How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
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13-02-2012, 03:38 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
(13-02-2012 03:25 PM)Zat Wrote:  You just told me that clever manipulation is more effective than honest and rational argument!

It is.
Ideas are sown, not planted. Planting is too invasive to ones ego. A clever idea is sown, and the subject gets the feeling he thought it up himself.

What you call manipulation, I call diplomacy. Wink

Observer

Agnostic atheist
Secular humanist
Emotional rationalist
Disclaimer: Don’t mix the personal opinion above with the absolute and objective truth. Remember to think for yourself. Thank you.
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13-02-2012, 04:08 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
(13-02-2012 03:38 PM)Observer Wrote:  What you call manipulation, I call diplomacy. Wink

Observer, are you familiar with the Disc-world series by Terry Partchett?

Sounds like Lord Vetinari is your idol!

There are times, there are times.... Big Grin
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13-02-2012, 04:17 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
(13-02-2012 04:08 PM)Zat Wrote:  
(13-02-2012 03:38 PM)Observer Wrote:  What you call manipulation, I call diplomacy. Wink

Observer, are you familiar with the Disc-world series by Terry Partchett?

Sounds like Lord Vetinari is your idol!

There are times, there are times.... Big Grin

I'm not familiar with it. Might give it a try.

I do like Niccolò Machiavelli thoug... Big Grin

Observer

Agnostic atheist
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Emotional rationalist
Disclaimer: Don’t mix the personal opinion above with the absolute and objective truth. Remember to think for yourself. Thank you.
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13-02-2012, 04:19 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
(13-02-2012 04:17 PM)Observer Wrote:  I'm not familiar with it. Might give it a try.

He is an absolute riot!

Funniest in the genre I have ever read and incredible insight into human nature and social trends.

You can't miss him! Exclamation
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13-02-2012, 05:11 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
The trick, my dear Zat, is not minding that it hurts.

It's not the mean god I have trouble with - it's the people who worship a mean god.
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13-02-2012, 05:14 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
(13-02-2012 05:11 PM)Peterkin Wrote:  The trick, my dear Zat, is not minding that it hurts.

Hahahahahaha!

"Lawrence of Arabia" -- by George, you got it right! Big GrinBig GrinBig Grin
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13-02-2012, 09:10 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
I try to keep away from them as I can tolerate them at first but then I find my fist just wants to punch their face for some reason Big Grin

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13-02-2012, 09:28 PM (This post was last modified: 13-02-2012 09:51 PM by GirlyMan.)
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
"How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?"

Whaddya mean? That's like asking how I suffer germs gladly. A lifetime of exposure develops an immunity.

(13-02-2012 08:49 AM)Zat Wrote:  This thread was created in the hope that I would get some useful advice on how to cope with people whom I consider 'stupid' in a particular situation. Huh

Can't help other than my own principles which I try to consider unless I'm too drunk and the id's temporarily relieved me of command. First, "Can we both have fun with this?" Second, "Can I have fun with this even if they don't?" Third, "How big an ass would I have to be in order to have fun with this?" ... An ancillary consideration would be whether the exchange might be informative to the participants as well as external observers, but that always winds up coming in second to the fun level.

Breathing - it's more art than science.
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13-02-2012, 10:35 PM
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
My two-penny-worth.
I'll approach this from a professional angle.
I teach management best practices but I will try to give the short answer (but you are welcome to come on the three day training course hehehe).
Much of my audience comprises of Service Desk / Call Centre staff and their job, most of the day, is to suffer fools gladly.
The first thing they have to know is that the caller is not a fool until this phone call, they were competently working away until now and now they need help and probably feel foolish already.
The Management process at this stage is Incident Management and the process steps are: Indentify, Log, Categorise, Prioritise, Initial Support, Escalation (2 types of this but I won't bore you with the details), Further Investigation and Diagnosis, Resolution and Recovery, and finally, Closure.

What is NOT happening at this stage is Problem Management (e.g. Root Cause Analysis and recommendation of a permanent solution (change) that will remove the problem so that no further Incidents will recur) and Change Management (evaluation of the recommended change, approval and management of the transition to implement the change).

Your difficulty, I suspect is that you live in a scientific world where relatively non-emotional Problem and Change Management are the norm.

It's Indicent Management where the emotions of the caller need to be addressed.

Good Service Desk staff are like good doctors. Very patient (excuse the pun) bed-side manners are required.

So, to deal with your "fools" try thinking of yourself as a doctor with an ignorant (not medically trained) patient. The danger sometimes is that (as with doctors) there is a risk of acting "superior" which certainly pisses me off i.e. when a doctor or a Service Desk agent simply sighs at me (it makes me go to instant psychopath-mode)... empathy (or the ability to fake empathy) is needed and then follow the Incident Management steps then it will be more like a team effort between you and your "fool" working through the process to achieve closure.

In other words, it's about Management not Psychology.

I hope this helps.
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14-02-2012, 12:25 AM (This post was last modified: 14-02-2012 12:55 AM by GirlyMan.)
RE: How do you suffer 'fools' gladly?
(13-02-2012 10:35 PM)DLJ Wrote:  My two-penny-worth.
I'll approach this from a professional angle. ...
I hope this helps.
oops.. bad form on me..

Breathing - it's more art than science.
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