How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
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25-08-2012, 04:41 PM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
(25-08-2012 04:21 PM)Red Celt Wrote:  
(25-08-2012 04:13 PM)Alice Wrote:  I am sorry I assumed the question was because of the abuse not the use, so I tried to focus my remarks on handling addiction, however with tobacco since there is no positive affect and actually has a negative effect on your body as soon as you inhale, along with being highly addictive, I could see wanting to try to eradicate that.

Alice, I wasn't have a pop at you (well, you alone). It is the whole idea that "because bad things happen with a substance, we should ban it".

Well, no.

This might be a revelation for some, but non-smokers and non-drinkers die every day. This isn't an issue of curtailing immortality. We all die. I've spent enough time in "retirement homes" visiting elderly friends and family to know that I'd be very happy to never end up there.

We have one life and it is short. We can be miserable and make that life ever so slightly less short. Or we can have fun and die a little sooner. I am going to go down kicking and screaming if some inconsiderate fucks try to make life a little more miserable, so that I get a better chance of living in a home, where attendants have to wipe my arse when I use the toilet (and that the "toilet" wasn't actually my bed).

I don't think I said to ban it, I could see why someone would want to. In an earlier post I made the point that we all do things that are unhealthy, that would apply to tobacco, since technically it does not hurt anyone else when it is abused (I say technically because it does effect a fetus, if a mother is going through with the pregnancy). I actually work in an ER so I too understand the process of dying (not emotionally but physically) in different manors, so I agree tobacco shouldn't be banned. Alcohol shouldn't be either in fact I suggested that perhaps lowering the drinking age would help with the addiction (looking at Europe). Marijuana as I stated I think should be legal I would put that in the same category as alcohol in fact I believe you are less likely to become addicted to it. I would never be ok with such things as cocaine and meth because in my opinion having substances like that legalized well legalized without a Prescription (yes we use cocaine in the hospital, but to clot bleeds) would be crazy because of the severe altered mental status causing enormous harm often times to innocent victims. Some of the most addictive substances are legal but require prescriptions (but don't get me started on that messed up system). My main concern is really to express that I was not judging anyone personally but commenting on substances and the understanding of the feelings people have expressed towards them.

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25-08-2012, 04:55 PM (This post was last modified: 25-08-2012 05:08 PM by Alice.)
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
(25-08-2012 04:21 PM)Red Celt Wrote:  
(25-08-2012 04:13 PM)Alice Wrote:  I am sorry I assumed the question was because of the abuse not the use, so I tried to focus my remarks on handling addiction, however with tobacco since there is no positive affect and actually has a negative effect on your body as soon as you inhale, along with being highly addictive, I could see wanting to try to eradicate that.

Alice, I wasn't have a pop at you (well, you alone). It is the whole idea that "because bad things happen with a substance, we should ban it".

Well, no.

This might be a revelation for some, but non-smokers and non-drinkers die every day. This isn't an issue of curtailing immortality. We all die. I've spent enough time in "retirement homes" visiting elderly friends and family to know that I'd be very happy to never end up there.

We have one life and it is short. We can be miserable and make that life ever so slightly less short. Or we can have fun and die a little sooner. I am going to go down kicking and screaming if some inconsiderate fucks try to make life a little more miserable, so that I get a better chance of living in a home, where attendants have to wipe my arse when I use the toilet (and that the "toilet" wasn't actually my bed).

That's it! Thank you! I just had an insight, personally totally not because of this thread well because of your comments with the retirement home and then reflecting on my current job. I think that's why I have so much extra anxiety about dying, more it sounds like then other people on the road to atheism. Hmm. Interesting. Fantastic! Knowing that might make it easier or at least get me started in coping.

“The highest activity a human being can attain is learning for understanding, because to understand is to be free.”
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26-08-2012, 04:41 PM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
(25-08-2012 11:19 AM)ClydeLee Wrote:  It also has health benefits. It's been something I've seen you or others ignore about alcohol in this thread.
Yes, alcohol has many health benefits, when consumed in low to moderate amounts. I suppose I'll have to supply my mom with slivovitz and dark chocolate, when she'll go to retirement. It's incredible what we can do for good health of our elders with some dark chocolate, homegrown plum brandy and homegrown cannabis. (for eating, not smoking) It makes lots of expensive medication obsolete, but we must decide which to use, because when someone gets on the pills, there's no switching back.
And I heard that heart pills destroy your liver. So you must take liver pills also, which will, I suppose, damage your stomach. Which means you have to take stomach pills too, which will damage who knows what. So yes, definitely, I'd prefer alcohol, which has little side effects with careful use. That's what I call spiritual healing Smile Spirit... get it?

(25-08-2012 11:19 AM)ClydeLee Wrote:  Of course it can be a dangerous substance, but it isn't everywhere in the world in large numbers. All those societal aspects you mention are more to do with societal issues like people binge drinking.

If you think his idea would make it not cool, you must of never attended a DARE program. Those impact a lot of kids to want to try drugs. They do have more awareness of the danger but it's the type of videos and information that is meant to sway people away.

Making things sacred or restricted are ways to make things more dangerous. That's evident by horrible state of dealing with alcohol in the US as well as other drug consumption.
There is a big difference between a sacred and restricted thing. Restricted means an authority imposed from above, which is in itself a reason to rebel against it. Something sacred is a part of our culture and ourselves. To go against the sacred is as unthinkable as injuring ourselves on purpose. Or going to the church on sunday in your underwear only. It's self-regulating.

I don't like using drugs for fun. Drugs are sacred, meaning they're dangerous and require respect. Otherwise they turn people into babbling wrecks. And our culture doesn't have any controlled ways of using drugs. It's either not to use drugs at all, or it's all left up to you and your wild friends and your emptying wallet. We don't have any rituals and ceremonies of drinking and smoking to satisfy the need in a safe, regulated and supervised way. Instead people think they can drink any day or any time of day, even at work.
It makes sense to teach people since youth that all things have their place and time and that those who don't know that will be ridiculed and shunned. Or maybe even considered sick and good to go for therapy.

Btw, what do they do at the DARE program? I was on their website but didn't find anything.
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26-08-2012, 09:57 PM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
[/quote]


Btw, what do they do at the DARE program? I was on their website but didn't find anything.
[/quote]
You don't want to know lol j/k. All I remember is I got a free t-shirt which for some reason became cool to wear when we got into high school 7 years later, and a cop who did the "presentation" which I remember nothing from. perhaps I was on drugs and thats why haha bad joke.

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27-08-2012, 05:09 AM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
Luminon, where do you get slivovitz? Oh wait, I just checked, you are from Czech Republic? At least you know what is a good drink... Serbian, I presume?

Big Grin

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27-08-2012, 03:27 PM (This post was last modified: 27-08-2012 03:33 PM by Luminon.)
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
(27-08-2012 05:09 AM)Filox Wrote:  Luminon, where do you get slivovitz? Oh wait, I just checked, you are from Czech Republic? At least you know what is a good drink... Serbian, I presume?

Big Grin
I have several plum trees around my house (apple and cherry too). Even if I didn't, there's a road with some plums nearby and it wouldn't be a problem to gather the fallen plums, for a price of some weird looks from neighbours. And frankly, "burning" (distillation) is the best thing to do, the fruit is mostly wormy and I don't like to eat leftovers after some worm, specially when it's still inside.

Next thing, many people around (whom my older brother knows) have a hi-tech distillery at home, for a 1-2 000 bucks or so. All you need to provide is a keg of fruit or zyme and some money and you'll get your fruit spiritus back. Here it is legal to produce alcohol at home, as long as you don't make profit on it. People supply their parties and weddings with it or often give these bottles as a gift. It's stylish and certainly easier than making your own wine Smile

Btw, what Serbian drink? Slivovitz (or as we write but pronounce almost the same, slivovice) is a Czech generic name for plum brandy. Although it can not be precisely translated, anything-vice implies a derivate or distillate of thereof.
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28-08-2012, 03:21 AM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
Sljivovica is a pretty traditional Serbian brand of rakija - brandy. We in Croatia also produce it and Bosnia as well. It is a domestic brandy made from plums. I didn't know Czechs do it as well, but now that I think about it, it makes sense.

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30-08-2012, 11:19 PM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
My wife and I were just paid a visit by an old woman from just down the road. She was mad stinkin drunk. I was trying to sleep before work when she knocked on the door and let herself in when my wife opened the door. Not only had she already been drinking before showing up, but immediately produced almost a pint of vodka and over the hour she was at our house managed to drink the whole thing. She not only urinated on our couch, it smelled like she lost bowel control as well. After having to escort her out of the house and drive her home, because she was too drunk to even stand up. It took a call to the police to come get her from just outside her own house where she suddenly decided that it was not only time for sleep, but that she was actually already inside her house. If only I already had kids old enough to understand what was happening, so they could see what alcohol truly does to you if you don't drink in moderation. That is why I am all for showing kids what actual drunks end up like. My father was a nurse for about 10 years. He had worked for a little while at Sunrise House, a place that handles people with drug and alcohol problems. He once took care of a woman whose liver was completely shot and her skin would tear so easily that it was hard to do anything with her. Put an IV in, her skin would tear and bleed. Tape it in place and you could forget being able to remove it without doing serious damage. These are things I think kids need to see in order to make the correct choices. If we have the attitude that they can't do it either just because they are young or because we said so, they can't wait to turn 21 and get hammered.
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31-08-2012, 09:11 PM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
I wouldn't. *mixes a margarita* Now let's got pot legalized, mkay?



Damn, I was actually going to make a margarita, but I'm out of Triple Sec. I guess just a Dos Equis then.

E 2 = (mc 2)2 + (pc )2
614C → 714N + e + ̅νe
2 K(s) + 2 H2O(l) → 2 KOH(aq) + H2 (g) + 196 kJ/mol
It works, bitches.
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01-09-2012, 07:20 AM
RE: How would you successfully eradicate the use of alcohol and cigarettes?
The DARE program has been a complete failure.
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