How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
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23-06-2017, 02:14 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
(23-06-2017 08:58 AM)OakTree500 Wrote:  Probably been said way too many times, but if you have to convince somebody that Genocide is Wrong....you probably should stop talking to them.

Butbutbut... what if the people you're murdering en masse are evil people, and God (well, the priests who wrote your holy book) insists that you have to kill them? Huh?

Didn't think of THAT, didja?

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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23-06-2017, 02:20 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
“To argue with a person who has renounced the use of reason is like administering medicine to the dead.” (Thomas Paine) Dodgy
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23-06-2017, 10:29 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
I would hope that the theist in question here would at least say that genocide is sometimes immoral. If so, it gives you some avenues to explore about what exactly distinguishes a moral one from an immoral. If all it takes is God ordering it, would he turn round and kill his family if God said so?

If they don't think it's ever immoral, then they are probably a psychopath and no discussion of morality will be of any use with them. Such a person is not immoral, but amoral.

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23-06-2017, 11:40 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
(23-06-2017 10:29 PM)Robvalue Wrote:  I would hope that the theist in question here would at least say that genocide is sometimes immoral. If so, it gives you some avenues to explore about what exactly distinguishes a moral one from an immoral. If all it takes is God ordering it, would he turn round and kill his family if God said so?

If they don't think it's ever immoral, then they are probably a psychopath and no discussion of morality will be of any use with them. Such a person is not immoral, but amoral.

So God supposedly decides the Jews are a chosen race, his pets, and ignores the Canaanites and does not come before them and sets them on the path to righteousness? And then decides to have his Israelite pets kill them all? And yet God gets no blame for his failings here to exert himself towards that end? And I am supposed to hold God as a moral being, when obviously he is not, as the Bible claims, good, merciful, compassionate and righteous?

If there is indeed a God, these lying myths that paint God as an amoral evil doer is not only a lie, these tales of genocides and massacres in Canaan are myths not history, but it is then a case of defamation of any possible God based on these lies.

Which makes the Bible possibly a blasphemous book, a book of character assassination on God.

When I shake my ignore file, I can hear them buzzing!

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23-06-2017, 11:44 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
(23-06-2017 11:40 PM)Cheerful Charlie Wrote:  
(23-06-2017 10:29 PM)Robvalue Wrote:  I would hope that the theist in question here would at least say that genocide is sometimes immoral. If so, it gives you some avenues to explore about what exactly distinguishes a moral one from an immoral. If all it takes is God ordering it, would he turn round and kill his family if God said so?

If they don't think it's ever immoral, then they are probably a psychopath and no discussion of morality will be of any use with them. Such a person is not immoral, but amoral.

So God supposedly decides the Jews are a chosen race, his pets, and ignores the Canaanites and does not come before them and sets them on the path to righteousness? And then decides to have his Israelite pets kill them all? And yet God gets no blame for his failings here to exert himself towards that end? And i am supposed to hold God as a moral being, when obviously he is not, as the Bible claims, good, merciful, compassionate and righteous?

If there is indeed a God, these lying myths that paint God as an amoral evil doer is not only a lie, these tales of genocides and massacres in Canaan are myths not history, but it is then a case of defamation of any possible God based on these lies.

Which makes the Bible possibly a blasphemous book, a book of character assassination on God.

What actually happened, I imagine, is that a certain group of people decided they wanted to take over a town, so they went and did it. When recording this in the "history book", they couldn't simply write this. So it sounded much better that some super-powered being told them to do it. Then they're just following orders. Orders which just happen to be exactly what they wanted to do.

You're right, the Bible describes the creator as a petty, disgusting, primitive thug, playing with us for its sick amusement. Any actual creator probably doesn't give a monkey's (pun intended) about anything we have ever done, and is off creating his next simulation. He probably has no idea we're self-aware. How could he? Would you believe a character in your simulation if it declared itself self-aware?

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25-06-2017, 12:37 AM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
Av0,

I note that your theist buddy hasn't responded to your latest post, in the Reddit debate. Has been quite a while, now, given the speed of the earlier replies. Perhaps you struck a nerve.

As the great Mister Spock might have said,

[Image: JajO7.gif]

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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25-06-2017, 12:39 AM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
[Image: giphy.gif]

"Theology made no provision for evolution. The biblical authors had missed the most important revelation of all! Could it be that they were not really privy to the thoughts of God?" - E. O. Wilson
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25-06-2017, 10:47 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
(22-06-2017 02:39 PM)av0vad0 Wrote:  I'm really stuck on this debate and I know the opposing argument is faulty but I'm just tired of doing all this work in my responses only to have everything ignored because of his circular reasoning. Does anyone have any advice as to what I could say in response that might get him to understand that a murderous God is not perfect or trustworthy? Thanks in advance.

https://www.reddit.com/r/DebateAChristia...4/diverq8/

Walk away and shake the dust from your sandals. A person who thinks that genocide is moral if his God says so is not worth one minute of your finite time on this planet.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

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29-06-2017, 03:34 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
(22-06-2017 02:39 PM)av0vad0 Wrote:  ...[A] murderous God is not perfect or trustworthy?
The Book of Revelation is all about removing undesirables from the planet (Eccl 10:2, Jn 10;10). That's a good thing.
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29-06-2017, 04:05 PM
RE: How do I convince a Christian that genocide is always immoral?
(29-06-2017 03:34 PM)serpentdove Wrote:  
(22-06-2017 02:39 PM)av0vad0 Wrote:  ...[A] murderous God is not perfect or trustworthy?
The Book of Revelation is all about removing undesirables from the planet (Eccl 10:2, Jn 10;10). That's a good thing.

You mean when all the xians are taken away in the rapture?

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