


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  Liberals are largely responsible for the racial tension in America today because they fight efforts to instill the national myth in blacks by pointing out historical racism.


Yep, it's the History classes in the underemployed and underfunded education systems (which are even more underemployed and underfunded in poor black communities) which are all a huge leftist conspiracy to keep blacks hating white people.

It's not the systemic racism, it's not the unequal opportunity, it's not the persecution from law enforcement. Nope, it's all the fault of the left and their divisive attempt at teaching actual history!


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  This prevents blacks from becoming American patriots and harms the natural progression of America towards a multi-racial nationalism.


Right. We're supposed to instill patriotism into the black community by lying to them about the past and force-feeding them a history filled with almost nothing but legendary white-men doing shit. Ignore both the hardship and the success of their ancestors in an effort to force a monochromatic nationalistic pride in them, a pride that should by all rights be earned by actions and not coerced by indoctrination.

This is such a bullshit idea that even the white kids don't find it compelling! Facepalm


(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  This is actually one of the things that Canada does right and America doesn't. Here in Canada when we talk about racism we discuss how bad it is South of the border and brag about our underground railroad. Because of this we don't have race issues like America does.


Canada is a fraction of the size of the United States (population wise), and generally has a far more homogeneous society; Canada doesn't have the same history of massive immigration. You also don't have the problem of a history of wide scale industrialized slavery which has left a legacy of institutionalized poverty and discrimination. So no, I wouldn't expect Canada to have trouble dealing with the same legacy issues, because Canada's history and foundation are not the same as the United States'.

Not that I'd expect an ignorant Canadian teenager to understand this.

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29-04-2015, 01:38 AM
RE: How did you get interested in history?
(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  And all countries need a national myth.

Funny, I wasn't aware that they did. If I declare a micronation on an island somewhere, do I need to read up on the regulations on foundation myths beforehand?

Then again, I come from a place where the national founding 'myth' is that the nation basically started when the British found somewhere shitty to dump their bread thieves, drunks and Irishmen. This was followed by much prosperity and legislated xenophobic terror about the Chinaman's proclivity for digging gold.

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29-04-2015, 01:52 AM (This post was last modified: 29-04-2015 02:13 AM by EvolutionKills.)
RE: How did you get interested in history?
(29-04-2015 01:38 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  
(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  And all countries need a national myth.

Funny, I wasn't aware that they did. If I declare a micronation on an island somewhere, do I need to read up on the regulations on foundation myths beforehand?

Then again, I come from a place where the national founding 'myth' is that the nation basically started when the British found somewhere shitty to dump their bread thieves, drunks and Irishmen. This was followed by much prosperity and legislated xenophobic terror about the Chinaman's proclivity for digging gold.


But what you're failing to see here is that you'd all be better off if you hid that part of your history whenever you indoctrinated the native and Chinamen youth so that they too can be patriotic shills in their own repression! Rolleyes

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29-04-2015, 02:18 AM
RE: How did you get interested in history?
(29-04-2015 01:52 AM)EvolutionKills Wrote:  
(29-04-2015 01:38 AM)Free Thought Wrote:  Funny, I wasn't aware that they did. If I declare a micronation on an island somewhere, do I need to read up on the regulations on foundation myths beforehand?

Then again, I come from a place where the national founding 'myth' is that the nation basically started when the British found somewhere shitty to dump their bread thieves, drunks and Irishmen. This was followed by much prosperity and legislated xenophobic terror about the Chinaman's proclivity for digging gold.


But what you're failing to see here is that you'd all be better off if you hid that part of your history whenever you indoctrinated the native and Chinamen youth so that they too can be patriotic shills in their own repression! Rolleyes

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Hmm... That's so crazy it might just work.

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01-05-2015, 04:04 AM
RE: How did you get interested in history?
(28-04-2015 08:31 PM)Res Publica Wrote:  And all countries need a national myth. It is important that all schoolchildren be taught the national myth, to instil them with a sense of pride and nationalism. It is best that the national myth not be questioned, by rather celebrated by all.

Yeah, you know, that line of thinking brought us some real great things in the past century. Great in the literary sense. They're called the great wars, which were a direct result of people believing their country had the biggest dick of them all.
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