How do you love w/o obeying god?
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16-10-2015, 04:26 PM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
(16-10-2015 04:11 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(16-10-2015 12:17 PM)jason_delisle Wrote:  Well ask yourself. Why would you compile 66 books into one book?

To make money?

To give monks a job?

To define orthodoxy?

To enforce orthodoxy?

A cover story to hide the fact Jesus was actually a paranoid schizophrenic flaming asshole psychopath?

#sigh
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16-10-2015, 04:42 PM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
(16-10-2015 04:01 PM)Alla Wrote:  
(16-10-2015 03:36 PM)true scotsman Wrote:  So then dying for a friend is a wrong choice, but it is also the greatest thing you can do for a friend.
Jesus said there is no greater love than to die for a friend. It is greatest sacrifice for a friend.
I didn't say that wrong choices is the only reason why we die. To die for a friend to safe his/her life is right choice.

Yeah that's why I said according to Jesus in the story, dying is the standard of the good. It is the heighth of Moral action. Death is a standard of value. But then you threw in there that death is the result of bad choices. Don't you see the contradiction.

My philosophy does not hold death as a virtue, either as a way to get to some imaginary spirit world or to save someone. If someone has to die in order to save a friend then we are talking about a screwed up situation. It is not something to celebrate. Death is a disvalues and is to be avoided. It seems a very strange thing to have as the measure of value. My worldview holds that to live is the right choice and that life is the standard of morality. Now I would die to save my children or my wife but it would definitely not be a sacrifice. It would be profoundly selfish, because I value them higher than anything else.

Do not lose your knowledge that man's proper estate is an upright posture, an intransigent mind and a step that travels unlimited roads. - Ayn Rand.

Don't sacrifice for me, live for yourself! - Me

The only alternative to Objectivism is some form of Subjectivism. - Dawson Bethrick
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16-10-2015, 05:57 PM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
(16-10-2015 04:14 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(16-10-2015 04:03 PM)Alla Wrote:  True. For example, I believe that Book of Mormon is also word of God.

Except it is demonstrably the work of a dishonest charlatan. Drinking Beverage

But Chas, don't you see that doesn't count because of Jesus jesus. And you would understand that if you could just Jesus!

The people closely associated with the namesake of female canines are suffering from a nondescript form of lunacy.
"Anti-environmentalism is like standing in front of a forest and going 'quick kill them they're coming right for us!'" - Jake Farr-Wharton, The Imaginary Friend Show.
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16-10-2015, 08:22 PM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
If only Chas could turn off his critical thinking and skeptical nature.

I sometimes wonder if some people don't have the ability to be skeptical. They are simply gullible most of the time.

Insanity - doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results
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16-10-2015, 08:32 PM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
(16-10-2015 08:22 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  I sometimes wonder if some people don't have the ability to be skeptical. They are simply gullible most of the time.

They might exist, but I would feel pitty for them. Unable to see reality No

"Skepticism is the first step towards truth" -Denis Diderot
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17-10-2015, 06:28 AM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
(16-10-2015 04:26 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  
(16-10-2015 04:11 PM)Chas Wrote:  To make money?

To give monks a job?

To define orthodoxy?

To enforce orthodoxy?

A cover story to hide the fact Jesus was actually a paranoid schizophrenic flaming asshole psychopath?
It was done for simplicity. So you only would have to keep up with one book.
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17-10-2015, 06:38 AM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
(17-10-2015 06:28 AM)jason_delisle Wrote:  
(16-10-2015 04:26 PM)GirlyMan Wrote:  A cover story to hide the fact Jesus was actually a paranoid schizophrenic flaming asshole psychopath?
It was done for simplicity. So you only would have to keep up with one book.

Maybe. But I prefer the Quran.

It has better jokes.

Yes

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17-10-2015, 08:10 AM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
As an atheist I can discount the entire bible or any "holy" book based on the idea that all of those books and every part of them are man made and it shows.

None were inspired by a god. Plain and simple.
Even when I lead you down a path of truth, you still cling to your fantasy.
[/quote]

I agree with you to an extent. There has been literally hundreds of translations of the bible in many different languages. There are many denominations that were created over the issues with a single word that was not properly translated. An example of this is the commandment "thou shall not kill". I know that it is something that lead many to question the the bible. Some denominations are against the military or using violence to defend our country as a result of this one verse. However we both know that the bible is full of killing in the name of God. That is why it is important to understand the original old testament hebrew and new testament greek. The original hebrew said " thou shall not murder". I think we both can see how to kill and to murder may seem similar but the difference lies in the heart. You can kill someone to protect yourself or your loved ones but it is different to murder out of hate, greed, or envy.

I was born and raised Catholic. However I am non-denominational today because I sought to question the teaching of the church from what was written in the original hebrew/greek bible. I also got frustrated when churches would cherry pick single bible verses and twist them to make you believe what they want you to believe while disregarding other verses. The difference between you and I (I could be wrong) is that when something did not make biblical sense you decided to discredit God and the entire bible. I instead dug deep into the original meaning to find the truth.

Now you said the you discredit the bible because it is entirely man made and not God inspired. The bible consists mostly of historical accounts. The gospels were basically journals from Matthew, Mark, and John. Luke was a physician who never witnessed Jesus' miracles but worked as an investigative journalist to verify everything that happened.

Atheist always focus on logic and critical thinking. However based on your "logic" history books are discredited because they were not written by the people who are in them. If you read a biography on George Washington would you believe it although it was written by a historian?
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17-10-2015, 08:12 AM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
(16-10-2015 08:22 PM)Rahn127 Wrote:  If only Chas could turn off his critical thinking and skeptical nature.

I sometimes wonder if some people don't have the ability to be skeptical. They are simply gullible most of the time.
You've hit on something that I have overlooked. Indeed many of the theists I know will bite hook line and sinker on many other concepts that prey on some people's innate gullibility.
I had not thought about it before now. maybe there is a genetic marker for gullibility?
The only hope is that it is recessive.
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17-10-2015, 08:25 AM
RE: How do you love w/o obeying god?
Btw... for everyone just reading this forum. Yes I am a Christian. I am non-denominational but I am sure nobody care. I just wanted to let you know that my intent is not to try to convert or harass you with talk of fire and brimstone. I just enjoy the respectful dialog. I do not get offended with smack talk. I am a Marine so I have some tough skin and I am not easily offended. I would like to look at all of you as friends who hold view differently from mine. You guys and gals are awesome and I really appreciate the wonderful questions.
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