Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
Post Reply
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
28-05-2014, 10:34 AM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(27-05-2014 11:34 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(27-05-2014 11:31 AM)djkamilo Wrote:  So who should have that power?

An individual should have control over their own life other than that I don't think anyone should have the authority to kill someone else. Notable exceptions are removing someone from life support when there is no chance of recovery and other right to die issues.

The counter argument is if you do something horrific like rape/murder than you lose some of your basic human rights.


I'm against capital punishment only because there's a chance of executing the wrong person (not because of stupid reasons like "the state doesn't have the right to kill people"). BUT I don't think it's an issue that needs pursuing, I think there are much much larger issues out there than capital punishment.

[Image: 3cdac7eec8f6b059070d9df56f50a7ae.jpg]
Now with 40% more awesome.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes earmuffs's post
28-05-2014, 02:39 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
Holy Shit Rev... I agree with you so much I think I must be your sock... except I can't feel your hand up my butt... Huh

We'll love you just the way you are
If you're perfect -- Alanis Morissette
(06-02-2014 03:47 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  And I'm giving myself a conclusion again from all the facepalming.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes morondog's post
28-05-2014, 04:07 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 10:14 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 10:04 AM)Chas Wrote:  Yabut, as War Horse said, "IDK, there's just people that need killin."

Your state, and mine as well, have already decided that those people are few and far between enough to not base their system off.

I have no problem with that - too many mistakes and too much bias.

Still, some people just need killin'. Drinking Beverage

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Chas's post
28-05-2014, 04:10 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 04:07 PM)Chas Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 10:14 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  Your state, and mine as well, have already decided that those people are few and far between enough to not base their system off.

I have no problem with that - too many mistakes and too much bias.

Still, some people just need killin'. Drinking Beverage

I agree with that. There is no defense for some psycho's however as a society it is better to forgo vengeance, for several reasons.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
28-05-2014, 04:27 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
Even if I put the paradoxical nature of the death penalty aside I just don't see the need for it logistically or morally. We are more then capable of incarcerating dangerous people, and with the rampant prosecutorial misconduct that still goes on it's not a thing I have a great deal of confidence in.

I'd say, slightly off the topic, that a bigger problem is not the death penalty but the willingness to arrest people for non-crimes ( I smoked the wrong plant, opps) and house them with violent and often repeat criminals.
Prisons, as they are now, are factories for breeding violent criminals.
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 6 users Like WhiskeyDebates's post
28-05-2014, 04:37 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
I'm not necessarily pro death penalty but I lean more towards it than against. ... My only concern is wrongly convicting someone. We haven't had the death penalty in the UK for decades and there were some innocents hung, maybe if there were criteria that must be met that would go some way towards a more reliable conviction, like:-

A confession
CCTV footage
Irrefutable DNA evidence
Prior conviction for the same thing where previous evidence was not strong enough for the death penalty

I don't see life or human rights as an inalienable entitlement. I think they are forfeit once you have taken them from someone else.

A man blames his bad childhood on leprechauns. He claims they don't exist, but yet still says without a doubt that they stole all his money and then killed his parents. That's why he became Leprechaun-Man

Im_Ryan forum member
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Monster_Riffs's post
28-05-2014, 04:54 PM (This post was last modified: 28-05-2014 05:24 PM by Revenant77x.)
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 04:37 PM)Monster_Riffs Wrote:  I'm not necessarily pro death penalty but I lean more towards it than against. ... My only concern is wrongly convicting someone. We haven't had the death penalty in the UK for decades and there were some innocents hung, maybe if there were criteria that must be met that would go some way towards a more reliable conviction, like:-

A confession
CCTV footage
Irrefutable DNA evidence
Prior conviction for the same thing where previous evidence was not strong enough for the death penalty

I don't see life or human rights as an inalienable entitlement. I think they are forfeit once you have taken them from someone else.

The anti-death penalty stance is one of the hardest ones to take. Almost always (and I am amazed it has not been done here) someone will bring up some kind of horror story usually involving children and ask whether this person deserves to live. The problem is not that there are not people who do deserve death but in how that is applied, which all data shows is invariably biased against poor and minority defendants. In the US if you are poor and Black and convicted of murder you are 75% more likely to receive a Death Sentence than if you were White.

Then there is also the problem with wrongful conviction. In recent years several men on Death Row have had their verdicts overturned due to new evidence, some however came to late and we as a society are complicit in their Murder by the State.

Lastly there is the cost, and this is mind boggling. It costs more to execute 1 prisoner than it does to incarcerate 20 prisoners for life. This is a burden to the taxpayer for a system that has never prevented a single death. The murder rate in area's with the Death Penalty is the same or higher than in areas without.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 7 users Like Revenant77x's post
28-05-2014, 05:13 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 04:54 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  The anti-death penalty stance is one of the hardest ones to take. Almost always (and I am amazed it has not been done here) someone will bring up some kind of horror story usually involving children and ask whether this person deserves to live. The problem is not that there are not people who do deserve death but in how that is applied, which all data shows is invariably biased against poor and minority defendants. In the US if you are poor and Black and convicted of murder you are 75% more likely to receive a Death Sentence than if you were White.

Then there is also the problem with wrongful conviction. In recent years several men on Death Row have had their verdicts overturned due to new evidence, some however came to late and we as a society are implicit in their Murder by the State.

Lastly there is the cost, and this is mind boggling. It costs more to execute 1 prisoner than it does to incarcerate 20 prisoners for life. This is a burden to the taxpayer for a system that has never prevented a single death. The murder rate in area's with the Death Penalty is the same or higher than in areas without.

*complicit

Skepticism is not a position; it is an approach to claims.
Science is not a subject, but a method.
[Image: flagstiny%206.gif]
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
28-05-2014, 06:05 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 10:14 AM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 10:04 AM)Chas Wrote:  Yabut, as War Horse said, "IDK, there's just people that need killin."

Your state, and mine as well, have already decided that those people are few and far between enough to not base their system off.

I remember my parents both being pissed off because of the Manson family stuff.

California got rid the death penalty then came the Manson trial and lessons in being careful what you wish for. Not to mention double Jeapordy.

As socially liberal as I am, I still go back and forth on this issue. There are people who are just wasting oxygen. Manson is one of them. There's a growing movement that feel, "oh he's too old he won't be able to do anything." Yet, they don't understand him. He never killed anyone personally. He got everyone else to do it. Added to that he still has this freaky rock star status.

I guess my odd ball point is there will always be people who actually deserve the death penalty. What I'd like to see, instead of being applied as often as it is in some states, i would feel better if it was reserved for the jackasses that truly do deserve to die. Like Oklahoma City dude...

People who terrorize a large swath of people maybe....


God is a concept by which we measure our pain -- John Lennon

Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 1 user Likes Momsurroundedbyboys's post
28-05-2014, 06:48 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 04:54 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 04:37 PM)Monster_Riffs Wrote:  I'm not necessarily pro death penalty but I lean more towards it than against. ... My only concern is wrongly convicting someone. We haven't had the death penalty in the UK for decades and there were some innocents hung, maybe if there were criteria that must be met that would go some way towards a more reliable conviction, like:-

A confession
CCTV footage
Irrefutable DNA evidence
Prior conviction for the same thing where previous evidence was not strong enough for the death penalty

I don't see life or human rights as an inalienable entitlement. I think they are forfeit once you have taken them from someone else.

The anti-death penalty stance is one of the hardest ones to take. Almost always (and I am amazed it has not been done here) someone will bring up some kind of horror story usually involving children and ask whether this person deserves to live. The problem is not that there are not people who do deserve death but in how that is applied, which all data shows is invariably biased against poor and minority defendants. In the US if you are poor and Black and convicted of murder you are 75% more likely to receive a Death Sentence than if you were White.

Then there is also the problem with wrongful conviction. In recent years several men on Death Row have had their verdicts overturned due to new evidence, some however came to late and we as a society are complicit in their Murder by the State.

Lastly there is the cost, and this is mind boggling. It costs more to execute 1 prisoner than it does to incarcerate 20 prisoners for life. This is a burden to the taxpayer for a system that has never prevented a single death. The murder rate in area's with the Death Penalty is the same or higher than in areas without.

Gasp how can that even be possible?? You got the run down on those numbers? It'd be interesting to see where all the expense in an execution comes from, and compare it to the cost of keeping them alive Consider

I've waffled on this issue my whole life, and still can't make up my mind. I feel very strongly about each side of the argument for some reason.

One thing tipping me toward the death penalty was I figured it HAD to be more expensive to pay for the food, prison space, and guards to cover an entire lifetime. Yeah, I know each one doesn't get their own prison with guards, but how much does it rack up when you add them all together... If that makes sense? More people means more prison space and more guards needed is what I'm getting at.

If that's not the case... I've got some more thinking on the subject to do.

I hope that the world turns, and things get better. But what I hope most of all is that you understand what I mean when I tell you that, even though I do not know you, and even though I may never meet you, laugh with you, cry with you, or kiss you, I love you. With all my heart, I love you. - V for Vendetta
Find all posts by this user
Like Post Quote this message in a reply
[+] 3 users Like Smercury44's post
Post Reply
Forum Jump: