How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
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30-11-2012, 03:57 PM (This post was last modified: 30-11-2012 04:19 PM by fstratzero.)
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
http://medical-dictionary.thefreediction...ucinations

Causes and symptoms

Common causes of hallucinations include:
  • Stress. Prolonged or extreme stress can impede thought processes and trigger hallucinations.
  • Sleep deprivation and/or exhaustion. Physical and emotional
    exhaustion can induce hallucinations by blurring the line between sleep
    and wakefulness.
  • Meditation and/or sensory deprivation. When the brain lacks external
    stimulation to form perceptions, it may compensate by referencing the
    memory and form hallucinatory perceptions. This condition is commonly
    found in blind and deaf individuals.
  • Electrical or neurochemical activity in the brain. A hallucinatory
    sensation—usually involving touch—called an aura, often appears before,
    and gives warning of, a migraine. Also, auras involving smell and touch
    (tactile) are known to warn of the onset of an epileptic attack.
  • Brain damage or disease. Lesions or injuries to the brain may alter brain function and produce hallucinations.
Personally I'd say the most popular conversion experiences are caused sleep paralysis, stress, and lack of sleep.

Where as the "feeling of the spirit" in the church atmosphere and other such things, I'd say is most likely caused by how the services carry out their messages to induce hypnotic trance like states in the congregations. Where mass hysteria can get a hold of people and produce dramatic changes in feelings, leading to dramatic effects.

Basically every time man looks for god, they do not look into the sky for it, they look inside themselves. It's all a product of their own minds.

That's why I think it's important to be aware of these things and to never trust your own mind, to doubt your own thoughts and feelings, until you can gain more evidence from the world around you and other people to confirm or deny them.




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30-11-2012, 04:15 PM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
Simple explanation...
[Image: SpongebobImagination.jpg]

That, and wishful thinking.

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30-11-2012, 04:22 PM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
(30-11-2012 04:15 PM)Dark Light Wrote:  Simple explanation...
[Image: SpongebobImagination.jpg]

That, and wishful thinking.
For me my experience with extacy, showed me how powerful the humankind can be. To feel utter and complete love, empathy, and well being with only a chemical, no god needed.

But I also had to life with the fact my brain was probably bleeding rainbows.

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The atheist is a man who destroys the imaginary things which afflict the human race, and so leads men back to nature, to experience and to reason.
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30-11-2012, 04:34 PM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
As madness.
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30-11-2012, 08:39 PM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
The brain is capable of creating real to life visions of anything. From time to time, I have what I call waking dreams. Hold your hand in front of you and carefully examine it. Look at all the detail and also review your thoughts. This is how real my waking dreams are except it's usually limited to a very tight focal area so I'm only aware of something directly in view..

The brain creates every instance of reality so you can be aware of it. If the brain doesn't make it, you don't sense it.

Nuff said

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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30-11-2012, 09:57 PM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
Pics or it didn't happen. Drinking Beverage

"All that is necessary for the triumph of Calvinism is that good Atheists do nothing." ~Eric Oh My
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30-11-2012, 10:36 PM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
I watched the entire Derren Brown show. Too bad they didn't have more people there, but I kind of like how they did it. But yeah, the whole "faith movement", "name it claim it" style of fraud is something that amazes me how SO many people can be fooled by it. The "snake oil salesmen" feeding people "good news", because happy people will tend to be more generous. It is truly evil, . . . and when you see the houses of many of these types, you will understand that [here again] it is a perfect example of the self centered narcissism of the "uber religious". If they TRULY cared about "the lost", "the hurting", "the hungry and naked", they would ONLY live in a modest home, and most of the money made would go to helping people.

Anyway, it is quite interesting how people can be "led to believe their healing". The brain is an amazing part of the body, for sure. And for those who don't think the brain can create a false reality? . . . . . Think about when you dream. You are unconscious, . . . but your brain, . . . all on its own, . . . is making up stories! And some of them can seem SO real.
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01-12-2012, 01:15 AM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
(30-11-2012 02:41 PM)Aseptic Skeptic Wrote:  
(30-11-2012 04:02 AM)amav.eram Wrote:  I did in fact have very subjective personal experiences on three occasions during my Christian life: I experienced a voice speaking in tongues saying what I interpreted to be a scriptural verse, I had some quite strange experiences with so called demonic possession in which parts of my body went numb...so that is why I have not asked the question of why I didn't experience such things.

Now I'm confused. If you have had 3 such experiences, and yet you're able to rationalize them as not being actual encounters with god, then why the original post? Are you just trying to figure out why other people have similar experiences but they are unable to recognize them as non-god experiences?
I think I'm still in the process of trying to rationalize and understand why I experienced the things that I did too, and why I let myself believe them...and on top of that I further find it difficult to understand why my former church companions cannot see that their experiences are just their own mind.
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01-12-2012, 01:43 AM
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
(30-11-2012 10:36 PM)DeavonReye Wrote:  I watched the entire Derren Brown show. Too bad they didn't have more people there, but I kind of like how they did it. But yeah, the whole "faith movement", "name it claim it" style of fraud is something that amazes me how SO many people can be fooled by it. The "snake oil salesmen" feeding people "good news", because happy people will tend to be more generous. It is truly evil, . . . and when you see the houses of many of these types, you will understand that [here again] it is a perfect example of the self centered narcissism of the "uber religious". If they TRULY cared about "the lost", "the hurting", "the hungry and naked", they would ONLY live in a modest home, and most of the money made would go to helping people.

Anyway, it is quite interesting how people can be "led to believe their healing". The brain is an amazing part of the body, for sure. And for those who don't think the brain can create a false reality? . . . . . Think about when you dream. You are unconscious, . . . but your brain, . . . all on its own, . . . is making up stories! And some of them can seem SO real.
Yes I agree with you that people do in fact become "led to believe their healing"...I was. It is harder to understand unless you have been there however...it is like your brain takes what it has been told and manifests it. It also seems pretty adept at generating false memories. When you are on the outside of it, it's easy to look in and wonder how anyone could believe it...but when you are actually in it, it seems real.

I am sure now that many leaders in churches simply lie about having visions...while I was in my church there was a testimony circulating around about colombian christians who had travelled to hell and reported that God will send you to hell if you dont tithe...bit of ulterior motives apparent there. I get them. But the people that I don't get are the lay people who have nothing to gain...many of these folk still say they see God.
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01-12-2012, 01:58 AM (This post was last modified: 02-12-2012 03:59 AM by amav.eram.)
RE: How do you explain believers' "visions" of god?
Thank you everyone for your thoughts. It has really helped me to gain a better perspective of the situation than what I initially had...now its time for me to go and do some research armed with a few new keywords.
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