Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
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28-05-2014, 07:16 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 07:14 PM)Smercury44 Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 07:10 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  It's the automatic appeals -- it falls on the taxpayers dime. It's not cheap -- and not any lawyer will take those cases too.

Food/clothing/shelter are nothing compared to the legal costs and special housing costs for death row inmates (they're usually kept out of the general prison population). Then there's healthcare if they get sick...

Lots of money tied into keeping them alive so they can die.

Ok, didn't know that court cost for appeals go to the tax payers. Yeesh No

Not only that but the Prosecution of Capital cases are astronomically expensive. There is no financial argument in favor of the Death Penalty.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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28-05-2014, 07:19 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 07:14 PM)Smercury44 Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 07:10 PM)Momsurroundedbyboys Wrote:  It's the automatic appeals -- it falls on the taxpayers dime. It's not cheap -- and not any lawyer will take those cases too.

Food/clothing/shelter are nothing compared to the legal costs and special housing costs for death row inmates (they're usually kept out of the general prison population). Then there's healthcare if they get sick...

Lots of money tied into keeping them alive so they can die.

Ok, didn't know that court cost for appeals go to the tax payers. Yeesh No

Yes, in many cases unless the family has a lot of moola, it falls on the tax payers to foot the bill. Because how can the person accused pay for it? Lawyers don't really work for free unless there is something in it for them.

I think in California you get two automatic appeals. So if the first fails you can try again.


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28-05-2014, 07:26 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
Are their any sites that bother with trying to accumulate statistics on the number of people who enter the U.S. penal system with intent to rehabilitate, and the number of those who actually succeed at it, instead of becoming more violent simply to survive?

Should we treat people coming out of prisons with the same care as we do soldiers coming back from combat? Consider Perhaps, I guess Undecided

I'm fairly certain there are, at least a few, methods of administering painless, and humane executions that would be cheaper than housing, and feeding, a serial killer for the rest of his/her natural life! If those methods were implimented everywhere, could I (as a death penalty proponent) be tax excempt from feeding Jeffrey Dahmers just so they could live long enough to die from acute broom-handle-up-the-ass syndrome? Dodgy

I know Gasp They can pile all the convicts in a buss, and drive around to anti-death penalty peoples' houses! Each inmate gets to beg for lunch money after they've described what they've done to get imprisoned! Tongue
When the rapists and child murderers don't starve, then I'll rejoice at all the non-false-altruism in the world Dodgy

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28-05-2014, 07:29 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 07:26 PM)TheGulegon Wrote:  Are their any sites that bother with trying to accumulate statistics on the number of people who enter the U.S. penal system with intent to rehabilitate, and the number of those who actually succeed at it, instead of becoming more violent simply to survive?

Should we treat people coming out of prisons with the same care as we do soldiers coming back from combat? Consider Perhaps, I guess Undecided

I'm fairly certain there are, at least a few, methods of administering painless, and humane executions that would be cheaper than housing, and feeding, a serial killer for the rest of his/her natural life! If those methods were implimented everywhere, could I (as a death penalty proponent) be tax excempt from feeding Jeffrey Dahmers just so they could live long enough to die from acute broom-handle-up-the-ass syndrome? Dodgy

I know Gasp They can pile all the convicts in a buss, and drive around to anti-death penalty peoples' houses! Each inmate gets to beg for lunch money after they've described what they've done to get imprisoned! Tongue
When the rapists and child murderers don't starve, then I'll rejoice at all the non-false-altruism in the world Dodgy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_emotion

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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28-05-2014, 07:41 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
No emotion, dude.

I would appeal to the real humanist that it is worth the added cost of execution to end the unessecary suffering of a human being, even one as seemingly undeserving as Jeffrey Dahmer, to alleviate humanity's conscious over prolonging a life that is nearly certain to die violently, and painfully!

If the end result is going to be death, anyway, then those who would keep a serial killer alive long enough for him/her to experience a horrifying death should know just how complicit they are in allowing it to happen. Some of those people might want to examine their own feelings on why they would wish that on another human, even one as seemingly deserving as a Jeffrey Dahmer, as well. Vengeance much?

I couldn't care less, of course. I was just sayin.

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28-05-2014, 07:43 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 07:41 PM)TheGulegon Wrote:  No emotion, dude.

I would appeal to the real humanist that it is worth the added cost of execution to end the unessecary suffering of a human being, even one as seemingly undeserving as Jeffrey Dahmer, to alleviate humanity's conscious over prolonging a life that is nearly certain to die violently, and painfully!

If the end result is going to be death, anyway, then those who would keep a serial killer alive long enough for him/her to experience a horrifying death should know just how complicit they are in allowing it to happen. Some of those people might want to examine their own feelings on why they would wish that on another human, even one as seemingly deserving as a Jeffrey Dahmer, as well. Vengeance much?

I could care less, of course. I was just sayin.

So your entire argument is nu-uh. Ok. I will counter this with what should you do every time it comes up that we have executed someone completely innocent? It has happened far more than the Pro Death side wants you to know.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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28-05-2014, 07:48 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
Completely off topic, I wonder if we are doing anything to reimburse folks who've been released after 30 years because we now have DNA technology that can clear them Consider

Every time I see one of those cases in the news I think "damn, I hope he's got a big check coming his way"

There's no way to make up for 30+ years of wrongful imprisonment, but dang...

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28-05-2014, 07:49 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 07:48 PM)Smercury44 Wrote:  Completely off topic, I wonder if we are doing anything to reimburse folks who've been released after 30 years because we now have DNA technology that can clear them Consider

Every time I see one of those cases in the news I think "damn, I hope he's got a big check coming his way"

There's no way to make up for 30+ years of wrongful imprisonment, but dang...

It varies from state to state. Some states have liability laws that limit the amount they can receive.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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28-05-2014, 07:50 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 07:43 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 07:41 PM)TheGulegon Wrote:  No emotion, dude.

I would appeal to the real humanist that it is worth the added cost of execution to end the unessecary suffering of a human being, even one as seemingly undeserving as Jeffrey Dahmer, to alleviate humanity's conscious over prolonging a life that is nearly certain to die violently, and painfully!

If the end result is going to be death, anyway, then those who would keep a serial killer alive long enough for him/her to experience a horrifying death should know just how complicit they are in allowing it to happen. Some of those people might want to examine their own feelings on why they would wish that on another human, even one as seemingly deserving as a Jeffrey Dahmer, as well. Vengeance much?

I could care less, of course. I was just sayin.

So your entire argument is nu-uh. Ok. I will counter this with what should you do every time it comes up that we have executed someone completely innocent? It has happened far more than the Pro Death side wants you to know.

My argument is that execution could be seen as more humane, in some instances, than imprisonement, depending on the environment you're sending the accused into. So... it's better that a human being is raped to death by a broom handle, rather than dieing peacefully on a gurney? That doesn't come across as humane to me, but in fact comes across as the opposite. But again I couldn't care less Tongue

2 questions:

Is it a good thing Jeffrey Dahmer died in pain?

and

Was there any doubt, in Jeffrey Dahmer's case, that he was guilty of murdering a boat load of people?

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28-05-2014, 07:53 PM
RE: Humanist Approach to the Capital Punishment
(28-05-2014 07:50 PM)TheGulegon Wrote:  
(28-05-2014 07:43 PM)Revenant77x Wrote:  So your entire argument is nu-uh. Ok. I will counter this with what should you do every time it comes up that we have executed someone completely innocent? It has happened far more than the Pro Death side wants you to know.

My argument is that execution could be seen as more humane, in some instances, than imprisonement, depending on the environment you're sending the accused into. So... it's better that a human being is raped to death by a broom handle, rather than dieing peacefully on a gurney? That doesn't come across as humane to me, but in fact comes across as the opposite. But again I couldn't care less Tongue

2 questions:

Is it a good thing Jeffrey Dahmer died in pain?

and

Was there any doubt, in Jeffrey Dahmer's case, that he was guilty of murdering a boat load of people?

No, it is not. The guards in that institute should have been fired. Secondly he was never eligible for the death penalty (protip he was in a mental ward) so your example is moot.

(31-07-2014 04:37 PM)Luminon Wrote:  America is full of guns, but they're useless, because nobody has the courage to shoot an IRS agent in self-defense
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