How to achieve world peace...
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17-03-2013, 07:18 AM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
I think you have to build confidence in a global power structure that the world population is significantly invested in before you can then invest that power structure with military might to decommission or reduce individual national armies. To move power from a local level to state, to national, to international requires a long transition period.

Give me your argument in the form of a published paper, and then we can start to talk.
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17-03-2013, 07:23 AM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
Looks like nobody wants to do role-playing today.

Pity.

It could be a lot of fun. Sad
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17-03-2013, 08:37 AM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
If I had Q like powers I would first make a speech introducing myself to everybody in the world. I would do this by being a voice in their heads and I would say.

"You are not going crazy. I am not god however you are not alone in hearing this. Everybody around the world is also hearing this as well. Things are going to change from now on on this planet for the better of everything. I will be holding a world trial except there wont be any punishments, only enlightenment"

This would happen in an instant and be like a memory, I would instill a sense of peace with this message. It wouldnt caus people to panic nor stop or interfere with what they were doing (flying planes, surgery, disarming bombs... anything)

With my Q powers I would then construct a life sustaining building on the Moon, this is where the "trial" shall take place away from earth for the safety of those being questioned.

I would then take all of the world leaders and the most prominent people in politics, military, religion and anybody who has influence on controlling the world, be them known publicly or not. In the same sort of "instant/memory" everybody in the world will see me question them on how the world is run and for what purpose, I will remove their ability to lie and they will tell the truth. They will explain if they have an alternative to fossil fuels and if it exists why it has been suppressed. I will ask them about the agenda behind all wars whilst they have been in power. I will question the world religious leaders to explain the things they have hidden away (like the vatican) and if their exists any hidden texts to reveal them with the aim of disproving all religions and making them null and void.

The people on earth will know the truth, Knowledge is power and this is what will change the world.

For no matter how much I use these symbols, to describe symptoms of my existence.
You are your own emphasis.
So I say nothing.

-Bemore.
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17-03-2013, 09:13 AM (This post was last modified: 17-03-2013 09:17 AM by Zat.)
RE: How to achieve world peace...
The second reply with imagination and creativity! (the first was DLJ's)

Thank you, bemore, it was brilliant!

Hope more is on the way! Smile
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17-03-2013, 11:44 AM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
(16-03-2013 07:23 PM)Zat Wrote:  A very good friend of mine made this suggestion and thought that it could start an interesting thread.

I will copy it here, without adding/changing/deleting anything.

Feel free to comment.

Here it comes:

1. Hand over all the keys to all the military installations to the UN, who will then destroy 100% of the nuclear missiles, decommission 90% of tanks, submarines and weapons, reassign 80% of the ships, aircraft and land vehicles for civilian use (rescue, emergency, cleanup and relief operations) and keep only a small standing army (international and fully integrated, of course) for intervention in local flare-ups.

2. Set up international courts of arbitration for outstanding disputes between peoples - the administration of each ruling to be done by a peace-keeping committee for the first five years; the committee than reports back to the court with recommendations for amendment - when it's working, the ruling becomes final. Then the committee hands over control to the local elected governments.

3. Disarm all repressive regimes and police forces that have a record of harming the citizens. Leave honest police forces in place, with all their crime-fighting capability, but take away their crowd-control equipment. Collect and destroy as many private weapons as can be done without riots; stop the retailing of new weapons and all ammunition.

4. Remove all clergy from political office and influential positions near government. Take away their privileges regarding money-collection, wealth accumulation, tax-exemption and property ownership.

5. Repeat 4. with the richest 0.01% of the world's population and the top 100 banks.

6. Abolish compound interest; write off all current debts. Confiscate the ill-gotten gains of above groups; hand over land and stationary assets to local governments;collect the liquid assets in an international fund
to be used wherever most needed.

7. Now that governments don't have to spend most of their time waging war and serving the rich and godly, and have the wherewithal, they can get on with their proper job: taking care of the people who elect them, dealing with problems of energy and production and distribution.

Assumption: (copied in from Post #11 for those who read only the OP)

You are an omnipotent alien. You are completely fair and totally incorruptible. You can make the rules and you can enforce them.

Pretend that you could do anything you wanted to do -- how would you go about it if your aim was world peace?

This is an exercise in imagination and creativity.

If your friend's proposals were based on the omnipotence, you would think they would have been a little more direct, or if the proposals were not based on the omnipotence, realistic. He worked backwards. The Soviet Union tried that, it doesn't work. You have to work from the bottom up; at least, from the middle out.

I really don't think you need omnipotence to move toward achieving world peace. I think you could ignore not being a god-like being, and still propose solutions. When you add in the omnipotence, it seems to take some of the work out of it. If you had all power, there would be no need to take Judeo-Christian God approach. You could simple create a perfect world directly. That is: adding omniotence is like playing the game with a cheat code.

With omnipotence, I'd simply just make human beings, rational. Maybe not fully rational, but definitely with higher average abilities to reason. I'd give ever person Einstein's brain. Not in the sense that every person was Einstein, but so that ever person had that level of ability to reason.

I wish I was also omniscient, as that would keep me from wondering whether, or not, that alone would work. I'd assume, it would, but if not, I guess I'd have to go back to the drawing board. Then again, I guess, at that point, with that power, it would make planning an approach a contradictory endeavor.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
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17-03-2013, 11:54 AM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
You should have prefaced the alien part...










The beginning of wisdom is to call things by their right names. - Chinese Proverb
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17-03-2013, 11:54 AM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
How to achieve world peace:

[Image: 250px-Destroy_All_Humans_box_art_for_the...tion_2.jpg]

[Image: opforum1.png]
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17-03-2013, 12:34 PM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
(17-03-2013 11:44 AM)TrulyX Wrote:  If your friend's proposals were based on the omnipotence, you would think they would have been a little more direct, or if the proposals were not based on the omnipotence, realistic. He worked backwards. The Soviet Union tried that, it doesn't work. You have to work from the bottom up; at least, from the middle out.

I needed the assumption of omnipotence because without it there is no way anyone could accomplish the 7-point program outlined in the OP (with which I wholeheartedly agree).

And no, the Soviet Union NEVER tried it -- take it from someone who grew up in that system. Play lip-service, yes, try it in reality, NEVER!

Actually, one of the 7 points was once tried, successfully (for a while) in history:

"In 594 BC in Greece, representatives in the middle classes asked Solon to accept election...with dictatorial powers to soothe the social war tearing Greece apart. His first measure was simple but drastic economic reforms. By his famous Seisachtheia, or removal of Burdens, Solon canceled ..all existing debts whether owing to private persons or the state. ...and at one blow cleared Attic lands of all Mortgages.. All persons enslaved or attached for debt were released; those sold into servitude abroad were reclaimed and freed; and such enslavement was forbidden for the future. ...within a decade opinion became almost unanimous that the act had saved Attica from revolution" (Will Durant: "The life of Greece - The story of civilization").

If we can't have Q-like powers, then I will take Plan "B" as suggested by DLJ -- hand all the keys to the women: our testosterone-drenched sex will never achieve world peace on this planet. Women have a much better chance of being sensible.
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17-03-2013, 03:39 PM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
(17-03-2013 12:34 PM)Zat Wrote:  
(17-03-2013 11:44 AM)TrulyX Wrote:  If your friend's proposals were based on the omnipotence, you would think they would have been a little more direct, or if the proposals were not based on the omnipotence, realistic. He worked backwards. The Soviet Union tried that, it doesn't work. You have to work from the bottom up; at least, from the middle out.

I needed the assumption of omnipotence because without it there is no way anyone could accomplish the 7-point program outlined in the OP (with which I wholeheartedly agree).

And no, the Soviet Union NEVER tried it -- take it from someone who grew up in that system. Play lip-service, yes, try it in reality, NEVER!

Actually, one of the 7 points was once tried, successfully (for a while) in history:

"In 594 BC in Greece, representatives in the middle classes asked Solon to accept election...with dictatorial powers to soothe the social war tearing Greece apart. His first measure was simple but drastic economic reforms. By his famous Seisachtheia, or removal of Burdens, Solon canceled ..all existing debts whether owing to private persons or the state. ...and at one blow cleared Attic lands of all Mortgages.. All persons enslaved or attached for debt were released; those sold into servitude abroad were reclaimed and freed; and such enslavement was forbidden for the future. ...within a decade opinion became almost unanimous that the act had saved Attica from revolution" (Will Durant: "The life of Greece - The story of civilization").

If we can't have Q-like powers, then I will take Plan "B" as suggested by DLJ -- hand all the keys to the women: our testosterone-drenched sex will never achieve world peace on this planet. Women have a much better chance of being sensible.

You said: "NEVER tried 'it'". That was without regard for what "it" was-- the "it" was the important part, not so much the Soviet Union. I wasn't talking specifically those outlined points, or really any specific things, in particular. I was referring to an approach of the backward reasoning, or top down, that would require an immoral and/or totalitarian, the end justifies the means, approach. You have to start with a problem, at its core, and then get to a solution from that core. You don't start with an overall solution, and then try to force the problems out, from the top, downward. On a small scale, it's like running into a church and yelling out, "God doesn't exist, assholes!", running out, burning the church to the ground and bullying all of the members as they run out frantically. It's completely counter-productive. If you expect there not to be a bigger church, with more influence, more power and more members, as a result, you are insane. Any dictator not expecting coup d'état is insane.

"I recently discussed with an intelligent and well-disposed man the threat of another war, which in my opinion would seriously endanger the existence of mankind, and I remarked that only a supra-national organization would offer protection from that danger. Thereupon my visitor, very calmly and coolly, said to me: 'Why are you so deeply opposed to the disappearance of the human race?'”

"It is the statement of a man who has striven in vain to attain an equilibrium within himself and has more or less lost hope of succeeding. It is the expression of a painful solitude and isolation from which so many people are suffering in these days."

You have to realize that, saying you want world peace but it is not possibly attainable, as many people do, is not a stance containing compatible ideas to be held simultaneously; yet, it's also a good idea to remember that band-aids don't fix problems, and magic wands don't exist.

The Paradox Of Fools And Wise Men:
“The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser men so full of doubts.” ― Bertrand Russell
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17-03-2013, 04:30 PM
RE: How to achieve world peace...
You are absolutely right, TrulyX, however, you misunderstood the nature of this thread.

It was for fun, role playing, fantasy -- not for finding solutions.

When I am serious, I start threads like "Proposal for a New Social Contract" or "The Nature of Money" or "How to resolve Conflicting Loyalties".

This wasn't one of them.

The seven point list in the OP was my desired end result, but I decided to be whimsical about it and play with magic.

I was hoping more would join in and have some fun for a change.

Something like the "Spaceship TTA" thread was before it became too serious.

I hope this explains what I had in mind. Smile
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