Poll: At what X do you find religion
10 percent certain
20 percent certain
30 percent certain
40 percent certain
50 percent certain
60 percent certain
70 percent certain
80 percent certain
90 percent certain
100 percent certain
I would rather go to hell then convert
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How much certainty do you need to find religion?
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20-09-2013, 07:07 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
I think if you included 0% then you would get a more accurate poll reading, because 0% is all you need to find any religion.

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20-09-2013, 07:10 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
(20-09-2013 07:07 AM)Rahn127 Wrote:  I think if you included 0% then you would get a more accurate poll reading, because 0% is all you need to find any religion.

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20-09-2013, 07:21 AM
Re: RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
(20-09-2013 06:17 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(20-09-2013 06:12 AM)ClydeLee Wrote:  I assume you get membership at your third picket event.

The question posed in the OP is legitimate. How much certainity do you need Clyde...to find religion?

Already stated in by first post... Carry the equation up, or until 100% certainty; because, without that I can not be sure any other religion/non religion could be actually correct.

Same reasons I don't profess gnostic atheism.

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20-09-2013, 07:21 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
(20-09-2013 05:50 AM)Heywood Jahblome Wrote:  
(20-09-2013 05:46 AM)Hafnof Wrote:  I hear the Westboro Baptist Church is no longer accepting new members. As such, entry to heaven is no longer possible.
For the sake of argument, lets assume they are still accepting new members...I know this is a difficult question, and maybe even a bit scary....but that is no excuse for nit picking it.

Ok, so you're willing to start from the perspective of an evil despicable god - the WBC god who I presume you are also atheist to and to which you could probably assign numbers to your level of confidence for or against. So let's define terms. What do you mean by "find religion"? Do you mean accept it as 100% true? If so, that would be at around the 100% mark. Do you mean accept it as likely true? I would say around the 60% mark. Do you mean that I change the way I live my life to conform to the religion's dictates? That depends on the impact to my life and way of life. For small changes 60% would do. For large changes I might be looking for 90%. That's roughly how I assess new science, so I would assess this religion thing in a similar way.

But let's go further. At what point would I "love" the god? The evil despicable WBC god? I'd have trouble even at 100%. At what point would I obey the evil god? Tricky. Even at a vanishingly small distance from 100% I'd be reluctant to sacrifice my firstborn or bestow a plague that kills the firstborn of an entire nation. Even at 98% I'd struggle to force my unfaithful wife to miscarry in compliance with mosaic law, or to stone the neighbour's daughter to death if she were found not to be a virgin on her wedding night. To really obey the heinous acts required of me I just feel I'd find it hard to reach that level of belief even if I were a true believer. And to swallow hard enough to "love" the god of these atrocities? It's hard to name a figure. I would just have to play it by ear I suppose.

Luckily I think both you and I can assign a realistic level of belief to the I hate fags God of less than one or two percent. I mean, I can place my certainty that the WBC god doesn't exist at about 98%. In general I think I can be certain that no form of the Christian God i've ever heard about at around 90-95%. In fact I'd place all commonly accepted religions at about that level - somewhere between 90% and 98% certain that they are false. If we're to expand out to a more generic god concept, a prime mover, a deistic god, etc I'd put my certainty against that concept somewhat lower - maybe 50-60% certain that no such being exists or maybe 70-85% certain that if a god-being exists that it would not have properties that I would consider worthy of the title "god".

With my generic "no god" certainty at about 70-85% confidence, and my minimum required certainty to change minor aspects of my life at about 60% for the god I have an "atheism buffer" of about 20-30% whereby I could become 20-30% less certain without finding myself needing to make life changes in response to my changing belief. That's in absolute terms. In relative terms I'd have to lose 43-53% of my current anti-god confidence to see life changes perhaps starting to occur. To move into a full divine command theory model enabling me to do the atrocious though I would need to lose more like 97-100% of my current anti-god confidence.

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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20-09-2013, 07:57 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
I think that the layout of the poll, the wording of the OP, and the subsequent lack of real clarification; belies some of the inherent biases and flaws in the thinking of the OP.

Religion is the man made dogma and rituals surround belief in a particular nebulous 'higher power'. Finding a religion requires zero evidence for the actual higher entity. However I find all such belief structures uncompelling. The poster is presupposing that proof of god equates validity of religion. It's a very black and white way of looking at the world, and it coming from a professed theist doesn't surprise me in the least. It also presupposes that just existing would make a god worthy of adoration, following their precepts, or worshiping it.

This strikes me as a bait and switch, I think the OP is trawling for ammunition from this hypothetical scenario to go shooting off rounds for his own particular interpretation of his own particular religion's particular interpretation of it's particular god...

Because even at near 100% certainty of the existence of X god and his approval of Y religion, that would not automatically equate my following that religion just because it's god exists. An analogy: I know to almost 100% certainty that President Obama exists. Does that mean I simply approve of the policies of the Democratic Party because he approves of them? Fuck no. Does that mean I'm almost 100% certain that he personally reads my e-mails or will hit me with a predator drone strike if I think unhappy thoughts about him? That is a separate range of probabilities completely independent of the probability of the existence of President Obama or his approval of the Democratic Party... Drinking Beverage

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20-09-2013, 08:01 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
(20-09-2013 06:11 AM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  That's why I positive repped him. Big Grin

What is why you did? Consider

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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20-09-2013, 08:06 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
(20-09-2013 08:01 AM)Chas Wrote:  
(20-09-2013 06:11 AM)cheapthrillseaker Wrote:  That's why I positive repped him. Big Grin

What is why you did? Consider

More of a chance of him reading it. xD

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20-09-2013, 08:38 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
I already found religion.

I found it to be bullshit. Big Grin

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20-09-2013, 09:16 AM (This post was last modified: 20-09-2013 09:21 AM by kim.)
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
So Blowjob, you are basically pleading with people to find a reason to accept someone else's delusion?

Sure, it's not crazy if we all do it.

Let's all go be nutters together... come on, it'll be fun! Hobo
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20-09-2013, 09:55 AM
RE: How much certainty do you need to find religion?
Free-floating scale is meaningless. Please calibrate your scale.

What is 40% certainty? 60%? 82.12%?

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
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