How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
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25-11-2014, 11:42 AM
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(24-11-2014 09:21 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  
(24-11-2014 09:18 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  The traditional Atheistic Worldview boils down to Materialism and Naturalism without a trace of any intelligent input -----

A. Naturalism : Attempts to explain all phenomina by natural causes and laws.

Questions : 1. Where did information come from ? 2. Where did Energy come from ? 3. Where did Matter come from ? 4. Where did Life come from (the very first DNA molecule which according to Dawkins has enough specified informational instructions in it to fill 1,000 volumes of encyclopedias) ?



B. Materialism : The Doctrine that nothing exists except matter and its movements and modifications.

Questions : 1. What about the Laws of logic ? 2. What about the Laws of Science ? 3. What about the Laws of Mathematics ? 4.What about the Laws of Morality ? 5. Where did Consciousness come from (the animate from the inanimate such as reason, logic, will, love, abstract thinking, etc... derived from atoms . Explain the process ) ?

Have you tried the search function all of your trite questions have been answered before on this forum.
TL;DR version all of these "laws" were created by us.

(25-11-2014 11:36 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  
(24-11-2014 10:45 AM)Chas Wrote:  No, that is not what information is. Information is any kind of event that affects the state of a dynamic system.


No, DNA is not a blueprint for an assembly process and does not contain any goal, nor information in the sense you misunderstand it to be.

Fetal development is growth with continuous morphological change as the chemical environment surrounding the fetus changes.


Chemistry is the answer, not your misunderstanding of information.


We don't know for certain.


No, it doesn't. It is all energy, no matter. Matter does not exist until the universe has expanded and cooled sufficiently.


We don't know for certain.


We don't know for certain, but there are several good hypotheses for abiogenesis, none of which involve rocks giving birth to living life forms.


Physical laws are human descriptions of human observations of the natural world.


Correct, there is no objective morality.


Correct, there is no absolute standard.


No, not quite. Humans evolved as a social species and our feelings of empathy, fairness, caring for our young, sacrificing all evolved because they were beneficial.


Because there are negative consequences for violating society's rules.


Thoughts don't "arise from these atoms", thoughts arise from the complex pattern of chemicals and structures of the brain.

We don't know all the details, but neuroscientists are working on it.


'WE DONT KNOW' was your frequent response , yet you DO know that there isn't/cant be any personal theistic intelligent Creator for what we have which sure doesn't resemble the atheistic worldview/origins of chaos, haphazard looking effects , accidental compilations of atoms ad nauseum , thrown-together non design, and non suitability for human life --- that's what we should expect from a non-personal / non intelligent / non willed Universe that hasn't a shred of reason or purpose.

Perhaps you should rethink your Reverse God of the Gaps creed of

OR you should take a course on Probability and Chaos Theory before you make a fool of yourself any further. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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25-11-2014, 11:49 AM
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(24-11-2014 11:55 PM)Astreja Wrote:  I can use materialism to calculate the number of sheets of drywall I need to finish a room, ease the pain in a sore joint, or make a nice cup of tea.

I can't use a hypothetical deity for bugger-all.

Materialism > Spirituality. 'Nuff said.

Can u calculate , design, then build your finished Room without a shred of personal intelligent input ? Because that's what your absurd faith in atheistic Materialism and Naturalism had to do for our entire Cosmos....AND for no good reason at all ! For, it just happened !

You don't have enough faith to be a true Atheist ; pride/rebellion/arrogance perhaps because those things are required when you don't want our Creator to exist.
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25-11-2014, 11:54 AM
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(25-11-2014 11:42 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(24-11-2014 09:21 AM)TheInquisition Wrote:  Have you tried the search function all of your trite questions have been answered before on this forum.
TL;DR version all of these "laws" were created by us.

(25-11-2014 11:36 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  'WE DONT KNOW' was your frequent response , yet you DO know that there isn't/cant be any personal theistic intelligent Creator for what we have which sure doesn't resemble the atheistic worldview/origins of chaos, haphazard looking effects , accidental compilations of atoms ad nauseum , thrown-together non design, and non suitability for human life --- that's what we should expect from a non-personal / non intelligent / non willed Universe that hasn't a shred of reason or purpose.

Perhaps you should rethink your Reverse God of the Gaps creed of

OR you should take a course on Probability and Chaos Theory before you make a fool of yourself any further. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory

You should apply just 5 of our over 150 razor edge precise life enabling parameters of the Cosmos to your chaos 'THEORY' and see how it fares ; heres just 5 of them : http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/designun.html
Forget your high held chaos theory as well as your built up pride and willful rebellion against our Creator ...instead, give him a chance in your life which is what your ultimate purpose is for being here.
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25-11-2014, 11:56 AM (This post was last modified: 25-11-2014 12:03 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(25-11-2014 11:49 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  You don't have enough faith to be a true Atheist ; pride/rebellion/arrogance perhaps because those things are required when you don't want our Creator to exist.

And doesn't it just give you a little hard-on to feel all superior and self-righteous. ("Judge not lest ye be judged" ... I see you think you know better than your Jebus).

Thanks for demonstrating yet again that you are clueless about how the universe evolved. Still WAITING for you to refute the videos of Dr. Szostack which were posted yesterday.

But thanks for coming here. Thumbsup
You fools do atheism more good than you could possibly imagine.

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25-11-2014, 12:18 PM
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(25-11-2014 11:54 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  
(25-11-2014 11:42 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  OR you should take a course on Probability and Chaos Theory before you make a fool of yourself any further. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory

You should apply just 5 of our over 150 razor edge precise life enabling parameters of the Cosmos to your chaos 'THEORY' and see how it fares ; heres just 5 of them : http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/designun.html
Forget your high held chaos theory as well as your built up pride and willful rebellion against our Creator ...instead, give him a chance in your life which is what your ultimate purpose is for being here.

And you know this how? We love evidence here and if you say you have any for a Creator being that wants a chance at...what exactly? Please send pics. Thumbsup

“I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man’s reasoning powers are not above the monkey’s.”~Mark Twain
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25-11-2014, 12:39 PM
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(24-11-2014 09:18 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  The traditional Atheistic Worldview boils down to Materialism and Naturalism without a trace of any intelligent input -----

Technically, all atheism entails is a lack of belief in gods. Anything more, and you're over-defining the term. Also, the 'a' isn't capitalized.


(24-11-2014 09:18 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  A. Naturalism : Attempts to explain all phenomina by natural causes and laws.

Questions : 1. Where did information come from ? 2. Where did Energy come from ? 3. Where did Matter come from ? 4. Where did Life come from (the very first DNA molecule which according to Dawkins has enough specified informational instructions in it to fill 1,000 volumes of encyclopedias) ?

I don't know. There are lots of things we can't explain right now. There are lots of things we weren't able to explain in the past that we can now. Shoehorning in a hypothetical answer is merely a thought experiment. Shoehorning in a god as an answer is a God of the Gaps fallacy.

It's far more honest to admit when you can no longer answer questions than it is to start trying to sneak presupposition under the radar as anything worth anyone's time.


(24-11-2014 09:18 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  B. Materialism : The Doctrine that nothing exists except matter and its movements and modifications.

Questions : 1. What about the Laws of logic ? 2. What about the Laws of Science ? 3. What about the Laws of Mathematics ? 4.What about the Laws of Morality ? 5. Where did Consciousness come from (the animate from the inanimate such as reason, logic, will, love, abstract thinking, etc... derived from atoms . Explain the process ) ?

The laws of logic, science, and mathematics are nothing more than human constructs to explain readily observable phenomenon that behave in predictable fashions. If it's something that can't be observed, then there cannot be a law for it. If it can be observed, then I don't know what your beef with it is. Consciousness is just the way we experience our thought.

Also, it's impossible to say that there aren't unobservable things that exist, such as gods, leprechauns, fleems or wargarbles; the point is, until we have evidence to believe those things exist, and so long as they cannot be demonstrated to have any actual effect on our lives, of what use is there in believing in them?

Seriously, if you tell me that I have to accept a particular <god> into my heart so my <soul> will go to <heaven> instead of <hell>, why should I take that seriously? None of those thing in brackets can be shown to exists, and they're frequently defined within context of each other. The only reason that sentence "makes sense" is because a lot of people presuppose it has any real meaning. Replace that with "it is important for you to fleem your floom with floum, lest you be flimed", and you end up with something equally incoherent. You probably don't care about flooms or floums or whether or not anything is fleemed or flimed, because you don't know what those things are, and you don't have any reason to believe they're real.
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25-11-2014, 12:43 PM
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(25-11-2014 11:54 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  Forget your high held chaos theory as well as your built up pride and willful rebellion against our Creator ...instead, give him a chance in your life which is what your ultimate purpose is for being here.

Prove it.

Which creator are you talking about ? (Oh, YOUR'S of course .. of course you think YOUR god is the right one, just like millions or billions of others before you thought THEIR gods were the right ones. Uh huh. Sure.)

I know you're been indoctrinated to spout this shit, but really ? Seriously ? Didn't someone tell you not to judge others ? (Oh... you're special. Very *special*. I get it).

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25-11-2014, 01:30 PM (This post was last modified: 25-11-2014 01:36 PM by Im a humble little Theist.)
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(25-11-2014 11:56 AM)Bucky Ball Wrote:  
(25-11-2014 11:49 AM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  You don't have enough faith to be a true Atheist ; pride/rebellion/arrogance perhaps because those things are required when you don't want our Creator to exist.

And doesn't it just give you a little hard-on to feel all superior and self-righteous. ("Judge not lest ye be judged" ... I see you think you know better than your Jebus).

Thanks for demonstrating yet again that you are clueless about how the universe evolved. Still WAITING for you to refute the videos of Dr. Szostack which were posted yesterday.

But thanks for coming here. Thumbsup
You fools do atheism more good than you could possibly imagine.

The Bible admonishes us all to judge...just not to judge hypocritically -- its not hypocritical of me since you as a professed Atheist doesn't desire a Creator to exist to which I only validate . Further, the Bible explicitly says that the motive for people not wanting the Creator to exist is based on personal willful rebellion, pride, and arrogance as stated in Romans 1:18-24 therefore it is an objective source of information that I appealed to and not my subjective opinion which therefore exonerates me of any alleged 'self righteousness and superiority' which you accused me of . God doesn't believe in Atheists per Romans 1:18-24 ...and so that's something you will have to take up with him on the superiority angle .

Next, the God we are talking about is the personal theistic Creator of the Universe who brought our universe into existence from nothing by nothing complete with all necessary razor edge design Parameters including scientifically confirmed Laws of Physics and Life enabling Constants which to think 'just happened along' is the epitomie of absurdity to the most basic logic . You can give the Creator any name you desire -- historically he has given himself the name of Jesus or Yahweh .

As for the Dr. Szo video presentation, ill let atheist Prof. Richard Dawkins give answer to it : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlZtEjtlirc
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25-11-2014, 01:44 PM
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(25-11-2014 01:30 PM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  Further, the Bible explicitly says that the motive for people not wanting the Creator to exist is based on the motive of personal willful rebellion, pride, and arrogance as found in Romans 1:18-24 therefore it is an objective source of information that I appealed to and not my subjective opinion -- therefore, that exonerates me of any alleged 'self righteousness and superiority' which you accused me of .

The bible is an objective source of information? Laughat

Quote:...since you as a professed Atheist doesn't desire a Creator to exist.

I've known at least a few atheists that say that they genuinely wish that there was a creator but that the lack of evidence forces them to admit that it isn't rational to believe that. Most atheists I know, including me, don't actually consider the question of whether they'd like there to be a god or not, they just follow the evidence. If it turned out that there was evidence to support the conclusion they would accept it.

You really have no clue what atheism entails. It's sad because you seem like you are probably pretty intelligent and if you could bring yourself to look at the "evidence" without the prior assumption that god exists and the bible is accurate you would see what a house of cards it all is.

Atheism: it's not just for communists any more!
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25-11-2014, 01:48 PM (This post was last modified: 25-11-2014 10:32 PM by Bucky Ball.)
RE: How well can Atheistic Humanists defend their Worldview/Origins ?
(25-11-2014 01:30 PM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  The Bible admonishes us all to judge...just not to judge hypocritically

Jesus put no qualifiers on it. You think you know better, AND you provided no quote. I did.

(25-11-2014 01:30 PM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  -- its not hypocritical of me since you as a professed Atheist doesn't desire a Creator to exist .

Thanks for demonstrating that you have no education. That sentence is what is called a "non-sequitur". Your conclusion does not follow from your premise. When you grow up and mommy lets you go to school, you will learn hard things like this.

(25-11-2014 01:30 PM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  Further, the Bible explicitly says that the motive for people not wanting the Creator to exist is based on the motive of personal willful rebellion, pride, and arrogance as found in Romans 1:18-24 therefore it is an objective source of information that I appealed to and not my subjective opinion -- therefore, that exonerates me of any alleged 'self righteousness and superiority' which you accused me of .

I don't give a shit what the Bible says. Before you use it, YOU must demonstrate it's authority and veracity. YOU have done neither, child.

(25-11-2014 01:30 PM)Im a humble little Theist Wrote:  Next, the God we are talking about is the personal theistic Creator of the Universe who brought our universe into existence from nothing by nothing complete with all necessary razor edge design Parameters including scientifically confirmed Laws of Physics and Life enabling Constants which to think 'just happened along' is the epitomie of absurdity to the most basic logic . You can give the Creator any name you desire -- historically he has given himself the name of Jesus or Yahweh .

Jesus was not Yahweh. Thanks for showing us you never took a class in religion. Jesus PRAYED to Yahweh. So now you're trying to tell us he prayed to himself ? Hahahaha. You can shove you little "design parameters" up your ass.
It's been DEBUNKED. I did it here, 3 ways to Sunday : http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/forum/...m+debunked
Post 9. I know most of it's WAY over your head, but do try to follow along, dear.

Here's a little book for you, child :
http://www.amazon.com/How-Not-Share-Your...1888992301

You're no "humble little atheist" You're a gigantic self-righteous fool.

Insufferable know-it-all.Einstein God has a plan for us. Please stop screwing it up with your prayers.
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